Kieron Dyer

[Rebellious]

It must be obvious I wasn`t comparing ability as I assumed you wasn`t as Dyer is miles ahead of Baba.   I was talking about breaking down injured after every 2 games and on massive wages in the process. Owen has done nothing for 2 years. Your talking about his England record from ages ago. I don`t think he will be the same player he was. I think Martins will be better this year if he gets the right coaching. He is faster, younger and stronger. If he gets to work on the mental side of the game.

 

Rebellious, while we have your attention, in another thread (the wisdom of selling Dyer) you claimed that the "family reasons" argument wasn't merely a way of Dyer transferring out without jeopardising his loyalty payment. In light of all that has happened in the last four days do you still hold to your claim that that wasn't the case?

You spoke with the authority of someone allegedly ITK, yes?

 

I`m pretty sure the family reasons thing is true. Family matters are personal so even if I knew the full truth I wouldn`t post it on here.  As for the loyalty bonus maybe its to do with the agent. Agents are more in control of footballers financial matters than I thought as I found out a couple of years ago when myself and a certain footballer were going to go into business together only to be blocked by his agent.

[jimmymag]

There's no doubt that our management have totally fucked up the Dire deal, and for Sam to come out and say he's annoyed with West Ham is total bollocks!

 

We've given the brat a ready made reason to sulk and not perform for us and, if the West Ham deal can't be resurrected, we'll end up selling him for a lot less than £6 miilion in the not too distant future.

 

Ashley and his sidekick should admit their mistake and get the deal done now.

[Robster]

Im still not convinced.

This was a deal that even the most inept businessman would have let go through

If they have decided to hike up the price at the last minute then there must have been a very good reason for doing so - which we will most likely never get to hear of.

I fail to believe that they moved the goalposts just because they fancied some extra cash for him.

[jimmymag]

Well that's what Sam has said, Newcastle undervalued Dire! Either it's true or Sam's making himself look a prick to protect his inept employers.

[Parky]

Im still not convinced.

This was a deal that even the most inept businessman would have let go through

If they have decided to hike up the price at the last minute then there must have been a very good reason for doing so - which we will most likely never get to hear of.

I fail to believe that they moved the goalposts just because they fancied some extra cash for him.

 

 

 

I don't beleive that either.

[Guest hagler]

sam on ssn blaming west ham

[TRon]

Well that's what Sam has said, Newcastle undervalued Dire! Either it's true or Sam's making himself look a prick to protect his inept employers.

 

It's more Dyer's and West Ham's problem than ours. We clearly aren't desperate for cash, and either Dyer buckles down and gets on with it or he can kiss his England career goodbye. Nice.

[Guest black]

It must be obvious I wasn`t comparing ability as I assumed you wasn`t as Dyer is miles ahead of Baba.   I was talking about breaking down injured after every 2 games and on massive wages in the process. Owen has done nothing for 2 years. Your talking about his England record from ages ago. I don`t think he will be the same player he was. I think Martins will be better this year if he gets the right coaching. He is faster, younger and stronger. If he gets to work on the mental side of the game.

 

Rebellious, while we have your attention, in another thread (the wisdom of selling Dyer) you claimed that the "family reasons" argument wasn't merely a way of Dyer transferring out without jeopardising his loyalty payment. In light of all that has happened in the last four days do you still hold to your claim that that wasn't the case?

You spoke with the authority of someone allegedly ITK, yes?

 

I`m pretty sure the family reasons thing is true. Family matters are personal so even if I knew the full truth I wouldn`t post it on here.  As for the loyalty bonus maybe its to do with the agent. Agents are more in control of footballers financial matters than I thought as I found out a couple of years ago when myself and a certain footballer were going to go into business together only to be blocked by his agent.

No-one was asking you to post what it was, just whether you still thought it was true - which for all intent and purposes you have.

At an educated guess from who you are, your myspce page gives a huge clue and from where you live I have no doubt that your path has crossed with Dyer's and/or that you at least know quite a few people who would have inside knowledge in his goings on.

 

If you are correct about it being agent driven, Dyer deserves no sympathy. His agent is his employee and all final decisions are Dyer's.

If he's that stupid that he didn't see the supporters and club reacting as they have then he really needs to take a look at his ability to think as a human being and understanding other's reactions/feelings/loyalties.

 

There's no doubt that our management have totally f***** up the Dire deal, and for Sam to come out and say he's annoyed with West Ham is total bollocks!

 

We've given the brat a ready made reason to sulk and not perform for us and, if the West Ham deal can't be resurrected, we'll end up selling him for a lot less than £6 miilion in the not too distant future.

 

Ashley and his sidekick should admit their mistake and get the deal done now.

 

Are you serious? The club has every right to object and would have the support of 99% of fans for standing up to being held to ransom for even more money. If it is true that Dyer wants his loyalty bonus after all but requesting a transfer, see the above post if you want more information, he deserves to rot in the reserves.

[Robster]

Well that's what Sam has said, Newcastle undervalued Dire! Either it's true or Sam's making himself look a prick to protect his inept employers.

 

It just seems unusual for them to change their minds when they did.

One worry for me is that if this is truly what happened, clubs are going to do the same with us.

I am also annoyed that it drags us into the West Ham shit  pool. I wanted this season to be as much good PR as possible. 1 week before the start of the season, I would have preferred we didnt have this hanging  over our heads.

[Mick]

 

 

 

I don't beleive that either.

 

I still think something has happened to raise the fee and I still wouldn't be surprised if it had as much to do with Dyer as it has West Ham, I still think what Allardyce has said is as much to protect the player as anything.

 

Playing Russian roulette doesn't make sense if only one club has bid for Dyer.  Normally you only raise the price for something if more than 1 person wants it and you can play them off each other.

 

It could just be Allardyce, Mort or Ashley wanting more cash, I would say that is the least likely reason.  If we have just decided to push the price up for Dyer after agreeing a fee then we stand to have the same done to us in future because other clubs will look at the way we do business and feel they have every right to do the same thing.

 

 

[jimmymag]

Well that's what Sam has said, Newcastle undervalued Dire! Either it's true or Sam's making himself look a prick to protect his inept employers.

 

It's more Dyer's and West Ham's problem than ours. We clearly aren't desperate for cash, and either Dyer buckles down and gets on with it or he can kiss his England career goodbye. Nice.

 

Oh yeah, we're so flush we can afford to spunk £6 million plus the waster's inflated wage packet!

 

Get real man!!!

[STM]

Dyer won't be a newcastle player come the end of the transfer window, probably gone before the season starts TBH. The only thing we have to complain about is that he's on our wage bill until that point.

[TRon]

Well that's what Sam has said, Newcastle undervalued Dire! Either it's true or Sam's making himself look a prick to protect his inept employers.

 

It's more Dyer's and West Ham's problem than ours. We clearly aren't desperate for cash, and either Dyer buckles down and gets on with it or he can kiss his England career goodbye. Nice.

 

Oh yeah, we're so flush we can afford to spunk £6 million plus the waster's inflated wage packet!

 

Get real man!!!

 

Ok you tell me what just happened then. Did we or did we not tell West Ham to pay £8m or fuck off?

[jimmymag]

 

There's no doubt that our management have totally f***** up the Dire deal, and for Sam to come out and say he's annoyed with West Ham is total bollocks!

 

We've given the brat a ready made reason to sulk and not perform for us and, if the West Ham deal can't be resurrected, we'll end up selling him for a lot less than £6 miilion in the not too distant future.

 

Ashley and his sidekick should admit their mistake and get the deal done now.

 

Are you serious? The club has every right to object and would have the support of 99% of fans for standing up to being held to ransom for even more money. If it is true that Dyer wants his loyalty bonus after all but requesting a transfer, see the above post if you want more information, he deserves to rot in the reserves.

 

Eh???

 

What are you going on about???

 

Who said we are being held to ransom???

 

It shouldn't be hard to arrange the transfer of a footballer should it? It should go something like this:-

 

We make the player available, we set a price whilst also factoring in anything in the players contract such as "loyalty" bonuses etc. We get a club interested in the player, they agree to the price we've set, we allow the player to enter into personal negotiations with the buying club, they agree personal terms, the player has a medical and if he passes he signs a contract.

 

Shouldn't be too difficult should it, except we may not have factored into the price Dire's potential "loyalty" bonus or, as has been stated by Sam, we undervalued Dire by £2 million. Either way we fucked up, West Ham are totally innocent in this, and if you think allowing a £6 million asset to "rot in the reserves" is in the best interests of NUFC you're a bigger idiot than you sound!

[NE5]

 

I'm not arguing either. And I'm going out soon and may not be back until tomorrow.

 

None of us know what this review has found.

 

I think everybody agrees that we should let Dyer rot rather than give in to him or West Ham, but I fail to understand why it was me you took up on it, almost everyone is in favour of wasting resources in this case as a matter or principle.

 

None of us know how much he has asked the board for.

 

We do know the comments Allardyce made, and it would appear that they have had some effect. I would imagine we all hope that he doesn't have to do it again.

 

I think not enough people have been aware of the possible implications of what Sam said, I think they should have been worried.

We differ on that one. Managers walk for things like this, whether you like it or not, and they wouldn't be concerned about financial reviews, the only thing they look for is backing, and they will look after their own careers.

 

We all hope these new players are good for us and we have a better season, and build from there, and keep on improving and moving.

 

 

 

Good post, for a change.

 

Anything which is anti Shepherd or pro-Ashley is a good post to you.

 

I'm making it clear what I hope happens, not what I think will happen.

 

So far the whole thing looks even more of a book balancing act, and an attempt to be successful on the cheap, or through not speculating. Long term football fans don't need to be told that this approach does not work, and you need your top or quality or trophy signings that the other top clubs want themselves if you have any hope of matching them, never mind beating them.

 

The interference of Ashley in Dyers transfer is amateur, and interfering to such a degree that I'm sure if Shepherd and Hall had done it, you and many others would be harping on and whining about it in spectacular fashion. He has in fact, made himself look like an idiot by doing it, and therefore you and Newcastle fans. At least thats the logic you've used in the past when the hierarchy at the club has followed this path so I presume the same logic follows.

 

 

[STM]

Jiimymag, Big Sam said the information regarding why we upped our price was confidential so how comes you seem to know?

 

Or is it that infact you don't know and are going out of your way to assume it was a mistake by our club as apposed to West Hams.

[STM]

 

I'm not arguing either. And I'm going out soon and may not be back until tomorrow.

 

None of us know what this review has found.

 

I think everybody agrees that we should let Dyer rot rather than give in to him or West Ham, but I fail to understand why it was me you took up on it, almost everyone is in favour of wasting resources in this case as a matter or principle.

 

None of us know how much he has asked the board for.

 

We do know the comments Allardyce made, and it would appear that they have had some effect. I would imagine we all hope that he doesn't have to do it again.

 

I think not enough people have been aware of the possible implications of what Sam said, I think they should have been worried.

We differ on that one. Managers walk for things like this, whether you like it or not, and they wouldn't be concerned about financial reviews, the only thing they look for is backing, and they will look after their own careers.

 

We all hope these new players are good for us and we have a better season, and build from there, and keep on improving and moving.

 

 

 

Good post, for a change.

 

Anything which is anti Shepherd or pro-Ashley is a good post to you.

 

I'm making it clear what I hope happens, not what I think will happen.

 

So far the whole thing looks even more of a book balancing act, and an attempt to be successful on the cheap, or through not speculating. Long term football fans don't need to be told that this approach does not work, and you need your top or quality or trophy signings that the other top clubs want themselves if you have any hope of matching them, never mind beating them.

 

The interference of Ashley in Dyers transfer is amateur, and interfering to such a degree that I'm sure if Shepherd and Hall had done it, you and many others would be harping on and whining about it in spectacular fashion. He has in fact, made himself look like an idiot by doing it, and therefore you and Newcastle fans. At least thats the logic you've used in the past when the hierarchy at the club has followed this path so I presume the same logic follows.

 

 

 

Ne5, you say it was Ashley but in fairness you have no evidence of that. Chris Mort would be the more obvious candidate and if that was the case you would be correct.

 

Personally, i believe there is more to it but without that information i couldn't expand and my defence would be futile.

[NE5]

 

There's no doubt that our management have totally f***** up the Dire deal, and for Sam to come out and say he's annoyed with West Ham is total bollocks!

 

We've given the brat a ready made reason to sulk and not perform for us and, if the West Ham deal can't be resurrected, we'll end up selling him for a lot less than £6 miilion in the not too distant future.

 

Ashley and his sidekick should admit their mistake and get the deal done now.

 

Are you serious? The club has every right to object and would have the support of 99% of fans for standing up to being held to ransom for even more money. If it is true that Dyer wants his loyalty bonus after all but requesting a transfer, see the above post if you want more information, he deserves to rot in the reserves.

 

Eh???

 

What are you going on about???

 

Who said we are being held to ransom???

 

It shouldn't be hard to arrange the transfer of a footballer should it? It should go something like this:-

 

We make the player available, we set a price whilst also factoring in anything in the players contract such as "loyalty" bonuses etc. We get a club interested in the player, they agree to the price we've set, we allow the player to enter into personal negotiations with the buying club, they agree personal terms, the player has a medical and if he passes he signs a contract.

 

Shouldn't be too difficult should it, except we may not have factored into the price Dire's potential "loyalty" bonus or, as has been stated by Sam, we undervalued Dire by £2 million. Either way we fucked up, West Ham are totally innocent in this, and if you think allowing a £6 million asset to "rot in the reserves" is in the best interests of NUFC you're a bigger idiot than you sound!

 

For once, I agree with jimmymag. A 6m quid player rotting in the reserves is of no use to us, and a spectacular gaffe by the club.

 

We should have kept our word, unless it is true that Dyer has asked for this money, and if this IS the case, we should make a statement confirming it to be true rather than avoid the mud slinging between us and West Ham. Otherwise - if we have simply stumped up the price for no reason - it is amateur and idiotic.

 

I wouldn't expect Allardyce to replicate what Souness did to Bellamy and not play him if it isn't in the clubs best interests, but it all depends on Dyers state of mind, which none of us know.

 

 

[NE5]

 

I'm not arguing either. And I'm going out soon and may not be back until tomorrow.

 

None of us know what this review has found.

 

I think everybody agrees that we should let Dyer rot rather than give in to him or West Ham, but I fail to understand why it was me you took up on it, almost everyone is in favour of wasting resources in this case as a matter or principle.

 

None of us know how much he has asked the board for.

 

We do know the comments Allardyce made, and it would appear that they have had some effect. I would imagine we all hope that he doesn't have to do it again.

 

I think not enough people have been aware of the possible implications of what Sam said, I think they should have been worried.

We differ on that one. Managers walk for things like this, whether you like it or not, and they wouldn't be concerned about financial reviews, the only thing they look for is backing, and they will look after their own careers.

 

We all hope these new players are good for us and we have a better season, and build from there, and keep on improving and moving.

 

 

 

Good post, for a change.

 

Anything which is anti Shepherd or pro-Ashley is a good post to you.

 

I'm making it clear what I hope happens, not what I think will happen.

 

So far the whole thing looks even more of a book balancing act, and an attempt to be successful on the cheap, or through not speculating. Long term football fans don't need to be told that this approach does not work, and you need your top or quality or trophy signings that the other top clubs want themselves if you have any hope of matching them, never mind beating them.

 

The interference of Ashley in Dyers transfer is amateur, and interfering to such a degree that I'm sure if Shepherd and Hall had done it, you and many others would be harping on and whining about it in spectacular fashion. He has in fact, made himself look like an idiot by doing it, and therefore you and Newcastle fans. At least thats the logic you've used in the past when the hierarchy at the club has followed this path so I presume the same logic follows.

 

 

 

Ne5, you say it was Ashley but in fairness you have no evidence of that. Chris Mort would be the more obvious candidate and if that was the case you would be correct.

 

Personally, i believe there is more to it but without that information i couldn't expand and my defence would be futile.

 

Ashley, Mort, whoever. I agree BTW. Whoever did this - if they have did it for no reason - is an idiot.

 

 

[Guest black]

Eh???

 

What are you going on about???

 

Who said we are being held to ransom???

 

It shouldn't be hard to arrange the transfer of a footballer should it? It should go something like this:-

 

We make the player available, we set a price whilst also factoring in anything in the players contract such as "loyalty" bonuses etc. We get a club interested in the player, they agree to the price we've set, we allow the player to enter into personal negotiations with the buying club, they agree personal terms, the player has a medical and if he passes he signs a contract.

 

Shouldn't be too difficult should it, except we may not have factored into the price Dire's potential "loyalty" bonus or, as has been stated by Sam, we undervalued Dire by £2 million. Either way we f***** up, West Ham are totally innocent in this, and if you think allowing a £6 million asset to "rot in the reserves" is in the best interests of NUFC you're a bigger idiot than you sound!

Ok, let's start at the beginning for you, firstly you want to call me an idiot, go look in the mirror first.

Secondly, why would it be the clubs fault if they have entered into the agreement in good faith, believing that Dyer wouldn't be asking for his loyalty bonus and then he goes, "oh by the way about that 2 mil you owe me?"

What you think they should just open up the wallet and go, here Kieron, you're such a good chap and have been such a good employee, we'll just sort out the balance for you!

Like fu<k they should.

But then again with supporters like yourself that point the finger at the club whether they're right or wrong maybe they should just roll over spread their cheeks and go, here help yourself.

We all want rid of Dyer but why should we pay him for the privilage?

[Guest alex]

If it's true about the loyalty bonus thing the club are probably protecting Dyer because it won't go down well with the fans if he ends up having to stay. There's some speculation that the deal can be revived though.

[jimmymag]

Jiimymag, Big Sam said the information regarding why we upped our price was confidential so how comes you seem to know?

 

Or is it that infact you don't know and are going out of your way to assume it was a mistake by our club as apposed to West Hams.

 

I've given the steps involved in a footballers transfer in idiot proof detail in an earlier post. Whatever the reason for upping the price, we fucked up!!! End of Story.

[Guest black]

If it's true about the loyalty bonus thing the club are probably protecting Dyer because it won't go down well with the fans if he ends up having to stay. There's some speculation that the deal can be revived though.

Well said Alex.

how's the mull bowl going?

[STM]

I think the Loyalty bonus thing is made up, not really sure where that came from.

 

Am i correct in thinking that Dyer spent time training with West Ham whilst injured? Haven't got a clue where i heard/read that but if so wouldn't suprise me if there was something more sinister going on. Hence the silence form the West Ham camp.

 

All theory of course.

 

[Guest alex]

If it's true about the loyalty bonus thing the club are probably protecting Dyer because it won't go down well with the fans if he ends up having to stay. There's some speculation that the deal can be revived though.

Well said Alex.

how's the mull bowl going?

Is that you Sammy?