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He didn't forget Bellamy. He's also not forgetting Chris Sutton and Mike Newell. He was just being honest when he said the best partner he's had at Newcastle was Les Ferdinand. Now are you saying him and Les weren't potent as a partnership? Don't overanalyze everything he says. He's not having a dig at Bellamy.

Fucking hell mate, did you even read what I wrote?? I'm talking about the FEES! Take a minute and wrap your mind around the concept of fees. I'll say it again, I'm not talking about backing the manager or not. He could have still backed the manager if Luque was bought for £8m, or if Owen was bought for £13m instead of £16m or whatever. I realize it's difficult to separate the two concepts, but what I'm getting at here is Shepherd's negotiation skills (or lack thereof). Owen for £16m?! You kidding me? Selling Bellamy for £5m?? Fucking joke that. I don't care how much Souness undermined Bellamy, every single person and their dog knows (and knew - before you trot out your 'hindsight' line) that Bellamy was worth more, even if he's an arrogant prick. That's my point, Shepherd's ineptness in the negotiation room, if you like.

Who would, in a hypothetical situation, if Bellamy was to be sold this summer, want him back at our club? (ceteris paribus ie. Owen is still here)

swings and roundabouts isn't it. We all want to pay less, but we all want better performance and better players, or more money spent on better players. Its got to come from somewhere. Its no use people moaning if the club doesn't buy quality players if they are not prepared to pay for it. The vast majority of the ground isn't particularly expensive within premiership prices. Yes, some clubs are cheaper, and some clubs are more expensive. It's also too expensive for some people. If someone lives outside Newcastle, its more expensive again, especially if they live a distance outside Newcastle or even the North East. This problem is far deeper ranging than NUFC's ticket prices. The problem is far deeper than just providing a nice transfer kitty too. Although this is beyond your comprehension as we've proved time and again. Indeed. An accountant like you, is just the sort of person who should have known the repercussions of Souness selling our best players for a pittance, and going on a wild spending spree to replace them. Sadly, you didn't have the comprehension to see that, did you. Souness didn't set the price of the players who were being sold, nor did he sanction the incoming transfers at those ridiculous prices. And don't come back with your typical 'What is a chairman to do then? Not back his manager?' bollocks because this isn't about that. It's about the fees for the players bought and sold, something that Souness did not control, so don't blame him for something Shepherd was in control of.

Pretty much sums up how I feel at the moment as well. Part of me thinks I should just renew, but then I just keep thinking why the fuck should I support his ineptitude and that of his boss with my 600 notes? It's like a downpayment on misery - you give them your money at the start of the season, and they repay you with fortnightly bursts of mediocrity. oh dear. You obviously wouldn't have the stomach for a real shite board and team Gem, just like all those who you think have always supported the club when we did ...... you know, that glory era where we fighting for the 2nd division relegation trophy instead of playing in europe. Great fans, these fans of NUFC. The most loyal in the world, unless they suffer the mediocrity of playing regularly in europe and buying top international footballers, they won't go. Top post mate. Maybe some of you will hop over to the SOS if they do better than our mediocrity. A tip for you. If you want an excuse for not going, why not pick up on the fact that the season tickets are going to be in the form of swipe cards, meaning if you miss a game you can't sell the ticket unless its to someone who you trust will give you the card back ? I didn't say I wouldn't go dicksplash, I said I wouldn't renew. So get down off your high horse eh, there's a good loyal fan. Fact is you would accept anything you get served up because "it's better than it used to be" - it's nothing to do with loyalty, it's because you're a brainless idiot that is Shepherd's dream fan. I have other things in my life to occupy my time and money beside a football team, and I'm not stupid enough to hand over money for a season ticket (particularly if there's a price rise) following the shit we've been served up the last few seasons - we are going backwards fast, everyone but you can see it, and I'm not about to blindly support it with my hard earned. You'll turn up as usual with a big vacant grin on your face, happy with the shit that your hero keeps serving up. That's up to you. I don't have to renew to keep the likes of you happy. Don't lie

Utter wank. Setting up your own criteria of him having to be the most superamazinglybrilliant player in the world this season and beating the whole world, then, just because he hasnt done it week in week out you say that someone who thinks he is the best is 'stupid'!! I have highlighted the clause for you. They are BOTH amazing players ffs. Rooney > Ronaldo tonight in biggest game of season (not against Wigan at home for example) If he is supposed to be the 'best', shouldn't he be able to perform week in week out? I'm only applying the criteria his fanboys set up for him; fanboys such as NE5 who state he's 'the best footballer in the country' when tbh, he's not. I think he's amazing. I think Ronaldo's amazing. Henry, Gerrard, Drogba, and a few others are as well. But this fact doesn't mean Rooney has lived up to the expectations of his defenders though. He's been inconsistent, imo, while Ronaldo's been the best player in the league with Drogba and Scholes being a distant second. And we'll see about the biggest game of the season, there'll be a few more games ahead for Manyoo that will be more important than tonight. hoho.....and you call ME a WUM mackems.gif Take into account that I absolutely hate manu and their arrogant gloryseeking fans, and tell me what reason I would have to be a "fanboy" of any of their players ? Its simply a matter of being above this sort of feeling, and making a judgement. I think Rooney is the better player with more to offer long term, which is not knocking Ronaldo in the slightest as i said I have always said he is a brilliant player, and I wish they both played for Newcastle. You're English, and so is he. That's the only reason I see for you making this absurd judgment that his own manager, most of his fans and his peers and colleagues disagree. Well. You know what, I'm not really arsed. He will have his reasons, maybe he is talking about form, maybe not, maybe Ronaldo is the type who responds to that sort of talk ? Alex Ferguson would know. One thing I think you should not do, is believe what managers and other people say in the press, they always have their reasons which only they know themselves. As you say, we will see who does better in the long run. This time next year he may be saying Rooney is the best player in the world ? One thing is obvious, and that is he clearly thinks he has 2 of the top players going, of which there is no doubt at all. Your use of stupid words such as fanboy do you little credit BTW, it just shows you can't debate properly, because it isn't as if I assumed anything about you. I don't like Manure, but also as I'm English, I would rather any of our teams win this cup than Milan, unlike the sad and small minded Wullie, it would seem. A WUM comment by him perhaps, do you think ? That's a lot of 'maybes' in regards to Fergie's comments about Ronaldo. Maybe Fergie's just telling it as it is? And it's ironic that you're talking to me about creating 'stupid words', wasn't it you who created the term 'Keegan-bandwagon-jumper' or was it your mate? Anyhow, I've seen you used this term on many an occasion so get off your high horse. Furthermore, in your previous post, you asked 'How do YOU judge talent?' - well, I judge talent on quite a similar list of attributes that you mentioned, but I also judge it on form and consistency, because that's a mark of a good player. Bramble has all the attributes needed by a central defender yet his form can be terrible and he lacks consistency, which is why he isn't good [enough]. And it's quite funny that you pounce on my judgment when I mentioned 'form' without actually paying attention to what I've emphasized in all my previous posts, which is that form, in my case, is performance over a period of time, such as a season or more, not some sort of purple patch that 'average' players can hit. So I'm not going to answer your hypothetical question regarding what I might say if Luque plays well in 5 or 6 games because it has no relevance. PS. I don't think Wullie's a WUM. I actually agree with him and want Milan to win the whole thing (and preferably thrash whoever they play in the final, if they get there of course).

Utter wank. Setting up your own criteria of him having to be the most superamazinglybrilliant player in the world this season and beating the whole world, then, just because he hasnt done it week in week out you say that someone who thinks he is the best is 'stupid'!! I have highlighted the clause for you. They are BOTH amazing players ffs. Rooney > Ronaldo tonight in biggest game of season (not against Wigan at home for example) If he is supposed to be the 'best', shouldn't he be able to perform week in week out? I'm only applying the criteria his fanboys set up for him; fanboys such as NE5 who state he's 'the best footballer in the country' when tbh, he's not. I think he's amazing. I think Ronaldo's amazing. Henry, Gerrard, Drogba, and a few others are as well. But this fact doesn't mean Rooney has lived up to the expectations of his defenders though. He's been inconsistent, imo, while Ronaldo's been the best player in the league with Drogba and Scholes being a distant second. And we'll see about the biggest game of the season, there'll be a few more games ahead for Manyoo that will be more important than tonight. hoho.....and you call ME a WUM mackems.gif Take into account that I absolutely hate manu and their arrogant gloryseeking fans, and tell me what reason I would have to be a "fanboy" of any of their players ? Its simply a matter of being above this sort of feeling, and making a judgement. I think Rooney is the better player with more to offer long term, which is not knocking Ronaldo in the slightest as i said I have always said he is a brilliant player, and I wish they both played for Newcastle. You're English, and so is he. That's the only reason I see for you making this absurd judgment that his own manager, most of his fans and his peers and colleagues disagree.

I see I apologize then. You still said I sounded like a twat though

NE5, mate.. That's why I said 'FWIW' to imply that I'm going off on a tangent and will be discussing something else. I don't think you're a WUM in general, but about Wayne Rooney, maybe you are. Or maybe you should take off your rose-tinted specs regarding English footballers, the same specs that many members of the media seem to have on. Anyways, how else do you judge 'talent and overall worth' if not based on a measure of long-term-ish form ie. over a season? I wouldn't actually have a problem if you said Rooney will be the best footballer in the country in 2 years, or 5 years, or whatever, but because your original statement inferred that you think of him in that manner at present, I just can't agree with it when he's clearly not. Note the differentiation that I'm making between today and tomorrow, now and the future. He's not the best footballer in the country today, but maybe he will be in the future. The only way, imo, you can judge whether a footballer is actually good today is based on form over a certain period.

Utter wank. Setting up your own criteria of him having to be the most superamazinglybrilliant player in the world this season and beating the whole world, then, just because he hasnt done it week in week out you say that someone who thinks he is the best is 'stupid'!! I have highlighted the clause for you. They are BOTH amazing players ffs. Rooney > Ronaldo tonight in biggest game of season (not against Wigan at home for example) If he is supposed to be the 'best', shouldn't he be able to perform week in week out? I'm only applying the criteria his fanboys set up for him; fanboys such as NE5 who state he's 'the best footballer in the country' when tbh, he's not. I think he's amazing. I think Ronaldo's amazing. Henry, Gerrard, Drogba, and a few others are as well. But this fact doesn't mean Rooney has lived up to the expectations of his defenders though. He's been inconsistent, imo, while Ronaldo's been the best player in the league with Drogba and Scholes being a distant second. And we'll see about the biggest game of the season, there'll be a few more games ahead for Manyoo that will be more important than tonight. Your use of the word 'fanboy' is like using the word 'posterboy', they both make you sound a bit of a twat. The distance you put between the portuguese lad that you clearly fancy and the rest is ridiculous. Yes, there will be more important games in the CL, i.e. the final if they make it past Milan. They've got the league sorted, so are you saying the final of the FA cup will be the most important? Wullie, your english, who would you prefer to be getting the plaudits today? Rooney and Scholes or Kaka and Gilardinio? I don't really give a fuck if I sound like a twat, my point still stands. And yes, I clearly fancy Ronaldo, which is why I voted Kaka in this thread before the game piss off. The fact that you have nothing else to say to me except call me a twat and have a dig at my admiration for Ronaldo says a lot, mate. Clearly. Try reading it again and point out where i said that. I said it makes you sound twattish. Subsequently confirmed tbh. I did have something to say, i pointed out your flawed criteria / logic and how absurd it sounded to call someone stupid for rating Rooney above Ronaldo. That's what you said. Is this some sort of stupid joke btw? Plainly obvious that you said I sound like a twat, to which I responded that I don't really give a fuck. Is there something I'm missing here?? I don't understand you differentiating between 'sounding twattish' and 'sound like a twat' - it's the same thing to me. My criteria isn't flawed, and even if it is flawed, it doesn't really matter because I applied it to each and every 'great' player in the same manner; I didn't create one criteria for Rooney and another for 'the boy I fancy', Ronaldo. Tbh, I hesitated when I was typed the word 'stupid' in the original post, because other words could have been substituted in to imply that I didn't understood his logic, but I wanted to make sure to imply that I did, but thought it was rubbish - a statement/point which I still stand by.

Utter wank. Setting up your own criteria of him having to be the most superamazinglybrilliant player in the world this season and beating the whole world, then, just because he hasnt done it week in week out you say that someone who thinks he is the best is 'stupid'!! I have highlighted the clause for you. They are BOTH amazing players ffs. Rooney > Ronaldo tonight in biggest game of season (not against Wigan at home for example) If he is supposed to be the 'best', shouldn't he be able to perform week in week out? I'm only applying the criteria his fanboys set up for him; fanboys such as NE5 who state he's 'the best footballer in the country' when tbh, he's not. I think he's amazing. I think Ronaldo's amazing. Henry, Gerrard, Drogba, and a few others are as well. But this fact doesn't mean Rooney has lived up to the expectations of his defenders though. He's been inconsistent, imo, while Ronaldo's been the best player in the league with Drogba and Scholes being a distant second. And we'll see about the biggest game of the season, there'll be a few more games ahead for Manyoo that will be more important than tonight. Your use of the word 'fanboy' is like using the word 'posterboy', they both make you sound a bit of a twat. The distance you put between the portuguese lad that you clearly fancy and the rest is ridiculous. Yes, there will be more important games in the CL, i.e. the final if they make it past Milan. They've got the league sorted, so are you saying the final of the FA cup will be the most important? Wullie, your english, who would you prefer to be getting the plaudits today? Rooney and Scholes or Kaka and Gilardinio? I don't really give a fuck if I sound like a twat, my point still stands. And yes, I clearly fancy Ronaldo, which is why I voted Kaka in this thread before the game piss off. The fact that you have nothing else to say to me except call me a twat and have a dig at my admiration for Ronaldo says a lot, mate.

Utter wank. Setting up your own criteria of him having to be the most superamazinglybrilliant player in the world this season and beating the whole world, then, just because he hasnt done it week in week out you say that someone who thinks he is the best is 'stupid'!! I have highlighted the clause for you. They are BOTH amazing players ffs. Rooney > Ronaldo tonight in biggest game of season (not against Wigan at home for example) If he is supposed to be the 'best', shouldn't he be able to perform week in week out? I'm only applying the criteria his fanboys set up for him; fanboys such as NE5 who state he's 'the best footballer in the country' when tbh, he's not. I think he's amazing. I think Ronaldo's amazing. Henry, Gerrard, Drogba, and a few others are as well. But this fact doesn't mean Rooney has lived up to the expectations of his defenders though. He's been inconsistent, imo, while Ronaldo's been the best player in the league with Drogba and Scholes being a distant second. And we'll see about the biggest game of the season, there'll be a few more games ahead for Manyoo that will be more important than tonight.

2-1 to Mourinho's men.

FWIW, imo, three of the best young players in the world who have proven that they can dominate/change a game on many occasions and have done the business this season and the last are Kaka, Cristiano Ronaldo and Leo Messi. Unfortunately, NE5, Rooney doesn't make the list. And it's not because of any 'agenda' or 'bias' that I have against the boy. I think he's talented and has all the tools needed to succeed, but succeed he certainly has not. This was supposed to be his breakout season, the one where he dominates the Premiership and takes over from Thierry Henry as the best all round striker. Has he done that? Fuck no. He's done okay, but severely underachieved if one considers the expectations placed on him by the typically sensationalist English media and of course the hordes of fans who expect him to be the saviour of the English game, a category I'm putting you in. He's not there yet, mate. Maybe one day he will be, but your statement 'Rooney is the best footballer in the country' is not only astonishingly stupid considering the fact that the actual best footballer is his teammate, but it also shows YOUR bias FOR Rooney, something which has been apparent on many an occasion. It's quite funny and ironic that you keep pointing out that because you've been to more games, seen more in football, you know more about the league, football and all that bollocks, yet you're unable to actually see what it seems is apparent to the rest of the world, even to Rooney's own fucking manager, which is that Ronaldo is better than Rooney. I'm not even going to address your previous remarks about form and how that can't be used to judget a player again because I think you're just being a WUM at this point.

Hear hear.

WHAT?! How do you judge whether a footballer is good or not unless he performs? And if I'm not mistaken, in this thread, you seem to be implying form is over a 'season' or more, not just five or ten games where players can hit purple patches. Are you saying Rooney is good just because? Without having any evidence to back up your claim since he's been poorer than his teammate, how can you justify this statement? Ludicrous, mate.

not surprised to see Kaka having more of the vote now, as opposed to before the game began when almost 66% voted Ronaldo.

Hoping Manyoo get raped. Honestly, that's the only thing I'm hoping for this season now - that they get bummed in every single competition they're alive in.

Fergie's gone if they win the Champions League this season tbh. He only ever stayed on because he wanted to win it again and I reckon if they have three good games, they're gonna win it and he's gonna go.

It's a good read actually and surprisingly, as we reach the end of the article, a few of his points really hit home. Go Oliver!!

He's quality. And he's an all-round striker. His game is not only about scoring goals, it's about making runs, holding the ball up and actually being a part of the attacking play (which is why Manyoo offloaded VRoy). I'd take him in a loan deal or something like him + £5m for Mickey.

He's a poor man's Lampard when he was at his best during his time at Leeds.

7 point lead!!!

Shocking, especially for a club like Arsenal. Wonder what Wenger thinks of the whole thing, especially considering the season they've had hasn't been one of their best.

Who thinks this has something to do with Freddy telling Roeder to keep Owen out of the side until the season's over so he can say to the FA in the summer 'look, he hasn't even played for us, he's not going to be playing for you' or am I just really cynical?