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Unfortunately playing trading is now essential the Ashley era of nil spending "war chest" is gone the easy upgrades to sponsors have been made and are already needed for all that previous spending which up until the summer involved under 40m worth of selling. If we have of spent 60m in the summer while it didn't need 60m of players to be sold as explained about the cost of the player being spaced over the length of the contract from a book keeping prospective it still would have needed players to leave.

Better in terms of slipping further down the league forget top 5 at all this season unless something drastically gives or we recruit difference makers in the winter window. Manu dropping points is good Fulham draw stops some of their excellent momentum while screwing arteta so win win Spurs result again stops them building a gap Brighton results stops their momentum (we want to slow their momentum and drag them back into the middle bunch with us). Palace well being negative stops them climbing towards us points wise. I think my sentiment is more thank fuck everyone beating everyone in that middle pack as we already have a hill to climb to make up a few points.

Some extremely kind results for us this weekend despite how bad we have been the gap to top 6 is only 5 points not that based on current form can make that up mind. Mad season in general.

I find it hard to argue each way to be honest due to things not being announced such as sponsorships, stadium, Darren's replacement etc. We also don't know if its Amanda's finances which facilitated her downfall the psr stuff or the off field performance. While much is unknown it can be used by both school of thoughts. The negative ownership opinion will say we are being too slow and no news is a bad sign of ambition. The positive bunch will say things take time, no project is linear and we have really good people in post now to take these next steps. I cannot say which side I am on as both can prove to be true right now. Guess we will know when the next bit of big news arrives I.e major sponsorship or stadium plans.

When you look at the individual players in the squad and how "good" they can perform how long before we start saying he's lost them? I dunno if it's arrogance they feel they have "made it". Did they believe the now seemly lie that with a fully fit squad they now top 7 already? How he exactly changes the mindset or stops the rot i have no idea. I know some of his favourites may end up finding their starts massively reduced with a new manager coach arriving. It's frustrating when you hear the likes of Gordan and big joe say how well they regard the manager that they are playing their way to his downfall. Although I fear for big joe he's masking a bad shoulder problem all that strapping and him going down and holding it can't be a good thing.

I assume it was either an ultimatum from Howe about being backed or a lack of will to make the changes needed as it was bad timing appointment wise with the transfer window. As you said hard to judge too much at this point but as I say he can't be blameless for the summer he chose to go along with plan "A"

I still want to have hope it somehow clicks Upturn in performances Mitchell shrewd business in the winter window getting a new spark/freshness Stadium plans Maybe God forbid some new sponsors announced Cup run However most of it is on Howes first two seasons which due to a whole host of reasons he may never get back to. How much of this season do you write off to find out is anyone's guess if there was a good standout available candidate maybe it would be an easier choice.

Lack of action from Mitchell in the summer in either backing the old plan or not coming up with a good alternative and stamping his authority to enforce a new way/direction. The comments brought up by him privately speaking to the journos after the summer that recruitment so far has not been fit for purpose. Something brought back to the attention of howe recently who just said he didn't know what he meant by that as he likes who we signed.

That quote only a few weeks ago would have been 3 or 4 points off the gap is widening and the performances are consistently inconsistent

His usual performance great driving runs no end product and alot of backwards passes once he has no clue what to do with the ball in the final third.

Age catching up to him? Too many games? No one for competition? Still to agree his future? All of it? I want a fair few players out of the side to try and freshen up and give them a kick in the arse they need but don't see anyone taking his place off him without a signing. If there is any budget at all is it an attacker or a defender both departments trying their best to make a case for new signings.

Easy to probably say after a loss and he's been out so long it will take time i am still unimpressed by anything he has done so far hope we aren't relying on him for any period this season he looks finished.

The regression is crazy only masked by a few teams being just as inconsistent. Bad bad bad summer and the Howe comments about it being very hard to improve what we have is starting to bite him in the arse as nearly the full team is here other than botman and we look shit. So disappointed with the lads and their effort and application and on the manager for doubling down and hoping something will click its not working.

Don't want to dwell on the negatives when the team did well collectively and the side will need that good feeling momentum. However agreed he drives forward and the stops and wants to go back and recycle the ball. Not that sort attacking instinct in him really a few times he was trying to keep 3 Liverpool players away and just ended up going back. I am hoping a proper attacking winger can do alot more with Tino's excellent driving runs and then takes over the crossing shooting bit.

Not sure i saw the same thing watching the game he was all over the place coming for the ball and trying to make things happen the assist for gordan was selfless and he kept chasing lost causes pressuring the keeper. Was an much better performance from him.

Craig no hope has suggested the dream sold is now further into thr future than those group sold a dream with training ground, stadium, European ambitious but didn't go as far to say it would cause an effect on the pitch. Howe having 1-2-1s with his players and his comment about if they feel they are champions league players play like one. The group dynamic does seem to have shifted from the together as one narrative. Players getting 1 year extensions, players still playing on last year on contract, older players coming to an end of their career. How we navigate this going forward may well have a baring on the medium and long term future of the clubs underlying performances. I hope it's seen as a positive and an opportunity.

Not sure it was mentioned in the match day thread but the trent thing really annoyed me. When he got carded he was right up in the refs face sure he put hands on him and think I read his lips right iam sure he said "but I have only been on the pitch 2 minutes" like that excuses a bookable offence? The respect the ref and captains only seem to only be when it suits them or they been told after the rice thing to lay off it.

In an ideal world all the following are shipped first: Willock- injures and never hit loan period heights and doesn't score with 6 in 83 for us compared to 9 in 33 from Barnes. Longstaff- don't rate Miggy-dont rate getting on Murphy- patchy at best and getting on but limited sale value However with Barnes it goes back to who is worth selling funds creation and who is willing to buy. Minus the injury last year he's entering peak years with a great goal return over multiple seasons. I can see us getting our money back or a little more unless the desire to sell is due to an unhappy player.

If we had Europe we would need him and there are other dross in the side I would prefer to shift first if only people would buy them but he's not pulling up trees when he starts and is older than gordan so I can see it being a sacrifice to move forward.

I would say the only chance we have if we get one of them sent off but it didn't work the last time 🤣

Like I say I can't understand your view point as I have no stake in it. Certainly you have my respect for speaking out when you feel so strongly. Because to me it's just a rainbow I don't see his actions as anything other than niave at best and he hasn't said or written anything aggressive to the point of promoting hate or hate speech about any sort of group. Obviously I am aware that branches of religion don't align with people's sexual preference and outside of the country it can have deadly consequences so not going to pretend there is no part whatsoever where it maybe construde that way. Hence why I would prefer its supported by the clubs and in the stadiums but kept off the field. For example my kids are severely disabled my son can't stand loud noises and regularly self harms due to sensory overload. The club have setup a quiet space in the stadium where you can be part of the match day experience but not the noise of the crowd. Not sure how well advertised it is but it's an inclusive thing I appreciate that doesn't need to be heavily promoted.

Obviously I can't put myself in your shoes or know how you feel or have been treated by others. I also feel campaigns like these are good for spreading the word and acceptance and tolerance. However to some the flag is just a rainbow and doesn't mean anything else and how they feel is personal to them. This is the point I kinda regret making as it just spill into the debate I feared where not doing it at all means you hate something or writing on a rainbow is a slight or defacing something special to others. The player may not have any strong views either way or misguided to think the campaign to respect a single group of people can also include religion too. Not going to know how he feels unless you know him or he releases a statement so hard to say if he is intentionally taking any stance good or bad by doing what he did.

Political maybe isn't a good choice of words as it shouldn't be debated that personal basic human rights are important. Just that promoting one thing and not another is a choice. The fact if he didn't wear one which to me he is more than free to do so would have gotten him outted in the press. Do I agree with what he did? No. However I also think what he did was harmless albeit misguided. The guidance as mentioned in the article restricts him promoting his view point of religion whilst playing. 'political, religious or personal slogans, statements or images.' I agree with the rule because unfortunately personal expression is just that personal.

That's why political stuff should stay out of sport its too devisive. Wasn't a big fan of the taking the knee thing and while it's great to include and promote inclusion we don't do sport campaigns for all minority groups or all walks of life who have a certain belief or condition. Things like these are a personal choice which should be left off the field for you to feel how you feel privately or promote in your personal life as you have every right to do so. I get the whole public figure thing but if work asked me to dress a certain way or promote a banner on an email and I didn't believe in it or want to I can see how it can be hard. End of the day you will have 2 schools of thought he has defaced a flag that symbolises something for so many people. Or he has promoted what he has been asked and added his own spin on it. The daft git will have been well aware it wouldn't go down well/not allowed.

Solanke? Although to be fair it was alot of championship and not consistently season after season so maybe not.