Kid Icarus

I can't get away from thinking that it'll end up being Rafa in the end. Maybe not the next manager, but in the long term.

I think you're both right like. It's a double edged sword - precisely because it's your football club means it should mean more to you than it does with Uber, Starkbucks, and Disney, but because it's your club means walking away isn't anywhere near being an option in the same way that it is not using Uber, Starbucks, or Disney+. I think it's fair to say that anyone looking on from the outside and not being able to understand why Newcastle fans aren't kicking up a fuss while they're using those companies and have a much easier consumer decision to make don't really have a leg to stand on. Obviously that's not to say that them being hypocritical means that they're wrong.

We did do that for years. No idea why you're continuing to ignore actions abroad but I don't think we're going to get anywhere near to agreeing, so best just leave it there

No of course it's not. Surely the point isn't that pointing it out is colonial and racist, but that not seeing it as the same thing when the west does it, or trying to claim that other states are worse is? I mean you're still saying the west and SA are incomparable but for some reason you're only really looking at the disparity between societies and not factoring in actions abroad.

And it's not a case at all of saying that you can't criticise the Saudis because the west is bad, it's purely in response to you saying that they're incomparable and not as bad. Of course you can and should criticise the Saudis.

I'm not obfuscating anything man, you're making up points I haven't and wouldn't make. It's really simple, our own societies are clearly freer and don't have the human rights issues internally that the Saudis have. Our and the U.S's foreign actions abroad are easily comparable and historically over a long and short period far beyond the atrocities of the Saudis. Why you're only looking domestically, I'm not sure.

It's really not and I say that as someone who fully realises who MBS is. You might have the blinkers on where the west is concerned. Our own societies may have more freedom but our and the U.S actions abroad, or in fact our sponsorship and trading with the very regimes you say are night and day to our own is there for all to see

Good to see you

Reminds me of when we tried to warn the Palace forum about Pardew, got told to fuck off and then they all ended up absolutely hating him, as expected. ?

There were some good times. Both championship seasons despite how we shouldn't have been there in the first place, the half a season in the PL with Hughton and the group of lads, the last few months of the 5th season had some enjoyable football and probably the best line up we had, the season back up with Rafa had a triumph over adversity feel to it All instances of enjoying it or feeling part of something in spite of Ashley and because of that, all of them deliberately shut down, dismantled, and undermined by Ashley out of spite.

Purely on foreign intervention alone. The U.S has far more domestic freedom.

I'd say B-More is absolutely right there. The U.S (and Israel) are just as bad, if not worse, and comfortably so. Obviously not an excuse, there'd be an outcry if those states owned clubs and rightly so. This is exactly how sports washing works though, they're not daft and know fine well the emotional ties that people have to their football clubs and that even those who are well aware what the likes of MBS have done and feel guilt will try to justify it to themselves or feel conflicted, and that those who don't feel guilty at all will openly defend them. There's a bit in Manufacturing Consent that talks about how team sports train people to have irrational attitudes of submission to authority. I'm not saying that has been the explicit intention here, but I do think there's a lot to be said for that idea and that it's the basis for sports washing's success.

Genuinely can't work out why this isn't a more popular outlook considering how popular it was under Ashley.

Mike supported Liverpool

Is this existence?

I have a question

Rafa really would be ideal, but probably have to draw a line under that now and it's nice thinking about that chapter without it possibly being tainted by a new one where there's higher expectations.

Could see us going for someone like Tammy Abraham if he really kicks on at Roma. Would be pretty funny considering Rafa wanted him when we could have got him cheaply.

Maybe one for tomorrow, but it's mad to think of the things that we'll have all got up to in the time that Ashley's owned the club, how old we were then vs now, where we've been, what we've done. Would love to read what's changed for everyone.

The Gallowgate pigeon and the human rights stuff. In that order.

The Hull protest...the next one, not sure when or if I will.

Having a succulent Indians with a couple of bottles of wine while browsing the internet and watching old Newcastle videos.

Caused irrepairable damage to so many people's love for Newcastle and football in general to the extent that he's forced 99% of the fanbase to embrace someone they know is an even worse person because they're that desperate get him out. Really wouldn't wish Ashley on Sunderland or any fan base like.