Kevin Keegan

[Rafalove]

It’s from the chronicle who were quoting his book

[Tsunami]

Pav was loved up here but between him, Hooper & Shak you’d struggle to make the keeper we needed. Those quotes from Pav suggest how fragile he was & I very much doubt that KK delivered those words in a negative way.

 

Look up the game at Southampton the year before we blew the league. I vividly remember sitting in my car waiting to pick my girlfriend up listening to the end of the game, 1-0 up, thinking at last we’d win down there (obviously not knowing there’d be years more disappointment) and we conceded 3 goals in the last 4 minutes. All 3 goals were comedy, Pav should have been replaced at the end of that season.

[Robster]

Look up the game at Southampton the year before we blew the league. I vividly remember sitting in my car waiting to pick my girlfriend up listening to the end of the game, 1-0 up, thinking at last we’d win down there (obviously not knowing there’d be years more disappointment) and we conceded 3 goals in the last 4 minutes. All 3 goals were comedy, Pav should have been replaced at the end of that season.

How on earth do I not remember this game !

[Hughesy]

Pav was loved up here but between him, Hooper & Shak you’d struggle to make the keeper we needed. Those quotes from Pav suggest how fragile he was & I very much doubt that KK delivered those words in a negative way.

 

Look up the game at Southampton the year before we blew the league. I vividly remember sitting in my car waiting to pick my girlfriend up listening to the end of the game, 1-0 up, thinking at last we’d win down there (obviously not knowing there’d be years more disappointment) and we conceded 3 goals in the last 4 minutes. All 3 goals were comedy, Pav should have been replaced at the end of that season.

 

People always talk about our defence letting us down in the Keegan era, but actually a top class keeper would have made a massive difference.  Had we had a Schmeichel/Seaman/Martyn level keeper we would have won the league.

[Superior Acuña]

Not dismissing the discussion, but we only conceded 2 more goals than ManU, whereas we scored 7 fewer.

[Guest]

Ferdinand went off the boil second half of the season (compared to the first-half anyway) just as Man U seemed to be winning every other game 1-0 - Cantona.

[Scoreboard82]

Was absolute stuff of dreams when world superstar KK signed for 2nd division US as a player.

 

Just been looking back pages trying to find some story about him going to play in the US...American.. 2nd division before I realized what this was saying.

Sorry for the confusion. Still amazed that he'd had such an illustrious career and joined NUFC at the time, when we'd struggled for years and seemed devoid of hope.

[Colos Short and Curlies]

Not dismissing the discussion, but we only conceded 2 more goals than ManU, whereas we scored 7 fewer.

 

Pav and Shaka were perfectly fine keepers, rarely conceding goals that they 'should' have been saving. However they also rarely put in performances where they were pulling out saves that they shouldn't be making, and that in a few games that season could have made all the difference. 5 of our 8 defeats were by 1 goal with a further 6 draws (4 being 1-1)

 

I'm not sure Martyn would have made that much of a difference, but a Flowers or Seaman probably win us the league.

 

 

[Wallsendmag]

Martyn was at least as good as Flowers like. Certainly won far more England caps. Seaman would have made a huge difference and would have won us the league imo.

[Rafalove]

Seamen definitely would. Better than any keeper we’ve ever had. A little bit forgotten about but he was class.

[Guest]

Not dismissing the discussion, but we only conceded 2 more goals than ManU, whereas we scored 7 fewer.

 

Pav and Shaka were perfectly fine keepers, rarely conceding goals that they 'should' have been saving. However they also rarely put in performances where they were pulling out saves that they shouldn't be making, and that in a few games that season could have made all the difference. 5 of our 8 defeats were by 1 goal with a further 6 draws (4 being 1-1)

 

I'm not sure Martyn would have made that much of a difference, but a Flowers or Seaman probably win us the league.

 

 

 

Southgate for £3-4m from Palace in 1995 would have been handy.

[Cronky]

Not dismissing the discussion, but we only conceded 2 more goals than ManU, whereas we scored 7 fewer.

 

Pav and Shaka were perfectly fine keepers, rarely conceding goals that they 'should' have been saving. However they also rarely put in performances where they were pulling out saves that they shouldn't be making, and that in a few games that season could have made all the difference. 5 of our 8 defeats were by 1 goal with a further 6 draws (4 being 1-1)

 

I'm not sure Martyn would have made that much of a difference, but a Flowers or Seaman probably win us the league.

 

 

 

Southgate for £3-4m from Palace in 1995 would have been handy.

 

I agree. That was a big miss.

[Ketsbaia]

Always thought it was a shame that Given, Speed and Solano came in just afterwards, as we starting turning shit.

[Guest]

Not dismissing the discussion, but we only conceded 2 more goals than ManU, whereas we scored 7 fewer.

 

Pav and Shaka were perfectly fine keepers, rarely conceding goals that they 'should' have been saving. However they also rarely put in performances where they were pulling out saves that they shouldn't be making, and that in a few games that season could have made all the difference. 5 of our 8 defeats were by 1 goal with a further 6 draws (4 being 1-1)

 

I'm not sure Martyn would have made that much of a difference, but a Flowers or Seaman probably win us the league.

 

 

 

Southgate for £3-4m from Palace in 1995 would have been handy.

 

I agree. That was a big miss.

 

Even if it was a budget thing, could have signed him rather than Warren Barton, Watson first-choice right-back and kept Hottiger or Venison as back up for an extra year? All obviously with hindsight, like.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

KK was tactically way ahead of his time when he was our manager first time around and we were not poor defensively, we were brilliant a both ends, we just lacked leadership and experience. Had he stayed we would have eventually won a title and been a force in Europe.

[Guest]

I hate how Tino gets scapegoated as well. In the 14 games he was here that season he scored 3 and had 7 assists. He was probably our best attacker during the run-in.

[Karjala]

Wasn't there a transfer window where Flowers and Hendry were strongly rumoured to be coming?

 

 

[JeffJ]

Wasn't there a transfer window where Flowers and Hendry were strongly rumoured to be coming?

 

No transfer windows back then. Hall says he went to Keegan and told him we should sign a centre half, rumour was Hendry but KK said no, we started the run with Howey, Peacock and Albert and we were finishing with them. He was right too, as mentioned earlier the goals drying up from Sir Les and Bobby Lee, the injury to Gillespie and Ginola going off the boil is what really cost us.

[kingxlnc]

For me, Keegan leaving in 1997 is the biggest what-if moment in football, given what's happened since. A proper sliding doors moment.

If he didn't leave then, or got replaced with Robson immediately, the way football looks today would have been completely different, to the extent where I feel NUFC would have continued to be a force, or at least still relevant instead the shell of a club you see today.

 

[Guest]

I don’t think Robson would have seen us stay a top force tbh. I think as a club we’d peaked. We’d became a plc, our top players were having to be sold to balance the books, I don’t think Bobby coming in would have changed that. I don’t think we’d have plummeted to 13th like under Dalglish, probably around 7th-8th as the likes of Chelsea, Leeds and even Aston Villa were starting to strengthen. If he’d came in then, would he have still been around early 00s to take us back to that sort of level after the stadium extension and additional income?

[Keggy_Keagal]

I always thought a key point was that Kevin was so self assured in his early days here and that he didn't give a monkey's when others questioned his decisions. This seemed to change during 95-96 season somewhat.

 

I remember there was negativity about Beresford (something about him having a dodgy knee or failing a medical) and Bracewell signing and Kev just plowed on through . Same with the signing of Cole there were people within football who were like "What ? He's spending how much on him ?" and Keegan was "like this lad's got it" . Even the signing of Beardsley, voices within the club weren't happy about that signing because of his age and Kevin was adamant. You can look at the sale of Andy Cole as a larger example that KK was completely sure of himself.

 

Then there definitely seemed to be a change of Special K's mentality and he started listening to the media and the naysayers. To me this started with the signing of David Batty which seemed to be on the back of people saying that we couldn't win the title playing the way we were. Then over time and with the loss of the title this seemed to validate the criticism's of him with a lot of people and perhaps in Kevin's mind. Culminating in when he left England and saying he tactically wasn't up to it.

[Wallsendmag]

Wasn't there a transfer window where Flowers and Hendry were strongly rumoured to be coming?

 

 

 

Can't remember any real links with Flowers (could be wrong) but we were definitely strongly linked with Colin Hendry. He would have been a massive signing for us.

[Tsunami]

KK bought Shaka from Reading who had lost the play off final when he should have signed Nigel Martyn who'd just been relegated with Palace. Martyn and Hendry  would have great business.

[TRon]

I always thought a key point was that Kevin was so self assured in his early days here and that he didn't give a monkey's when others questioned his decisions. This seemed to change during 95-96 season somewhat.

 

I remember there was negativity about Beresford (something about him having a dodgy knee or failing a medical) and Bracewell signing and Kev just plowed on through . Same with the signing of Cole there were people within football who were like "What ? He's spending how much on him ?" and Keegan was "like this lad's got it" . Even the signing of Beardsley, voices within the club weren't happy about that signing because of his age and Kevin was adamant. You can look at the sale of Andy Cole as a larger example that KK was completely sure of himself.

 

Then there definitely seemed to be a change of Special K's mentality and he started listening to the media and the naysayers. To me this started with the signing of David Batty which seemed to be on the back of people saying that we couldn't win the title playing the way we were. Then over time and with the loss of the title this seemed to validate the criticism's of him with a lot of people and perhaps in Kevin's mind. Culminating in when he left England and saying he tactically wasn't up to it.

 

I think there's a lot of truth in there, Keegan was definitely at his best when he just did what he wanted and believed in what he was doing. He did get tactically out-manoeuvred in some games, I think Fergie's Man U seemed to impose themselves on us more than we should have allowed, but we were still a far better team then than we have been since even with tactically acclaimed managers like Allardyce and Rafa.

[Cronky]

I always thought a key point was that Kevin was so self assured in his early days here and that he didn't give a monkey's when others questioned his decisions. This seemed to change during 95-96 season somewhat.

 

I remember there was negativity about Beresford (something about him having a dodgy knee or failing a medical) and Bracewell signing and Kev just plowed on through . Same with the signing of Cole there were people within football who were like "What ? He's spending how much on him ?" and Keegan was "like this lad's got it" . Even the signing of Beardsley, voices within the club weren't happy about that signing because of his age and Kevin was adamant. You can look at the sale of Andy Cole as a larger example that KK was completely sure of himself.

 

Then there definitely seemed to be a change of Special K's mentality and he started listening to the media and the naysayers. To me this started with the signing of David Batty which seemed to be on the back of people saying that we couldn't win the title playing the way we were. Then over time and with the loss of the title this seemed to validate the criticism's of him with a lot of people and perhaps in Kevin's mind. Culminating in when he left England and saying he tactically wasn't up to it.

 

I think there's something in that.

 

I always remember around the time that we signed Tino, I read this article by Brian Clough in one of the tabloids. He said that when he was manager of Notts Forest, during their title-winning season, he was very tempted to make sure of success by buying another player towards the end of the transfer window. In the end, he decided to hold his nerve, because a new player at that stage might be difficult to integrate, and might be seen by his existing squad as a vote of no confidence in them. For those reasons, he decided against entering the transfer market, and he now had similar doubts as to whether it was wise for Keegan to buy Tino.

 

We'll never know for sure whether things would have turned out differently if Keegan had done differently, but I've since been inclined to think that Clough made the right call. Tino was a good player all right, but he wasn't the player we needed. Including him meant that the Sir Les - Pedro partnership, which had been so fruitful, was disrupted, with Beardsley being pushed out right. The weak link in the side, and the player that should have been replaced, was Gillespie. We needed a wide player.

 

I recently saw an interview with Sir Les, where he himself said that changing the line-up to bring in Tino was a significant error. It's not that Tino can be held 'to blame'. It's just that he was the wrong player at the time.