what the hell goes on?

[madras]

The fans.

i agree with this to a large part. the performances of carr, duff , bramble and parker where never as bad as certain sections of the crowd tried to make out. crowds have fovourites and they also like scapegoats and once a player has the tag it takes a hell of a lot to get rid of it. i'd also say that some players appear to get a very easy ride of the crowd (beye in his final season, gutierrez this season for example). it's nothing new as i remember tommy gibb getting dogs abuse while jimmy smith was allowed to get away with murder.

[Yorkie]

Carr - Bramble - Boumsong - Babayaro.

 

£15m or so? It was a shame that Moore got injured so early on in his career here because he was a decent centre-back. A seasoned pro like him would have probably improved our general defense ten-fold that year. Not that the team had any hope at all with Souness at the helm.

[Guest toonlass]

For years we have had more injuries that other premiershp teams, if physioroom is to be believed. We were forever at the top of their "league" and even before they kept a league we always seemed to have players who were out forever i.e. Marcellino and his ridiculous finger injuries. Personally I think there is a problem with the medical staff at the club, as this has been a consistant problem for ages and hasn't seemed to clear up with a change of manager.

[MKSC]

I'm sure I recall hearing Allardyce say when he was appointed that one thing he was aiming to sort out was the horrific record of players getting injuries and, in particular, recurring injuries. Obviously we never found out if he could do it, but he was certainly aware of the problem. It remains to be seen if it has been solved.

[David28]

I'm sure I recall hearing Allardyce say when he was appointed that one thing he was aiming to sort out was the horrific record of players getting injuries and, in particular, recurring injuries. Obviously we never found out if he could do it, but he was certainly aware of the problem. It remains to be seen if it has been solved.

 

Well, as you said we never found out. But one thing that we know is that it seems like Chris Hughton has sorted it out for now. 

[Guest Haris Vuckic]

We have had poor managers, it's as simple as that. If it's true that Shepherd bought players over the manager's head that won't have helped either.

 

Absolutely spot on.

 

Bad management from the very top all the way down to the bottom/.

 

I dunno like.

 

Apparently Gullit was proper good at finding out what player wanted in their tea 

[DubblyDubblyDubbly]

I'm sure I recall hearing Allardyce say when he was appointed that one thing he was aiming to sort out was the horrific record of players getting injuries and, in particular, recurring injuries. Obviously we never found out if he could do it, but he was certainly aware of the problem. It remains to be seen if it has been solved.

 

Well, as you said we never found out. But one thing that we know is that it seems like Chris Hughton has sorted it out for now. 

That wouldn't be that the current bunch don't put in enough effort to get injured would it ?

PS. I fancy Forest to finish 2nd.. if not 1st.

[cubaricho]

This is definitely something I thought about today while watching Carr captain a side in the top half of the Prem tonight when he was dubbed not good enough by a vast majority of our fans. 

 

What I find interesting while reading through this thread is the reluctance to blame any of this on the fans of our club, and when someone has brought it up, I find it odd that it's almost exclusively foreign posters (like myself) that see this as an issue.  There definitely seems to be a different type of culture surrounding our club that isn't as prevalent at other clubs around the country (from what I've read) - it's almost like there is some sense of entitlement.  I see it every day on this forum, everyone is very volatile when it comes to their feelings about a certain player but more often than not it's very negative and the negativity happens very quickly.  Also, players are given no where near enough time to acclimate to the surroundings of SJP.  We have to take into consideration the fact that we have one of the biggest fan bases in England and that has got to be very intimidating for a foreign (or any) player - especially when they go out and put in one abject performance and are never given the chance to get back into the good graces of the fans.  We have a lot of responsibility considering our numbers and passion, I just think everyone needs to look at themselves and see how they use that power.  We could be the best model club in the league but we are very very far from it.  This is not a place people are clambering to come play at - Premiership or not.

 

And just so we're clear, I am not blaming this solely on the fans, but there is definitely a percentage of this equation that involves the supporters of this club.

[TRon]

For years we have had more injuries that other premiershp teams, if physioroom is to be believed. We were forever at the top of their "league" and even before they kept a league we always seemed to have players who were out forever i.e. Marcellino and his ridiculous finger injuries. Personally I think there is a problem with the medical staff at the club, as this has been a consistant problem for ages and hasn't seemed to clear up with a change of manager.

 

The manager doesn't usually appoint the medical staff, I would think that's the job of the board of directors. Seeing as Shepherd appointed his own son to deal with signings like Boumsong, Luque and Owen, I wouldn't like to think how he made decisions regarding medical staff. I'm in no way suggesting that the Shepherd family benefited financially in any way out of those signings btw. Not at all.

 

 

[Pilko]

Carr was poor today, there was two occasions when there was a routine long punt towards him and instead of just heading it unchallenged he let it bounce then lost the shoulder to shoulder with the opposition player and there was a chance created.

[Wullie]

This is definitely something I thought about today while watching Carr captain a side in the top half of the Prem tonight when he was dubbed not good enough by a vast majority of our fans.

 

The plain and simple fact though is that he wasn't good enough when he was here. How he's doing now is irrelevant.

 

If it was just our fans who thought he was shite, why was he on the dole for 18 months?

[TRon]

Carr was poor today, there was two occasions when there was a routine long punt towards him and instead of just heading it unchallenged he let it bounce then lost the shoulder to shoulder with the opposition player and there was a chance created.

 

I know Carr was mentioned in the OP but there are much better examples of players thriving after leaving here. Milner, Bellamy, Zog, Duff, Speed, to name just a few. It's quite funny that Souness was once quoted as saying you won't win anything with Milner and Ambrose in the side. Both are doing far better than most of the garbage he brought into the club at massive expense.

[Pilko]

Carr was poor today, there was two occasions when there was a routine long punt towards him and instead of just heading it unchallenged he let it bounce then lost the shoulder to shoulder with the opposition player and there was a chance created.

 

I know Carr was mentioned in the OP but there are much better examples of players thriving after leaving here. Milner, Bellamy, Zog, Duff, Speed, to name just a few. It's quite funny that Souness was once quoted as saying you won't win anything with Milner and Ambrose in the side. Both are doing far better than most of the garbage he brought into the club at massive expense.

 

Ah, I know, Carr is still generally pretty wank imo. The first thing you're told as a defender is not to let the ball bounce and he did it at least twice today. He's also crap in possession, there was a game away at Southampton where we played him RM once, and his ball retention and distribution was unbelievably poor.

[TRon]

Carr was poor today, there was two occasions when there was a routine long punt towards him and instead of just heading it unchallenged he let it bounce then lost the shoulder to shoulder with the opposition player and there was a chance created.

 

I know Carr was mentioned in the OP but there are much better examples of players thriving after leaving here. Milner, Bellamy, Zog, Duff, Speed, to name just a few. It's quite funny that Souness was once quoted as saying you won't win anything with Milner and Ambrose in the side. Both are doing far better than most of the garbage he brought into the club at massive expense.

 

Ah, I know, Carr is still generally pretty wank imo. The first thing you're told as a defender is not to let the ball bounce and he did it at least twice today. He's also crap in possession, there was a game away at Southampton where we played him RM once, and his ball retention and distribution was unbelievably poor.

 

Yeah Carr is shit without a doubt. Conceivably though any player can be used to his maximum ability if the management is right...even Nicky Butt. That's the real issue for me.

[Pilko]

Are you watching MOTD? They just showed one of those times when he ducked under the ball and let Rooney in.

[HawK]

There's only one reason, it's all down to the management of the players, and we've had terrible managers since Bobby. And for this we can mostly blame Shepherd

[TRon]

Are you watching MOTD? They just showed one of those times when he ducked under the ball and let Rooney in.

 

Yeah I already agreed he's shit. I was looking at the broader topic of piss poor management at newcastle which for me is the bigger issue.

[lovejoy]

This is definitely something I thought about today while watching Carr captain a side in the top half of the Prem tonight when he was dubbed not good enough by a vast majority of our fans.

 

The plain and simple fact though is that he wasn't good enough when he was here. How he's doing now is irrelevant.

 

If it was just our fans who thought he was s****, why was he on the dole for 18 months?

he was only on the rock and roll for about 6 months, not that it matters like

[Cronky]

This is definitely something I thought about today while watching Carr captain a side in the top half of the Prem tonight when he was dubbed not good enough by a vast majority of our fans. 

 

What I find interesting while reading through this thread is the reluctance to blame any of this on the fans of our club, and when someone has brought it up, I find it odd that it's almost exclusively foreign posters (like myself) that see this as an issue.  There definitely seems to be a different type of culture surrounding our club that isn't as prevalent at other clubs around the country (from what I've read) - it's almost like there is some sense of entitlement.  I see it every day on this forum, everyone is very volatile when it comes to their feelings about a certain player but more often than not it's very negative and the negativity happens very quickly.  Also, players are given no where near enough time to acclimate to the surroundings of SJP.  We have to take into consideration the fact that we have one of the biggest fan bases in England and that has got to be very intimidating for a foreign (or any) player - especially when they go out and put in one abject performance and are never given the chance to get back into the good graces of the fans.  We have a lot of responsibility considering our numbers and passion, I just think everyone needs to look at themselves and see how they use that power.  We could be the best model club in the league but we are very very far from it.  This is not a place people are clambering to come play at - Premiership or not.

 

And just so we're clear, I am not blaming this solely on the fans, but there is definitely a percentage of this equation that involves the supporters of this club.

 

I'd agree that there is a problem, in that since the Keegan / Hall era, the expectations are much higher, but there hasn't been the means to deliver on those expectations. That can put a lot of pressure on the players. The glass is half empty rather than half full.

 

It's a lot easier playing in front of Birmingham fans, because they're in a state of delirium because they're 8th. Sir Bob was booed after finishing 5th.

 

It's not the only problem, but it's there.

[midds]

Some people are only ever happy when they've got something to be miserable about. Fact.

[Guest Roger Kint]

Some people are only ever happy when they've got something to be miserable about. Fact.

 

100%

 

As for this thread, hopefully the horror of relegation has wiped all twattery from our squad(excluding Barton & Caroolll)  and we start doing things right

[lovejoy]

Some people are only ever happy when they've got something to be miserable about. Fact.

 

100%

 

As for this thread, hopefully the horror of relegation has wiped all twattery from our squad(excluding Barton & Caroolll)  and we start doing things right

 

agreed.

 

whatever people say about shearer as manager, i do believe he was hell bent on correcting the deep issues that we have behind the scenes/

[Raconteur]

 

I know Carr was mentioned in the OP but there are much better examples of players thriving after leaving here. Milner, Bellamy, Zog, Duff, Speed, to name just a few. It's quite funny that Souness was once quoted as saying you won't win anything with Milner and Ambrose in the side. Both are doing far better than most of the garbage he brought into the club at massive expense.

 

I would have thought that both Bellamy and Speed, for instance, were both outstanding while here - hardly falling into the category of players who thrive after leaving. And at a stretch you could say the same for Zog and Milner - while their careers have gone in an upward trajectory, one must consider their age and the fact that they did both improve and play at a good standard while here...

 

[midds]

Some people are only ever happy when they've got something to be miserable about. Fact.

 

100%

 

As for this thread, hopefully the horror of relegation has wiped all twattery from our squad(excluding Barton & Caroolll)  and we start doing things right

 

agreed.

 

whatever people say about shearer as manager, i do believe he was hell bent on correcting the deep issues that we have behind the scenes/

 

Said at the time we needed someone to rip the club apart and build it up again from scratch. I think Shearer, given enough time and backing, would have done this.

 

All academic now obviously like. We didn't go down that route and we are where we are.

[TRon]

Some people are only ever happy when they've got something to be miserable about. Fact.

 

100%

 

As for this thread, hopefully the horror of relegation has wiped all twattery from our squad(excluding Barton & Caroolll)  and we start doing things right

 

agreed.

 

whatever people say about shearer as manager, i do believe he was hell bent on correcting the deep issues that we have behind the scenes/

 

Said at the time we needed someone to rip the club apart and build it up again from scratch. I think Shearer, given enough time and backing, would have done this.

 

All academic now obviously like. We didn't go down that route and we are where we are.

 

Shearer was offered the job under Shepherd but didn't take it. I'm pretty sure he would have all the time and backing he wanted back then so why he didn't is a mystery tbh. Maybe he just didn't fancy it at the time.