Play-offs for fourth Premier League CL place?

[OzzieMandias]

Seems like a good idea to me.

 

Premier League plans play-off for last Champions League place

 

The Premier League is considering introducing a play-off system to determine the fourth club to qualify for the following season's European Champions League.

 

Currently the club which finishes fourth goes through but the new proposal would mean a play-off between the clubs finishing fourth, fifth, sixth and seventh. The intention is to inject more competition into a league in which qualification has for years remained in the hands of the same four clubs.

 

Premier League sources have confirmed that the play-off proposal was presented at the most recent meeting of all clubs, on 4 February, and the league's chief executive, Richard Scudamore, was authorised to return with further details in April.

 

It is understood that the idea was enthusiastically supported by all clubs – except the so-called big four of Chelsea, Manchester United, Arsenal and Liverpool. Scudamore, and the league's secretary, Mike Foster, will examine the practicalities of how a play-off system could work: whether it should take the form of a home-and-away knockout system, similar to that in the Football League, or incorporate seeding. They will also look into when matches could be fitted into a crowded fixture calendar before making recommendations.

 

The idea was presented as part of the Premier League's strategic review of its format and operations and springs from two particular motivations. The first is to crack the problem of England's top league becoming less open and competitive, with the richest clubs, Manchester United, Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool, having strengthened their hold on the top four places over several years. One league source said it was an odd twist that the idea has been raised now, in a season when Liverpool's claim to the fourth place is being seriously challenged.

 

The response among clubs outside the top four is understood to have been positive, with some believing that a play-off system would create more competitive matches and give more clubs a prize to challenge for. Most clubs now feel they have no chance of attaining fourth place but almost the whole Premier League could be brought into a competition to finish seventh and make it to the play-offs. The medium-sized clubs, which increasingly aspire to break the cartel, are said to have been enthusiastic, seeing play-offs as a great opportunity.

 

The big four, who have been qualifying on merit at the end of each season and reaping the footballing and financial rewards of Champions League participation are understood to have been less keen. Self-interest is clearly a factor, with those clubs concerned about protecting their own advantages. However, there is also a feeling that the league should be more sophisticated about addressing its major challenges, particularly the financial ones, rather than incorpor-ating an awkward play-off system for a prize as ostensibly moderate as fourth place.

 

The other motivation for the play-offs is a waning of the proposal for an international round of matches, dubbed "Game 39", which was widely criticised for lacking coherence and being territorially expansionist. The play-offs would mean extra matches, which would be sold to pay-television and so generate more money for all clubs.

 

The consistent qualification of the same four clubs, widely seen as stifling competition, is not replicated across Europe. The Premier League largely blames the Uefa Champions League money, distributed to participating clubs, for entrenching the big four's financial power. Uefa, however, points out that Champions League income represents a small part, 8–13%, of Manchester United's, Chelsea's, Arsenal's and Liverpool's total turnover. Most of the big clubs' money is made in this country; Premier League television income is relatively evenly distributed but United, Chelsea and Arsenal in particular make much more than their nearest rivals from commercial activities and match-day revenues in the Premier League.

 

The Dutch league tried a play-off system for the second Champions League qualification place but abandoned it after the 2007-08 season, when FC Twente Enschede beat Ajax 2-1. The issues in Holland were the risk of crowd trouble at such high-stakes matches and a perception that the play-offs were one-sided.

 

In the Premier League there is some confidence that neither of those would present major problems. As a means of encouraging competition, opportunities and increasing income, the play-off proposal already seems to have enough support to suggest it could gain the necessary 14-6 majority to be implemented.

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/feb/14/premier-league-play-off-champions-league

[Nobody]

Give it to the FA Cup winner.

[Guest neesy111]

Seems like a good idea to me.

 

Premier League plans play-off for last Champions League place

 

The Premier League is considering introducing a play-off system to determine the fourth club to qualify for the following season's European Champions League.

 

Currently the club which finishes fourth goes through but the new proposal would mean a play-off between the clubs finishing fourth, fifth, sixth and seventh. The intention is to inject more competition into a league in which qualification has for years remained in the hands of the same four clubs.

 

Premier League sources have confirmed that the play-off proposal was presented at the most recent meeting of all clubs, on 4 February, and the league's chief executive, Richard Scudamore, was authorised to return with further details in April.

 

It is understood that the idea was enthusiastically supported by all clubs – except the so-called big four of Chelsea, Manchester United, Arsenal and Liverpool. Scudamore, and the league's secretary, Mike Foster, will examine the practicalities of how a play-off system could work: whether it should take the form of a home-and-away knockout system, similar to that in the Football League, or incorporate seeding. They will also look into when matches could be fitted into a crowded fixture calendar before making recommendations.

 

The idea was presented as part of the Premier League's strategic review of its format and operations and springs from two particular motivations. The first is to crack the problem of England's top league becoming less open and competitive, with the richest clubs, Manchester United, Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool, having strengthened their hold on the top four places over several years. One league source said it was an odd twist that the idea has been raised now, in a season when Liverpool's claim to the fourth place is being seriously challenged.

 

The response among clubs outside the top four is understood to have been positive, with some believing that a play-off system would create more competitive matches and give more clubs a prize to challenge for. Most clubs now feel they have no chance of attaining fourth place but almost the whole Premier League could be brought into a competition to finish seventh and make it to the play-offs. The medium-sized clubs, which increasingly aspire to break the cartel, are said to have been enthusiastic, seeing play-offs as a great opportunity.

 

The big four, who have been qualifying on merit at the end of each season and reaping the footballing and financial rewards of Champions League participation are understood to have been less keen. Self-interest is clearly a factor, with those clubs concerned about protecting their own advantages. However, there is also a feeling that the league should be more sophisticated about addressing its major challenges, particularly the financial ones, rather than incorpor-ating an awkward play-off system for a prize as ostensibly moderate as fourth place.

 

The other motivation for the play-offs is a waning of the proposal for an international round of matches, dubbed "Game 39", which was widely criticised for lacking coherence and being territorially expansionist. The play-offs would mean extra matches, which would be sold to pay-television and so generate more money for all clubs.

 

The consistent qualification of the same four clubs, widely seen as stifling competition, is not replicated across Europe. The Premier League largely blames the Uefa Champions League money, distributed to participating clubs, for entrenching the big four's financial power. Uefa, however, points out that Champions League income represents a small part, 8–13%, of Manchester United's, Chelsea's, Arsenal's and Liverpool's total turnover. Most of the big clubs' money is made in this country; Premier League television income is relatively evenly distributed but United, Chelsea and Arsenal in particular make much more than their nearest rivals from commercial activities and match-day revenues in the Premier League.

 

The Dutch league tried a play-off system for the second Champions League qualification place but abandoned it after the 2007-08 season, when FC Twente Enschede beat Ajax 2-1. The issues in Holland were the risk of crowd trouble at such high-stakes matches and a perception that the play-offs were one-sided.

 

In the Premier League there is some confidence that neither of those would present major problems. As a means of encouraging competition, opportunities and increasing income, the play-off proposal already seems to have enough support to suggest it could gain the necessary 14-6 majority to be implemented.

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/feb/14/premier-league-play-off-champions-league

 

stupid idea tbh

 

after 38 games, the team that finishes fourth deserves to be there

[Kaizero]

"Oh no! Liverpool might not finish fourth? What can we do? :frantic:"

 

Is what it reads to me.

[Gash]

In a way, it seems like a good idea to mix it up a bit, but on the other hand, somebody playing well for 38 games then getting pipped to the post by a team who could, in theory, have finished 10 points behind them seems unfair. I'd vote for position personally, no play-off.

[Village Idiot]

"Oh no! Liverpool might not finish fourth? What can we do? :frantic:"

 

Is what it reads to me.

 

Probably wouldn't apply this season.

 

Interesting idea, although we enter the usual "who deserves it more vs excitement" debate when playoffs are involved.

[Dr.Spaceman]

"Oh no! Liverpool might not finish fourth? What can we do? :frantic:"

 

Is what it reads to me.

 

This.

[Greg]

"Oh no! Liverpool might not finish fourth? What can we do? :frantic:"

 

Is what it reads to me.

 

This.

 

Not a chance of it happening this season so I don't see how this can be the case.

[Kaizero]

"Oh no! Liverpool might not finish fourth? What can we do? :frantic:"

 

Is what it reads to me.

 

This.

 

Not a chance of it happening this season so I don't see how this can be the case.

 

This season shows the "big four" might be falling out of the CL spots, which would be a big issue for the money makers, hence the idea of giving whichever drops out of the four top spots in the future yet another chance so money won't be lost. It won't apply this season, but I'd bet they're regretting not coming up with this before.

[midds]

If everyone knows what the rule is at the start of the season then the team finishing 4th can have no complaints if they don't go on and qualify. It's a good thing as it would mean more of the cash being shared around rather than the current 'big 4' having it sewn up.

[Thespence]

I hope the FA stand up to the PL & say nar were going to dish out the invite to the top 4.

[The Prophet]

Thought they should of done it for a while.

[Disco]

Won't involve us for fucking ages so I say good idea.

[cubaricho]

Would be down with this idea just due to the possibility of there no longer being the "big four."  the only people who will be against this are teams who have the chance to finish fourth (arsenal/liverpool) and not see themselves in the CL.

[Village Idiot]

What kind of playoff would that be though? Wembley games or home+away legs?

[Kaizero]

Would be down with this idea just due to the possibility of there no longer being the "big four."  the only people who will be against this are teams who have the chance to finish fourth (arsenal/liverpool) and not see themselves in the CL.

 

I see it the other way around, the gap between the "top four" and the ones close to them are becoming much less apparent, and this would give the "top four" a chance at remaining the "top four" even if not finishing in it.

[TRon]

Seems like a good idea to me.

 

Premier League plans play-off for last Champions League place

 

The Premier League is considering introducing a play-off system to determine the fourth club to qualify for the following season's European Champions League.

 

Currently the club which finishes fourth goes through but the new proposal would mean a play-off between the clubs finishing fourth, fifth, sixth and seventh. The intention is to inject more competition into a league in which qualification has for years remained in the hands of the same four clubs.

 

Premier League sources have confirmed that the play-off proposal was presented at the most recent meeting of all clubs, on 4 February, and the league's chief executive, Richard Scudamore, was authorised to return with further details in April.

 

It is understood that the idea was enthusiastically supported by all clubs – except the so-called big four of Chelsea, Manchester United, Arsenal and Liverpool. Scudamore, and the league's secretary, Mike Foster, will examine the practicalities of how a play-off system could work: whether it should take the form of a home-and-away knockout system, similar to that in the Football League, or incorporate seeding. They will also look into when matches could be fitted into a crowded fixture calendar before making recommendations.

 

The idea was presented as part of the Premier League's strategic review of its format and operations and springs from two particular motivations. The first is to crack the problem of England's top league becoming less open and competitive, with the richest clubs, Manchester United, Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool, having strengthened their hold on the top four places over several years. One league source said it was an odd twist that the idea has been raised now, in a season when Liverpool's claim to the fourth place is being seriously challenged.

 

The response among clubs outside the top four is understood to have been positive, with some believing that a play-off system would create more competitive matches and give more clubs a prize to challenge for. Most clubs now feel they have no chance of attaining fourth place but almost the whole Premier League could be brought into a competition to finish seventh and make it to the play-offs. The medium-sized clubs, which increasingly aspire to break the cartel, are said to have been enthusiastic, seeing play-offs as a great opportunity.

 

The big four, who have been qualifying on merit at the end of each season and reaping the footballing and financial rewards of Champions League participation are understood to have been less keen. Self-interest is clearly a factor, with those clubs concerned about protecting their own advantages. However, there is also a feeling that the league should be more sophisticated about addressing its major challenges, particularly the financial ones, rather than incorpor-ating an awkward play-off system for a prize as ostensibly moderate as fourth place.

 

The other motivation for the play-offs is a waning of the proposal for an international round of matches, dubbed "Game 39", which was widely criticised for lacking coherence and being territorially expansionist. The play-offs would mean extra matches, which would be sold to pay-television and so generate more money for all clubs.

 

The consistent qualification of the same four clubs, widely seen as stifling competition, is not replicated across Europe. The Premier League largely blames the Uefa Champions League money, distributed to participating clubs, for entrenching the big four's financial power. Uefa, however, points out that Champions League income represents a small part, 8–13%, of Manchester United's, Chelsea's, Arsenal's and Liverpool's total turnover. Most of the big clubs' money is made in this country; Premier League television income is relatively evenly distributed but United, Chelsea and Arsenal in particular make much more than their nearest rivals from commercial activities and match-day revenues in the Premier League.

 

The Dutch league tried a play-off system for the second Champions League qualification place but abandoned it after the 2007-08 season, when FC Twente Enschede beat Ajax 2-1. The issues in Holland were the risk of crowd trouble at such high-stakes matches and a perception that the play-offs were one-sided.

 

In the Premier League there is some confidence that neither of those would present major problems. As a means of encouraging competition, opportunities and increasing income, the play-off proposal already seems to have enough support to suggest it could gain the necessary 14-6 majority to be implemented.

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/feb/14/premier-league-play-off-champions-league

 

stupid idea tbh

 

after 38 games, the team that finishes fourth deserves to be there

 

I agree. To this day it still rankles that the mackem bastards benefited at our expense through the play offs which reduces a whole season to a lottery.

[Thespence]

CL is bad enough having the 4 placers in it never mind potentially having 7th in.

[Fenham Mag]

I think only the top 2 should get Champions league. Its a bonus for the winners and consolation for the runners up. The other 2 places should be dished out in the cup competitions. Some clubs are becoming more interested in qualifying for the CL than actually winning the premiership itself.

[Teasy]

Good idea IMO, yes how well a team does over 38 games is always a better decider then one off games.  But the fact is the money from the top four is so large it almost guarentees that the same teams will continue to finish in the champions league places every year (appart from when a billionaire comes in and buys success like at Chelsea and Man City).  At least this idea would shake things up a bit.

[Kaizero]

I think only the top 2 should get Champions league. Its a bonus for the winners and consolation for the runners up. The other 2 places should be dished out in the cup competitions. Some clubs are becoming more interested in qualifying for the CL than actually winning the premiership itself.

 

I agree with that, would make the cups potentially interesting again.

[Greg]

"Oh no! Liverpool might not finish fourth? What can we do? :frantic:"

 

Is what it reads to me.

 

This.

 

Not a chance of it happening this season so I don't see how this can be the case.

 

This season shows the "big four" might be falling out of the CL spots, which would be a big issue for the money makers, hence the idea of giving whichever drops out of the four top spots in the future yet another chance so money won't be lost. It won't apply this season, but I'd bet they're regretting not coming up with this before.

 

You think the Premier League want it to be the same top 4 every year? They want to mix it up a bit and make the league more entertaining, it's no surprise Liverpool and the other so called big 4 are the only teams against it.

[Kaizero]

"Oh no! Liverpool might not finish fourth? What can we do? :frantic:"

 

Is what it reads to me.

 

This.

 

Not a chance of it happening this season so I don't see how this can be the case.

 

This season shows the "big four" might be falling out of the CL spots, which would be a big issue for the money makers, hence the idea of giving whichever drops out of the four top spots in the future yet another chance so money won't be lost. It won't apply this season, but I'd bet they're regretting not coming up with this before.

 

You think the Premier League want it to be the same top 4 every year? They want to mix it up a bit and make the league more entertaining, it's no surprise Liverpool and the other so called big 4 are the only teams against it.

 

tbh I think the world is cynical enough for that, including the Premier League, the "top four" are the main pull outside of England and if one or two of them started to trail it would make the gloryhunters jump ship and perhaps focus on other league, or not follow football at all, meaning a lot of money would be lost selling television rights to other countries and so on and so on.

[OzzieMandias]

Good idea IMO, yes how well a team does over 38 games is always a better decider then one off games.  But the fact is the money from the top four is so large it almost guarentees that the same teams will continue to finish in the champions league places every year (appart from when a billionaire comes in and buys success like at Chelsea and Man City).  At least this idea would shake things up a bit.

 

Exactly. At the moment it's like a vicious circle (or virtuous circle, from the top 4's point of view). Certain teams finish in the top four so they get the money to buy the players to finish in the top four to get the money to... And no one has a hope of challenging this without gambling everything on debt, or attracting a super-rich sugardaddy.

[Village Idiot]

I agree about giving a CL spot to the cup winner, I wish they would do that in Spain too although we don't have the same issues there (3rd and 4th spots are pretty open). However I can't see UEFA smiling at say, Pompey playing the CL (as cool as it would be for fans of small clubs that manage a good cup run).