Ishmael Posted April 20, 2011 Share Posted April 20, 2011 He's a good player. Real technical quality at least. Of course he's going to tear that league up. Remember him sending one past Man Red from 30+ yards in a friendly when he was at Stoke ages back. A little wasted his career. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaelius Posted April 20, 2011 Share Posted April 20, 2011 Georgios Samaras manages to maintain a wretched scoring record up there like. Greasy, languid streak of shite that he is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Snrub Posted April 20, 2011 Share Posted April 20, 2011 Any post-match interviews from Guardiola/Jose about? http://www.sportinglife.com/football/news/story_get.cgi?STORY_NAME=soccer/11/04/20/manual_230822.html&BID=165 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaelius Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 Don't suppose anybody's sad enough to be watching the Copa Libertadores right now? Santos going through here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpal78 Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 Maybe Messi should move to Port Vale and prove himself? It's not that though, you miss the point. He's a world class manager and one of the best around. But he's not god like some people make him out to be. It's not like he beat Barcelona with Alan Smith and James Perch. There are other factors bar him that has contributed to his success. Money, deep squads and so on. People are all hysteric he beat Barcelona with a team consiting of CRonaldo, Özil, Di Maria etc. You're not making much sense. Of course top managers will manage top clubs, why would he be managing players like Perch or Smith? We don't ask SAF and the rest of the top managers to prove their credibility by managing piss poor players. What Mourinho does though is make his players play 110% for him no doubt. I've followed Madrid since the Galactico period and never have I seen a Madrid team played with so much intensity down to every single player. They were running and harassing Barcelona right to the very end, even the so called diva players. Of course when big teams like Madrid, Barcelona, Man Utd, Inter win, there are a multitude of factors involve, when Giardiola wins with Barcelona, we don't take credit away from him just because he has players like Messi, Xavi and Iniesta do we? But if you want to consider the Mourinho factor, then why is it that even with money, big squads (and all other factors that you care to name) Inter did not win the CL for donkey years till Mouriho came along. Why is that Madrid with all that they have could not past the 2nd round stage of the CL for so many years pre Mourinho ad now they are in the semis? He makes great teams into champions and although unlikely I would love it just love if Madrid wins the CL this year. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hughesy Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 His Porto squad was full of quality players, also look at what teams he played in the UEFA Cup. Not like they were impossible teams to beat. I mean a team consisting of half the portuguese national side which reached the final of the Euro Cup isnt exactly bad. Add to that Benni McCarthy, Derlei and Carlos Alberto who were very good players at the time its not like he had a s*** team. Also, the Porto team that won the Champions League beat Manchester United, but after that most of the games were clubs of the same reputation as them. It was a weird season with Monaco in the final. That Porto team was a team he built, and it only became half the Portuguese national side when he came along. Deco was an average player until Mourinho came onto the scene. (7 league goals in 3 seasons before scoring 13 in Jose's first season alone), Ferreira, Derlei, Mendes and Valente were all signed from mid table Portuguese clubs, Carvalho was third choice and had spent the past two seasons on loan (and had only made a a single league game for Porto) and his Captain Costa had to be recalled from loan. Alberto, Maniche and McCarthy were all signed by him as well. All those players were no names or names only in Portugal. Deco wasn't really averaged, and also the 13 goals he scored was during the season when Mourinho signed, Mourinho signed however only in January. Vitor Baia had been injured and had played for Barcelona prior to that and wasn't exactly unkown. Costinha had won Ligue 1 and arrived prior to Mourinho. Carvalho became 3rd choice under Mourinho as he had partnered Jorge Andrade for most of the season before Mourinho came. On the other hand he did build his team, I'll give you that, but he also had the money to do so. The players he signed weren't exactly unknown in Portugal. That said, he's a great manager, but ALL I've been trying to say is that there's an exxageration in terms of praise. Its not exactly like he has ever had a s*** team and won stuff with a s*** team. Just to clarify... who has won the CL with a bad team? Who has won the CL with a 'worse' team than Porto? And also it would be useful to offer an opinion without relying entirely on hindsight when it comes to judging the merits of players. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cronky Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 I only saw the last 45 minutes of the game last night, but Barca have reason to be worried because it did look like Mourinho knows how to beat them. Now that they've got that result, the players will have that confidence as well. Despite all the possession and pressure, Real looked the more likely to score. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 Never once did I say he should be managing players like Smith and Perch. Let me say this then to make it easier for you to understand. Mourinho has not won anything with an unwinnable team. I have not once said he's not a great manager, there aren't many managers of his qualities and achievements out there. But he has won with Inter who were used to win titles and during a time where the Serie A was weak. He has won with Chelsea where he had the money to buy whatever player he wanted, he won last night with a team that has the deepest squad in the world, yet people makes it look like he has won of an eleven consisting of amateur players. Not once have I said he's shit or hasn't won anything. All I've said is that he's not exactly won stuff with nobodies. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hughesy Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 Yes - and I've asked quite a straightforward question in return. Can you name a manager who has won the CL with a 'worse' team? No-one is disputing the fact that Porto were a good team - albeit I imagine barely amongst the top 16 favourites to win the CL that year. But I cannot think of a 'worse' team to win the CL? Therefore, that makes Mourinho's achievement that much greater. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 Never once did I say he should be managing players like Smith and Perch. Let me say this then to make it easier for you to understand. Mourinho has not won anything with an unwinnable team. I have not once said he's not a great manager, there aren't many managers of his qualities and achievements out there. But he has won with Inter who were used to win titles and during a time where the Serie A was weak. He has won with Chelsea where he had the money to buy whatever player he wanted, he won last night with a team that has the deepest squad in the world, yet people makes it look like he has won of an eleven consisting of amateur players. Not once have I said he's shit or hasn't won anything. All I've said is that he's not exactly won stuff with nobodies. Who has? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 My response wasn't exactly to you. But well, considering I'm to young to even remember most of the 90s, I'd say during the last decade Porto certainly had the worst team. And the achievement was great, but tell me bar Man Utd what other teams did they play on their way to the final? Were these great teams? Or were these teams of the same reputation as them? Mourinhos achievements ARE great, and I AM a fan of Mourinho. However, sometimes he gets more credit than he deserves that's all I wanted to say really and I'm talking about last night for instance. His team was inferior for 120minutes and moments of brilliance from his goalkeeper and one moment of greatness from arguably the 2nd best player in the World won him the game. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 Never once did I say he should be managing players like Smith and Perch. Let me say this then to make it easier for you to understand. Mourinho has not won anything with an unwinnable team. I have not once said he's not a great manager, there aren't many managers of his qualities and achievements out there. But he has won with Inter who were used to win titles and during a time where the Serie A was weak. He has won with Chelsea where he had the money to buy whatever player he wanted, he won last night with a team that has the deepest squad in the world, yet people makes it look like he has won of an eleven consisting of amateur players. Not once have I said he's s*** or hasn't won anything. All I've said is that he's not exactly won stuff with nobodies. Who has? wow... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 Alex McLeish? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 No one has, my point exactly. Not even Mourinho Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpal78 Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 My response wasn't exactly to you. But well, considering I'm to young to even remember most of the 90s, I'd say during the last decade Porto certainly had the worst team. And the achievement was great, but tell me bar Man Utd what other teams did they play on their way to the final? Were these great teams? Or were these teams of the same reputation as them? Mourinhos achievements ARE great, and I AM a fan of Mourinho. However, sometimes he gets more credit than he deserves that's all I wanted to say really and I'm talking about last night for instance. His team was inferior for 120minutes and moments of brilliance from his goalkeeper and one moment of greatness from arguably the 2nd best player in the World won him the game. I'm not sure that's a fair description of the game. Barcelona no doubt played the better football overall, but Madrid edged it in the first half. In the 2nd half, although Barca dominated possession, in terms of chances and likeliness to score they were almost even. Barca was just better on the eyes. On ur 2nd statement of winning with a poor team, like you said no manager has done so in the CL. Mourinho's success should be measured against some realistic standards not some abstract unachievable standards and using the former, Mourinho is amongst the best if not the best already (will be if he leads Madrid to CL trophy) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnypd Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 Derlei and Carlos Alberto were pretty shit tbf Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 Pretty s*** yeah... 12 goals in 13 UEFA Cup games the season prior to the Champions League. And then 16 in 27 the whole season they won the Champions League. Carlos Alberto scored the first goal in that CL Final, s*** players don't do that. The season after that he played for Corinthians and was one of the their key players. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnypd Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 Pretty s*** yeah... 12 goals in 13 UEFA Cup games the season prior to the Champions League. And then 16 in 27 the whole season they won the Champions League. Carlos Alberto scored the first goal in that CL Final, s*** players don't do that. The season after that he played for Corinthians and was one of the their key players. sorry, forgot we weren't allowed to criticise brazilian players on here. derlei and carlos alberto would've been mid to lower table prem players at that point, and even that's being charitable. they performed better for porto because of who the manager was. jardel shits on both of them and he was crap too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEMTEX Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 I always thought Cafu was overrated personally. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 Pretty s*** yeah... 12 goals in 13 UEFA Cup games the season prior to the Champions League. And then 16 in 27 the whole season they won the Champions League. Carlos Alberto scored the first goal in that CL Final, s*** players don't do that. The season after that he played for Corinthians and was one of the their key players. sorry, forgot we weren't allowed to criticise brazilian players on here. derlei and carlos alberto would've been mid to lower table prem players at that point, and even that's being charitable. they performed better for porto because of who the manager was. What? Criticize how many Brazilian players you want as long as you've seen them. I have no problem as long as you can give an opinion to why. Now, you yourself said he (Derlei) wasn't shit. Good on you... Carlos Alberto on the other hand is shit now, but at that time he was a very promising player. After all he played in Mourinhos team and was then one of the reason to why Corinthians won the title in Brazil (Mourinho wasn't the manager at Corinthians, no). I also find it hard to understand why Porto, then Corinthians than Werder Bremen would splash cash on this kid if he was shit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 I always thought Cafu was overrated personally. Always offside. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 Pretty s*** yeah... 12 goals in 13 UEFA Cup games the season prior to the Champions League. And then 16 in 27 the whole season they won the Champions League. Carlos Alberto scored the first goal in that CL Final, s*** players don't do that. The season after that he played for Corinthians and was one of the their key players. sorry, forgot we weren't allowed to criticise brazilian players on here. derlei and carlos alberto would've been mid to lower table prem players at that point, and even that's being charitable. they performed better for porto because of who the manager was. jardel shits on both of them and he was crap too. Jardel only shits on portuguese defenders, fucking hell he was an average player just like Afonso Alves. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEMTEX Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 Carlos Alberto only scored 2 goals for Porto. It just so happens the I bet on him to be First Goalscorer in one of those 2 games. (The CL Final unsurprisingly). That is all, just wanted to remember that moment. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JH Posted April 22, 2011 Share Posted April 22, 2011 Forrest - Leicester on SS1. Cracking head from Tudgay. 1-0. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JH Posted April 22, 2011 Share Posted April 22, 2011 1-1 Cracking strike from Oakley. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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