SteveMc Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 If they're going to the trouble of making a statement it ought to actually say something Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaliMag Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 This is an internet forum so hyperbole and exagerration rule the day. I am disappointed, but I was more angry during the Gullit, Souness and Allardyce regimes than I am now at Pardew. I would guess I am not alone. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 The real issue here is that we have an incredibly stingy owner. It's as simple as that. The guy is only interested in getting bargain deals. I don't even think it's an issue of not wanting to spend money or not buy players tbh. The problem this last window is that we needed to get a striker who had somewhat of a goalscoring record. Finding a striker with a record of scoring goals at a bargain is damn near impossible. Simple. I find this annoying, because you can't help but feel they continued doggedly down this path to nowhere, and so didn't even consider someone who was maybe not as proven, but more of an up and comer e.g. Roux, which is the only way they would have been able to get the kind of value they were after. It just wasn't good enough. The policy is way too restrictive and for proven goalscorers in particular, it really does have to be loosened up some. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
macphisto Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Read my post fully and you'll see I wasn't blaming Carr. I was pointing out that if the club was serious about buying a new striker then Carr would have been at fault as it would have been one of the easiest jobs in football to identify players who are better than the current strikers at the club. By the way Prophet I like the way you don't say why my statement is a load of rubbish. Read through your quote and tbh you blame Carr and cannot wriggle out of that one ,Carr identifies and leaves it to the clowns to get them . I'm being serious here, where am I blaming Carr in this statement: "If the statement is true and it’s not but if it is then Graham Carr should be sacked already." I was saying that if we took the club statement to be true then in my opinion Carr would be to blame but I acknowledge that the statement is not true so by implication this is not the fault of Carr. That's not wriggling out of it, it's what I said. What I am saying is that for my mind in view of our current strike force the following does not compute: Board serious about buying a striker+good scout=no striker Obviously I think the board was not serious but I was making the point that if their statement was true then I would blame Carr for our failure to sign a striker. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 The real issue here is that we have an incredibly stingy owner. It's as simple as that. The guy is only interested in getting bargain deals. I don't even think it's an issue of not wanting to spend money or not buy players tbh. The problem this last window is that we needed to get a striker who had somewhat of a goalscoring record. Finding a striker with a record of scoring goals at a bargain is damn near impossible. Simple. I find this annoying, because you can't help but feel they continued doggedly down this path to nowhere, and so didn't even consider someone who was maybe not as proven, but more of an up and comer e.g. Roux, which is the only way they would have been able to get the kind of value they were after. It just wasn't good enough. The policy is way too restrictive and for proven goalscorers in particular, it really does have to be loosened up some. I basically agree with this, Ashley just doesn't want to be ripped off and will always push for a good deal. This will have pros and cons for us. One of the cons is that if we have a need for very specific type of player, and he has to be a lot better than the players we already have on the books, it might stop us releasing enough money to get him. In a less likely but possible scenario, we would identify a Tiote/Cabaye/Santon type signing - a quality player who is underpriced. For whatever reason we didn't manage to do that for a second striker this time. Still wonder if we'd be having the striker discussion in the same way if Ba had banged in two or three goals already. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conjo Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Who was crying out for a statement? like anyone take notes. There were plenty who called for a statement around the end of the deadline and the day after. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Who was crying out for a statement? like anyone take notes. There were plenty who called for a statement around the end of the deadline and the day after. A club statement? Really? I remember a lot of people wanting to know what shite Pardew would come out (what thread are we in here?) but other than that? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rainforest Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Im beginning to think that as far as strikers goes, its nigh-on impossible to meet the criteria of our owner. Strikers are the one position where players live and die by their goal/games ratio, the single criteria by which they are judged. I think Carr might be able to find "purchasable bargains" in any other position, but when it comes to strikers, there just isnt any strikers around banging in goals while remaining relatively unknown. Once they start smashing them in, people will know, driving the price up, and making the club less willing to sell. Hopefully there are some sloppy clubs around with too low a fee on the release clause of their striker, which they forgot to raise when he suddenly started banging them in. Heres to hoping Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Im beginning to think that as far as strikers goes, its nigh-on impossible to meet the criteria of our owner. Strikers are the one position where players live and die by their goal/games ratio, the single criteria by which they are judged. I think Carr might be able to find "purchasable bargains" in any other position, but when it comes to strikers, there just isnt any strikers around banging in goals while remaining relatively unknown. Once they start smashing them in, people will know, driving the price up, and making the club less willing to sell. Hopefully there are some sloppy clubs around with too low a fee on the release clause of their striker, which they forgot to raise when he suddenly started banging them in. Heres to hoping Fair point, buying a quality striker is going to be difficult unless we loosen the purse strings a bit. The problem is that we have a number of average striker already, so to get a new one he has to be much much better. And you're right, those players cost more money. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 I wonder what the excuses will be next summer, when the likes of Harper, Lovenkrands and Smith will all be off the wage bill. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 I wonder what the excuses will be next summer, when the likes of Harper, Lovenkrands and Smith will all be off the wage bill. Hopefully we won't need any excuses. But at the same time, I can't see us deciding to suddenly spend a lot more. We just have to hope the right player becomes available at a cheap enough price. At the end of the day we were only one player away from a very good transfer window IMO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sugoinufc Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 He might feel his effort is better appreciated elsewhere, though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rainforest Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 At the price point we are looking at, which are approx. 8-12 million pounds, you would be hard-pressed to find players much better than a 1 in 3 ratio.. and that is in a foreign league. Then you have the transitioning to EPL, fitting in etc... Upgrade? Aside from a new name on the sheet and the hype effect, im not sure how much better we would be off tbh... I cant believe im saying this, but the likes of Erdinc, roux, maiga etc - Im actually not sure if they are a straight upgrade from Ba and Best. If we were to get a proper upgrade this window, it would have had to be Gameiro, Gervinho or Cissè tbh. Aside from the lack of ambition we obviously showed by not signing anyone, Im starting to wonder if we are better off just not spending money on Erdinc, Maiga, Roux etc, as Im not actually sure if they are better than Ba or Best. Im expecting some abuse for this post. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 He should have kept his mouth shut I've never ever seen a statement from a chairman explain transfer window failings. They f***ed up, we knew that. Amateurish once again. Damned if they do, damned if they don't to be honest. Everyone was crying out for a statement, they make one, shouldn't have made a statement. or Everyone was crying for a statement, they don't make one, they get reamed for not making one. Either way they lose. I can't remember seeing anybody crying for a statement although I might have missed them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Im beginning to think that as far as strikers goes, its nigh-on impossible to meet the criteria of our owner. Strikers are the one position where players live and die by their goal/games ratio, the single criteria by which they are judged. I think Carr might be able to find "purchasable bargains" in any other position, but when it comes to strikers, there just isnt any strikers around banging in goals while remaining relatively unknown. Once they start smashing them in, people will know, driving the price up, and making the club less willing to sell. Hopefully there are some sloppy clubs around with too low a fee on the release clause of their striker, which they forgot to raise when he suddenly started banging them in. Heres to hoping Yup, and the thing is as well though, even if they have a low release clause, or were in the last year of a contract and so were available for a good fee, the likely competition from other clubs would drive up the price anyway. So you would still have to pay more if competing with other clubs, be it regarding the transfer fee itself, or the wages the player would then start commanding. The only way you get a good deal with these kind of strikers is by taking bigger risks. i.e. looking at goalscorers in the smaller leagues, and trying to determine if their abilities would translate to the prem. The fact that they couldn't even at least have some of these types of options is disgraceful. Someone like Mohammed Bangoura who has just joined celtic after being recommended by Larsson, or even Shane Long from the Championship. These guys both cost less than £5 million, why not try someone like that. Long look sideal already. The season before Man U signed Hernandez for £6million. Why not look at South America, if you want to be cheap about it? Look at the striker Everton brought in. Hasn't cost them much, but his record is really good in South America, at least they're trying to do something. Not enough effort. They had to have had more options, and tried to do more, regardless of how much they were willing to spend. They need to step it up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 I think you've hit on the basic problem, just getting a player who's far enough above the ones we already have, while not spending much money on his transfer fee. It's a tough one to be sure. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashley17 Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Plan A: Gameiro, Gervinho, Ba Plan B: GOALKEEPERS Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rainforest Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 The entire European market is pretty much scouted the shit out of already. Any striker capable of banging in 15-20 goals will have a premium price tag, especially with clubs like PSG City and the like having virtually limitless amounts of cash. I think we should have a look in south america as well. Shit, look at Hernandez, I imagine the ITK`s down there will know of equal talents or even bigger ones. Im actually fine with not buying overpriced continental strikers, as long as we explore other options.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Hernandez is from central america. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxfree Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 The entire European market is pretty much scouted the s*** out of already. Any striker capable of banging in 15-20 goals will have a premium price tag, especially with clubs like PSG City and the like having virtually limitless amounts of cash. I think we should have a look in south america as well. s***, look at Hernandez, I imagine the ITK`s down there will know of equal talents or even bigger ones. Im actually fine with not buying overpriced continental strikers, as long as we explore other options.. "Expensive" and difficulties with work permits etc. Won't happen (unfortunately). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 I'm not having it being classed as North America btw. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxfree Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Hernandez is from central america. Officially North America... I'm with you though. Edit: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 The entire European market is pretty much scouted the s*** out of already. Any striker capable of banging in 15-20 goals will have a premium price tag, especially with clubs like PSG City and the like having virtually limitless amounts of cash. I think we should have a look in south america as well. s***, look at Hernandez, I imagine the ITK`s down there will know of equal talents or even bigger ones. Im actually fine with not buying overpriced continental strikers, as long as we explore other options.. "Expensive" and difficulties with work permits etc. Won't happen (unfortunately). I'm sure they're not all expensive, and they don't all have difficulties with work permits! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sicko2ndbest Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Pardews silence is still deafening I reckon he is well fucked off! However,it is a fact that he will tow the party line and won't criticise the owners Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Yup, reckon Pardew was just as desperate to have his socks blown off, but has instead blown his lid. Think the guy is fuming right now too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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