Wullie Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Ryan Taylor took a corner at 1-0 up and we had four players in their box. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dinho lad Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 have we thrashed anyone under pardew yet? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Hated Souness. If we're here at the same time next year and not making progress I'll be unhappy. We've had good results and played some good football. In our 2nd season back in the Premier League I'd say things are going very well. Very easy to stick the boot in on Pardew after a tough month but he's doing a good job. I remembered you having strong views on him. I don't see the good job that Pardew is doing, he's starting to look like a one dimensional manager who is looking out of his depth. Our results have been better than expected but our quality of football has been poor except for a few games, we've played more bad than good and a lot of games where we've come out of them with more than we have deserved. He's been lucky and he's lived off that, when things aren't going our way he's got no answer to what is going wrong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Logic Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Ryan Taylor took a corner at 1-0 up and we had four players in their box. Generally, most times. I didn't ask if anyone could prove me wrong in a single instance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
plenum Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 The interview with Pardew , what a complete load of bollocks. The man does not give a fuck about NUFC, he's purely a "professional" doing his job, or at least half trying to do his job. FFS it's cockney mafia vibes this shit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hughesy Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Can't really reply at length to HTT or Wullie's posts as on Blackberry (and on holiday - this hasn't helped my mood), but there is some fantastic revisionist history going on about Hughton's reign. I can remember many a match under Hughton where we were bloody awful, certainly as bad as anything served up by Pardew (blackpool, west brom, bolton???). Some of the examples given are questionable as well. Not sure why any matches in the Championship should even be considered for obvious reasons. Villa - we played a Villa team without a manager and they could have been out of sight in the first few mins we were that bad. Lucky Carew took that penalty. Arsenal - but for Krul's brilliance we would have lost that. Good backs to the wall performance, but not a tactical masterclass in any way. Rose tinted glasses on that performance or you didn't see it. I'd also love to know what this ideology you think we had under hughton... Anyway - genuinely can't be arsed debating Pardew anymore on here. If you spole to any non-NUFC fan and told them that there were a significant proportion of people advocating his sacking they would think you were mental. Unbelievable stuff. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERTOON Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Does it matter what we where like under Hughton, we play utter terrible football under Pardew. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Venkman Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Let's just stop talking about Hughton? There's huge question marks over Pardew and what we do going forward, Hughton's the past. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 We are top 6 in the main thanks for Ba's goals and the individual performances of Krul and Colo. Of course Pardew deserves credit but I'd say he deserves less than the likes of Ba, Krul et al. His input in our season is similar to R.Taylor's. He's contributed but not starred. Our tactics are all wrong, at the start of a game, during the game and especially when the opposition start to nulify us and attack us. We simply drop back, revert to hoof and end up with no real shape. His team selections are often baffling and his use of subs almost always wrong. He helped instill a very good team-spirit and a very good work-ethic and earlier on in the season we were defensively very strong which he deserves a lot of credit for and this has helped us to make a good start to the season and to get into a really good psoition in the league. But good team spirit and work ethic will only take you so far as does individual performances from star players but star players need direction, they need to play in a system that helps them. This isn't happening. Pumping long ball after long ball up to Ba is not what he needs or wants. How are we meant to dominate a side when the area that achieves this - the midfield - are constantly being bypassed by long balls or restricted due to a flat and unballanced set-up? Our tactics are so hopeless and dumb its embarrassing and is costing us and will if we persist, end up costing us big time. We have as much chance of finishing mid-table as we do a European spot and forget about 4th. A position we could actually finish in if we did play better football. Been trying to work out what happened there myself. Don't think it's as simple as Wilko for Saylor, but Santon's forward play certainly has Colo pulled out to the wings more than I would like. It really is Willo for Saylor like. Saylor's Bramble-esque with the mistakes no doubt about it. But he can be a colossus at times. He's faster, stronger and better in the air than Willo (and Colo too tbf) but crucially, he's a pretty good footballer like. He's not afraid to have the ball at his feet and he naturally plays short passes. Mike & Danny are shit scared of the ball and it has a huge overall detriment to the team. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElDiablo Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Think his main mistake was to drop Guthrie today, a) because it would have been a big knock to his confidence and b) because it's too big of an ask, in my opinion for Cabaye and Tiote to come back in having not played in the side, or together, for a long run of games. Guthrie has been in the side, knows his job, and has played well. Poor decision, probably should have left Cabaye on the bench. That probably cost us a bit of the initiative. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 His team is built on being very narrow and tight and all banks of four are very straight and well ordered. We could get away with it if we had steven taylor but we look a shambles defensively with Williamson and Simpson. he's become extremely scared of other teams counterring us since chelsea did in december but in fact since then we hvave done far worse and the hoof ball has increased (norwich, fulham, spurs). The stranget hign is I don't remember us playing quite this ugly last season. it's a strange set up really. he wants everyone pressing and filling back in high up the pitch and quickly reorganising into very rigid lines. he has no idea how to utilise cabaye or ben arfa. --full back--deep centre half--ball playing centre half--full back --defensive wide man--box to box cm--stopper--defensive wide man-- ------------------------deep forward----poacher-------------------- There's no room for flair because it won't allow the rigid side of our game to work. Cabaye's been adjusted to just be a constant runner and tbf he can do it because of his sheer stamina but he's wasted imo. I'm not sure he's that tactically strong, he knows how to be a tough immobile unit that is hard to break through the middle and poor full backs are backed up by strong defensive wingers but in terms of possession play and movement he has no clue. He either just hopes Cabaye, Jonas, Ba (Hatem when he plays) already have a good enough footballing knowledge to do it without instruction or he genuinely believes the best method is to stop them penetrating us and hitting it towards Ba/player capable of magic. I really hope he has some new formation or plan lined up but I doubt it. My best hope is we manage to sneak 6th come the end of the season and he has pre season to attract some better technical players and rethinks his strategy- hopefully moulding a specific role for Ben Arfa. This post needs more love. Good tactical insight. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Oh come on HTT and Wullie would never get satisfied unless we win the league. I am serious, not being sarcastic. So to argue who is better manager with them is pretty non-sense. SBR is a minimum benchmark. Mourinho would be appropriate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Logic Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Just seen the interview. FFS. Does he really believe it was a big improvement on Spurs? Looked pretty much the same to me only this time we weren't playing Spurs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jagten Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Think he has been made to look good by our brilliant scouting network. Doesn't deserve the credit he gets. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Just seen the interview. FFS. Does he really believe it was a big improvement on Spurs? Looked pretty much the same to me only this time we weren't playing Spurs. There was a moment when the camera caught him shaking his head. I genuinely felt sorry for him. The games gone Alan. It's gone mate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Hughton's team could smell blood when we took the lead and it was f***ing fantastic to watch. Some of the wins at the back end of the Championship and against Villa and on Hallowe'en were champagne stuff. Today should have been 5 or 6 nil. I'm not one for glorifying Hughton's tenure but this was truly the best part of his time. When teams where there to be beaten, he wouldn't hold the players back. Today we let Wolves into it for no reason. It took 30 minutes of submissive play from us and a jammy goal to get them really going. Had we come out in the second half, dominated for the opening 15 minutes and not conceded (or scored) Wolves would've gone back into their shell and the game would've been over. "Defensive tilt" is Pardew's predisposition. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Memphis Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 "But for us I'm not overly disappointed. It could be a lot worse. After Spurs we needed to just get ourselves back to something like our normal selves, which we were today. But we still should have won." Staggering quote. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiresias Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dontooner Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 His team is built on being very narrow and tight and all banks of four are very straight and well ordered. We could get away with it if we had steven taylor but we look a shambles defensively with Williamson and Simpson. he's become extremely scared of other teams counterring us since chelsea did in december but in fact since then we hvave done far worse and the hoof ball has increased (norwich, fulham, spurs). The stranget hign is I don't remember us playing quite this ugly last season. it's a strange set up really. he wants everyone pressing and filling back in high up the pitch and quickly reorganising into very rigid lines. he has no idea how to utilise cabaye or ben arfa. --full back--deep centre half--ball playing centre half--full back --defensive wide man--box to box cm--stopper--defensive wide man-- ------------------------deep forward----poacher-------------------- There's no room for flair because it won't allow the rigid side of our game to work. Cabaye's been adjusted to just be a constant runner and tbf he can do it because of his sheer stamina but he's wasted imo. I'm not sure he's that tactically strong, he knows how to be a tough immobile unit that is hard to break through the middle and poor full backs are backed up by strong defensive wingers but in terms of possession play and movement he has no clue. He either just hopes Cabaye, Jonas, Ba (Hatem when he plays) already have a good enough footballing knowledge to do it without instruction or he genuinely believes the best method is to stop them penetrating us and hitting it towards Ba/player capable of magic. I really hope he has some new formation or plan lined up but I doubt it. My best hope is we manage to sneak 6th come the end of the season and he has pre season to attract some better technical players and rethinks his strategy- hopefully moulding a specific role for Ben Arfa. Good Analysis and read on his formation and tactics. 100% spot on with how he sets his team to play in each role hence flair players just would not work in his formation. If you want to see better footy or winning like we deserved it there must be a comprise in the formation and role of the players. If this cant be change either we continue the same or we need to change a Manager that is proven and better. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Can't really reply at length to HTT or Wullie's posts as on Blackberry (and on holiday - this hasn't helped my mood), but there is some fantastic revisionist history going on about Hughton's reign. I can remember many a match under Hughton where we were bloody awful, certainly as bad as anything served up by Pardew (blackpool, west brom, bolton???). Some of the examples given are questionable as well. Not sure why any matches in the Championship should even be considered for obvious reasons. Villa - we played a Villa team without a manager and they could have been out of sight in the first few mins we were that bad. Lucky Carew took that penalty. Arsenal - but for Krul's brilliance we would have lost that. Good backs to the wall performance, but not a tactical masterclass in any way. Rose tinted glasses on that performance or you didn't see it. I'd also love to know what this ideology you think we had under hughton... Anyway - genuinely can't be arsed debating Pardew anymore on here. If you spole to any non-NUFC fan and told them that there were a significant proportion of people advocating his sacking they would think you were mental. Unbelievable stuff. We did indeed put in many a poor performance under Hughton but you could still see a gameplan, that we at least went out to play football. At home to Stoke for example, we were probably too attacking. We created many chances in that game. As for matches in the Championship, of course they should be considered. A performance is a performance regardless of who the opposition is or the level. Performances are indicators of potential and what kind of level you are at or could achieve. The performances from that Championship season suggested we could cope in the Premier league and indeed survive. As it was, we did more than that and got ourselves into a very comfortable mid-table position prior to his departure. A position that wasn't really improved on by the way and a position this current side could easily slip back into if we are not careful. As for Villa, they started the season well under their caretaker manager and Brummie will tell you himself, they were playing good stuff. We stuffed them though, they couldn't cope, we were at them from the off and kept going. It could have been even more in the end. The same happened against the mackems. Sacking sounds bad, I don't want him sacked in the sense Hughton was sacked, I want him upgraded basically. We can do better, ought to look for better, just as we look at Simpson and think, yep, we must improve and can. Back to performances, we played better under Hughton than we have done under Pardew, without a doubt. Our football under this fool is Sam Allardyce esque or Souness at times. QPR away this season was on a par with Fulham away under Big Sam. Only we won that game. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 Logic, I was agreeing with you re: the corner. Four players in the box for a corner is ridiculous, we were outnumbered more than 2 to 1. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 have we thrashed anyone under pardew yet? Wham. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bimpy474 Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 "But for us I'm not overly disappointed. It could be a lot worse. After Spurs we needed to just get ourselves back to something like our normal selves, which we were today. But we still should have won." Staggering quote. Thats actually quite worrying, if he sees it like that then he is blinder than Captain Blind on the shortsighted sailing ship The HMS Blind. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 He's also pleased for Wolves' manager. Staggering. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beren Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 have we thrashed anyone under pardew yet? Wham. They caught hell for disobeying his order to sit on a goal two lead. Spelled the end for Lovenkrands. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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