midds Posted March 12, 2023 Share Posted March 12, 2023 Umpire's call decision. If the ref gives it on the field then VAR aren't overturning it, he didn't give it and there wasn't enough to overturn it. Luckily it went for us today but we couldn't really have complained if he'd given the pen tbh. If that's Sa clipping Isak in the other box we're screaming for a pen Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
geordiesteve710 Posted March 12, 2023 Share Posted March 12, 2023 He didn't get much right today at all this prat. Thought we got the benefit more often than not as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miercoles Posted March 12, 2023 Share Posted March 12, 2023 Amazed it wasn't given, but I also think it's fair not to. There is contact but you can also see the Wolves player take a horribly heavy touch and decide to go down. He would have had a lot to do just to catch up to the ball if he doesn't go down there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Posted March 12, 2023 Share Posted March 12, 2023 8 minutes ago, Miercoles said: Amazed it wasn't given, but I also think it's fair not to. There is contact but you can also see the Wolves player take a horribly heavy touch and decide to go down. He would have had a lot to do just to catch up to the ball if he doesn't go down there. Please, please watch it again. Jimenez has tried to con the ref (and has been successful with you) that he has been fouled. I used to play centre forward and probably would have done similar (cough). Jimenez has actually fouled Pope. Trust me, I have exhausted my reasonings on another thread. No pen, foul on Pope. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miercoles Posted March 12, 2023 Share Posted March 12, 2023 (edited) I don't think it was a foul, I think it was a dive. I'm just surprised the ref didn't give it. Maybe because it's Wolves. Edited March 12, 2023 by Miercoles Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 Did anyone see the Bella-Kotchap incident? I said no pen at the time but the more I see it the more I'm doubting my original opinion. I'm totally confused as to what the handball rules are now. I thought if a defender handles the ball in the box from an attacking play it was a penalty and likewise if the attacker handles it's a free out. https://www.skysports.com/watch/video/sports/football/12832424/were-man-utd-denied-a-penalty-against-southampton Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingArthur Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 It is a clear red for Pope and penalty. Jimenez is 100% scoring that and it is a clumsy collission, but still denying a goal scoring opportunity. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 36 minutes ago, KingArthur said: It is a clear red for Pope and penalty. Jimenez is 100% scoring that and it is a clumsy collission, but still denying a goal scoring opportunity. Don’t agree at all, it’s at the very least debatable. Raul scoops the ball and dives in one motion, the contact with Pope is after he’s already in the air. Also, the touch is quite bad and he may not have got to the ball anyway. Really don’t understand this desire to give game-changing penalties for very questionable stuff, it’s like people are just gagging for the drama no matter how much it ruins the game. Obviously I expected it to be given like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
geordie_b Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 Jimenez goes down because he spreads his legs wide out. The contact from Pope did not cause this It was a dive (like Gerrard did throughout his career), he was expecting more contact and thats why he didnt appeal Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prophet Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 1 hour ago, KingArthur said: It is a clear red for Pope and penalty. Jimenez is 100% scoring that and it is a clumsy collission, but still denying a goal scoring opportunity. I can see both sides of the argument on this one, it's anything but clear. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack j Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 A far worse decision than the Pope one was rashford not being booked for that dive. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prophet Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 It's poor from Pope, first the touch, then the clumsiness. At the same time Jimenez adjust his run and stops in an attempt to initiate contact. Personally, I thought the ref just about got it right, but it's just one of those where you're furious if it's given against you, but you'd always want it given in your favour. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 I don't think I would want it if one of my players did that TBH, attackers shouldn't be able to initiate contact and deliberately dive. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Butcher Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 The more I see it the more I think Jimenez should've been booked for diving. Open goal and he throws himself into Pope. No wonder he hasn't scored in a year. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Icarus Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 (edited) The more I watch it the more obvious it is that it's an absolutely stonewall penalty tbh. Jimenez does turn but in real-time it's irrelevant really, he shouldn't be penalised for bracing for impact. Madley is an atrocious referee like, but VAR should be intervening there. Pope and we were very lucky. If that's the other way around everyone on here is saying it's a clear and obvious pen. Edited March 13, 2023 by Kid Icarus Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 (edited) He's not bracing for impact like, that's incredibly generous The fact there are so many people on both sides shows that the ref was within his rights and VAR were correct not to overrule him. It's subjective at the end of the day, there's never going to be a definitive answer. Edited March 13, 2023 by AyeDubbleYoo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 It looks like a stonewall penalty from a couple of angles, then from others it looks like Jimenez has made a meal of it. It's very close. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Icarus Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 10 minutes ago, AyeDubbleYoo said: He's not bracing for impact like, that's incredibly generous The fact there are so many people on both sides shows that the ref was within his rights and VAR were correct not to overrule him. It's subjective at the end of the day, there's never going to be a definitive answer. Not at all if you watch it in real-time. There are people on both sides within our support - very different. Among the unbiased it's almost unanimous from what I've seen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cf Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 I can see why it wasn't given in real time. Ref is miles away. The argument for it it not being a penalty I guess is that Jiminez's touch was also bad. He's not nicked the ball off Pope he's kicked it away and not even really towards the goal. It means he's running across Pope which causes him to go into him. If it was given I'd have no arguments but the fact there's discussion means I think stick with on-field decision. Refs should perhaps be a bit more forthright in saying to the VAR "I was miles away - what do you think?". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 If it was given I would be saying it was extremely soft. The bar needs to be much higher, and fans should be calling for that. You can't be awarding free goals for stuff that's this soft/debatable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 I would like something like "has Nick Pope fouled Raul Jimenez to stop him getting the ball, and was Jimenez trying his best to continue and score". No? OK, move on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinkeye Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 We were actually really lucky, for the record it was not a penalty - I watched it a couple of times and the only contact was from Jimenez on Pope. The reason I say we were lucky was that the Linesman on that side went to flag a foul and then stopped himself. I think if the on-field officials had given it then it might not have been overturned by VAR. Popes touch was rotten though, it should never have been a decision to make. I can forgive him that one considering the 2 or 3 amazing saves he made later in the game. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 It's a blatant foul imo. I don't think you need to really get into analysing Jiminez' actions on whether he made the most of it or not when it's very clear Pope fouls him there regardless. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sempiternal Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 31 minutes ago, The Butcher said: The more I see it the more I think Jimenez should've been booked for diving. Open goal and he throws himself into Pope. No wonder he hasn't scored in a year. Personally think he knew he had lost the touch as it was so bad and just went to buy the foul. He barely appealed it iirc, certainly not vociferously Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsunami Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 (edited) With the “high bar” for clear and obvious then either way VAR weren’t going to overturn the onfield decision. Jimenez knew what he was doing but so did Pope. Most referees would have given a penalty and sent Pope off. Edited March 13, 2023 by Tsunami Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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