Jonjo Shelvey (now playing for Çaykur Rizespor, on loan from Nottingham Forest)

[gbandit]

Got to hand it to you Outremont, you came in with some tough competition but I think you might be the worst poster on here now. Credit where credit’s due 

[Outremont]

4 minutes ago, gbandit said:

Got to hand it to you Outremont, you came in with some tough competition but I think you might be the worst poster on here now. Credit where credit’s due 

Seems like to be accepted here you need to go with popular opinion, practice the art of groupthink, like sheep. How dare someone present an alternate point of view!
 

Yeah, I’m good doing my thing.

[Guest reefatoon]

Smells like a former poster.

[Kid Icarus]

People are far too willing to let these things become cop-out replacements for actual systemic change. No denying it's had a big impact and I have no issue with anyone taking the knee, but I do find it crazy how quickly it's gone from:

 

Colin Kaepernick risking and losing a lot in a stand against racially motivated police brutality, on his own, largely against the establishment, and it being a huge talking point.

 

to

 

It being co-opted by inherently racist companies and an establishment that only want to use it for PR, it being expanded to 'all forms of discrimination', and it now being diluted to the point where it's becoming a solely symbolic gesture that's getting closer and closer to having about as much impact as Kick Racism out of Football.

[Kid Icarus]

14 minutes ago, Outremont said:

Seems like to be accepted here you need to go with popular opinion, practice the art of groupthink, like sheep. How dare someone present an alternate point of view!
 

Yeah, I’m good doing my thing.

 

Using groupthink, sheep and  'virtue signalling' like you learned of them through independent thought and not through...

 

 

groupthink and being a sheep.

[Happinesstan]

Just now, Kid Icarus said:

People are far too willing to let these things become cop-out replacements for actual systemic change. No denying it's had a big impact and I have no issue with anyone taking the knee, but I do find it crazy how quickly it's gone from:

 

Colin Kaepernick risking and losing a lot in a stand against racially motivated police brutality, on his own, largely against the establishment, and it being a huge talking point.

 

to

 

It being co-opted by inherently racist companies and an establishment that only want to use it for PR, it being expanded to 'all forms of discrimination', and it now being diluted to the point where it's becoming a solely symbolic gesture that's getting closer and closer to having about as much impact as Kick Racism out of Football.

 Massive respect for Kaepernick's actions against systemic racism. Was a perfect protest in the context of American Football. The adoption by ruling bodies around the world as a mere gesture is [I don't know, worrying?]. Especially when none of them are asked to partake. Did FIFA officials all take a knee before the World Cup draw? I doubt it [apologies if they did], so they're sending the players out to do their work in the community for them.

[Outremont]

3 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said:

 

Using groupthink, sheep and  'virtue signalling' like you learned of them through independent thought and not through...

 

 

groupthink and being a sheep.

Ummm… So basically anything we learn ever, from school to university and beyond is simply mainstream, lazy and non-divergent?
 

Lol.  
 

 

[Abacus]

It's good that our only skinhead didn't take the knee.

[Kid Icarus]

Just now, Outremont said:

Ummm… So basically anything we learn ever, from school to university and beyond is simply mainstream, lazy and non-divergent?
 

Lol.  
 

 

Of course not, but howeh man, you must know that there's a stereotype attached to people who come out with things like groupthink, sheep/sheeple, virtue signalling, etc? And that it's not because they're free, independent thinkers or anything, but because they don't realise they're just from a different heard of sheep.

[Abacus]

But in seriousness, it should be a personal choice for all players.

 

Thought Shelvey had an OK game yesterday. Drifted in and out of the game a bit, but a few telling balls and he's stopped being the liability I thought he was even a few months ago.

 

See also: Emile Krafth.

[Outremont]

4 minutes ago, Abacus said:

But in seriousness, it should be a personal choice for all players.

 

Thought Shelvey had an OK game yesterday. Drifted in and out of the game a bit, but a few telling balls and he's stopped being the liability I thought he was even a few months ago.

 

See also: Emile Krafth.

Agree. I thought he was good. Better than the Wolves game. Composed and generally involved in the best attacking moves. 

[Happinesstan]

15 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said:

Of course not, but howeh man, you must know that there's a stereotype attached to people who come out with things like groupthink, sheep/sheeple, virtue signalling, etc? And that it's not because they're free, independent thinkers or anything, but because they don't realise they're just from a different heard of sheep.

Are you saying independent thought is impossible? I hope you don't truly believe that.

[Theregulars]

I thought he was just stretching. He like bowed down while doing a hamstring stretch. I think he normally takes the knee - we’d have probably noticed by now. 

[Amir_9]

1 hour ago, Outremont said:

Does it matter? I don’t blame him. It’s a virtue signalling gesture. More meaningful and practical things to do than this. 

 

I'm sure there are, but it never ceases to amuse me how something so simple and quick, which is enough to get the message and trigger the conversation in kids/tomorrow's generation is beeeewed and mostly put through mental gymnastics by people who have never been through racism. 

 

As for the ones who have been on the receiving end of racism who don't want to do it, they seem under the impression that taking a knee will stop racism on its own or something.

 

Luckily most who do this 'virtue signalling gesture' still see the point and the ever hard working racism ending pioneers of all that is right and fair lot have stopped booing. I'm not white, but if I took a knee I'd also take it for anyone, including a white individual fwiw and I'd not accept or condone any racism towards them either. Even those who fly "all lives matter" planes. 

 

 

Edited April 18, 2022 by Amir_9

[Guest reefatoon]

13 minutes ago, Theregulars said:

I thought he was just stretching. He like bowed down while doing a hamstring stretch. I think he normally takes the knee - we’d have probably noticed by now. 

Its quite funny how he does it. Like I said earlier, he sort of squats like an old codger with knackered knees who doesn’t dare go down on them as they won’t get back up.

[Happinesstan]

Disgusted by the booing, instigated by a media hell bent on preserving the right to be an abhorrent cunt a free press. I remember when Willock's parents came to St. James' first time after he signed permanently, they were loving it, then the knee prompted the boos, which I can't help feeling dampened their experience. And I like to believe that without that moment, they would have not experienced anything as uncomfortable.

I think it should be a choice of the players, but their choice will always be defined by the racist element, and that undermines the cause.

[mofo]

3 hours ago, Outremont said:

Does it matter? I don’t blame him. It’s a virtue signalling gesture. More meaningful and practical things to do than this. 

Doesn't matter to me, I was just wondering.. 

[Guest HTT II]

I’ve no problem with players not taking the knee and no problem with players taking the knee, I do have a problem with those that boo players taking the knee and those that get angry if players don’t, however.

 

Racists will always be racist, for me it’s now about educating our kids for their generation like MLK educated the masses when he was fighting racism, and everyone else who campaigned too before, during, since and after.
 

It worked, but not 100% and if taking the knee helps towards fighting racism even a little bit, so be it, and long may it continue. Sadly as with everything in life, a lot of organisations adopt things for sheer bandwagon jumping purposes, or to be seen to be doing good or for their own selfish self preservation when most organisations are the antithesis of such endeavours. 
 

If you want to find true racism in its most ugliest and destructive form, it’s not at football match, in a pub or say the streets of Benwell, it’s in the corridors of power. No-one is born racist or with hate or bigotry, they are conditioned to it and the only effective way to fight racism, is to say no to it. If you boo taking the knee you’re a racist, otherwise why would you? If you disagree with taking the knee, you’re entitled to that, but you’re a fucking idiot because again, why wouldn’t you not agree with saying NO TO RACISM? 

[Super Duper Branko Strupar]

4 hours ago, Outremont said:

Seems like to be accepted here you need to go with popular opinion, practice the art of groupthink, like sheep. How dare someone present an alternate point of view!
 

Yeah, I’m good doing my thing.

 

 How many Facebook groups are you a part of?

[Guest HTT II]

1 minute ago, Super Duper Branko Strupar said:

 

 How many Facebook groups are you a part of?

Ones with white backgrounds?

[Disco]

 

[Guest]

Must be intentional as he didn’t take the knee today either.

[54]

 

[toon25]

Improved massively under a decent standard of coaching, but I'd love to see him replaced as a regular starter

[Tiresias]

Yes, though I do worry he might not have the mentality to be a squad player rather than an instant starter. Sulked a fair bit about Rafa dropping him and when he did get a game wasn't at his best at all. I hope we upgrade him, and if he has the right mentality would be happy for him to be in squad, but might be sensible to see if can get some money for him too.