C*CK P*SS P*RDEW

[Altamullan]

Every employer in the UK, who works with or may come into to contact with children or vulnerable adults, have safeguarding procedures. Whilst the content may vary, they will all have at their core a fundamental rule that you communicate the concerns. Doing nothing isn’t an option. I don’t know whether the club would have had safeguarding procedures, and mandated staff training, at that time. They, and all other football clubs, do now.

[SEMTEX]

So hans is a nonce-apologist as well now? I wish I could say I was surprised. Might report him to my boss.

[mrmojorisin75]

 

If you hear allegations that someone is a nonce you’re not going to immediately run to the police without evidence.

 

What are abuse victims supposed to do? They rarely have any kind of evidence.

 

You'd think he'd at least have not let the dude be around kids until it was resolved. But he didn't do anything about it.

 

one thing i'm sure we can all agree on is that carver should never have been put in a position to deal with something of that nature in the first place, he's not got the intelligence or training for it, and everything we know about carver tells us that he's dealt with it exactly as i would have expected him to, i.e. badly/not at all

[Darth Crooks]

Title only says he failed to act and he did.

[Beren]

I know it’s not a laughing matter, but you really couldn’t look like any more of a pedophile if you tried:

 

 

FFS

[Guest firetotheworks]

I know it’s not a laughing matter, but you really couldn’t look like any more of a pedophile if you tried:

 

There's only one possible addition.

 

 

 

 

Wanted a shoe for running:

 

width=600http://img.wolverineworldwide.com/is/image/WolverineWorldWide/MRL-W06525-052113?op_usm=0.5,1&wid=1012&hei=554&qlt=70&fmt=jpg&extend=0,0,0,0[/img]

 

...away from Dark Justice?

 

 

 

[Guest firetotheworks]

As an aside, I've never known anything like it for some posters on here using these situations as a vehicle for proper falling over themselves to show off about being bog-standard, basically decent human beings like.

 

[TheHoob]

I know it’s not a laughing matter, but you really couldn’t look like any more of a pedophile if you tried:

 

 

he's still no backpack nonce mind.

[Guest neesy111]

Zero excuse for Carver to not even follow it up with further lines of enquiry to start with.

[Big Geordie]

If someone came to me in my job (as a support worker) and made allegations against someone I knew or worked with, it’s your personal duty to report and escalate it up the chain of command. If it transpired that I knew and said nout - I’d be sacked. Carver is a prick.

[Jimburst]

Aye, no excuses tbh. It's probably more about the culture and the lack of awareness people had about stuff like this back then, especially someone like John Carver, but these days I would hope most of us wouldn't hesitate.

 

Even if he was your mate, you'd bring it up with him and smack him or something ffs. He's sexually abusing kids.

[Hanshithispantz]

Title only says he failed to act and he did.

Even the Guardian goes with "did not take action on abuse claims right away" instead of "failed to act" man. Although "gives evidence in nonce trial" also works. He's also talking about things that happened 20 year ago, I doubt even he has a decent memory of how it went down.

 

It's not even the title really anyway tbh, I think Carver is a total cunt but I think it needed pointing out that this is actually probably not heinous behaviour and that there's evidence this kind of reaction is pretty common. I think it's canny harsh to demonised him over it.

[LFEE]

Carver and Ormand were at the same Montagu Boys Club for a few years when Carver was a youngster and Ormand was a coach.

 

Carver used to wear a Wolves top at the time as they were the team he supported as a boy.

[Hanshithispantz]

If someone came to me in my job (as a support worker) and made allegations against someone I knew or worked with, it’s your personal duty to report and escalate it up the chain of command. If it transpired that I knew and said nout - I’d be sacked. Carver is a prick.

You've probably received better 'training' like. I might not be giving the 90s enough credit but I would hope the entire system around youth players is different now.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

It’s inexcusable, but we have to remember the era and times where this thing wasn’t something talked about, back then it was a culture of mates and lads at a football club so while again it inexcusable from Carver because if it was me I’d have went to the club or whatever and said something, but he shouldn’t be condemned now all these years later. I can’t stand the bloke, but by all accounts he’s a canny enough fella when he’s not licking windows, offering fans on and masterminding defeat after defeat.

[Guest ElCid]

Carver and Ormand were at the same Montagu Boys Club for a few years when Carver was a youngster and Ormand was a coach.

 

Carver used to wear a Wolves top at the time as they were the team he supported as a boy.

 

Your right I know

[Darth Crooks]

Title only says he failed to act and he did.

Even the Guardian goes with "did not take action on abuse claims right away" instead of "failed to act" man. Although "gives evidence in nonce trial" also works. He's also talking about things that happened 20 year ago, I doubt even he has a decent memory of how it went down.

 

It's not even the title really anyway tbh, I think Carver is a total cunt but I think it needed pointing out that this is actually probably not heinous behaviour and that there's evidence this kind of reaction is pretty common. I think it's canny harsh to demonised him over it.

 

Well I understand where you're coming from but it just seems to underline further to me he's just useless and lacks professionalism or adequate common sense. I think most people will stop short of accusing him of some kind of support for Ormand's actions.

[mrmojorisin75]

If someone came to me in my job (as a support worker) and made allegations against someone I knew or worked with, it’s your personal duty to report and escalate it up the chain of command. If it transpired that I knew and said nout - I’d be sacked. Carver is a prick.

You've probably received better 'training' like. I might not be giving the 90s enough credit but I would hope the entire system around youth players is different now.

 

for once i'm in agreement with hans like, i simply wouldn't have expected anything else of the likes of carver...doesn't make his inaction right or whatever but it's 100% the reaction i'd have expected

[Hanshithispantz]

Point out a single straw man.

 

I have no clue how I would react as I've never been in that situation - I can just picture how difficult it would be and how easy it would be to be in denial about it. Without evidence and (I'm just assuming here) without the proper knowledge about how to deal with these situations I imagine it's a lot easier to theorise about what you would do rather than do what you would actually wish you would do.

 

The 'ruse' bit is weird but then we don't really know the full info on any of this, there isn't a great deal in the article.

[mrmojorisin75]

carver's also a thick cunt who probably knew he was in a position he had no right to be in, people in those spots will never rock the boat, ever

 

doesn't excuse him but blame the people who put him there just as much imo

[James]

Call me bitter but if I was a billionaire in a position to buy the club, the first thing I would literally do is write a lengthy club statement about how Pardew and Carver bought the club into disrepute and issue them both with life bans.

 

Then I would invite Jonas to host a fundraising match at SJP.

 

Only then would I talk to Rafa about the current playing side.

[Hanshithispantz]

If you hear allergations that someone is a nonce you’re not going to immediately run to the police without evidence.

 

Literally no one suggested this?  Also you're acting like this his best mate, it's not. He knew him socially. Also I don't think it is that difficult to imagine how you would react. At the literal very very least, you ask the guy. And that's the minimum. There were regulations in the late 90s. it wasn't some wild west free for all nonce-a-thon.

 

If carver was such good mates with him, he obviously felt there was some truth in it as he wanted to get him out of the club.

 

I mean atleast try not to straw man my in a post accusing me of straw manning other people man, howay

 

It being 20 year ago isn't irrelevant like. I don't know what systems were in place at the club back then but I imagine they've improved a lot since - as has working with children in general. I'm assuming Carver wasn't fully trained in how to deal with this kind of thing but I might be wrong.

 

The article says he 'took part' in a ruse I think. It's canny vague what happened, but it reads like a group within the club had been made aware of the allegations and thought that was the best course of action was to get him out. It sounds thick as fuck but again we don't really know the full details - it's all a bit vague.

 

In any case I don't really care, I was mortal when I wrote my initial posts and have no real desire to continue arguing my point now

 

I do think people are being too harsh on him given the little we know though.

[Happinesstan]

Don't know about the 90s but when I was a kid in the 80s, we had a well known nonce that we were told to avoid. We used to seek him out and torment him, until he chased us on his motorbike. Times have definitely changed.

[Altamullan]

Part of the reasoning behind the mass implementation of safeguarding policies and procedures was to acknowledge how often suspicions or allegations were being made and not co-ordinated, largely based on findings from health and social care services. A significant part of this is how hard it can be for colleagues/friends/family to believe that someone known to them was harming children. Whilst I am not excusing Carver’s presumed lack of action, it was unfortunately a common occurrence. Therefore the era it happened in does provide context.

[Deuce]

As an aside, I've never known anything like it for some posters on here using these situations as a vehicle for proper falling over themselves to show off about being bog-standard, basically decent human beings like.