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Greg

by Greg
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Unbelievable

Unbelievable

Posted
Posted

Short's a much worse owner than Ashley is.

 

Least Ashley during a couple of periods has appointed a good manager, short didn't do that once during his tenure.

 

I disagree. For a club of their stature Martin O'Neill, Dick Advocaat, Sam Allardyce and David Moyes are what you would call pretty proven managers. Then you have some out of the box thinking with the likes of Di Canio, Poyet and Grayson who were promising based on their record in the lower leagues.

 

I wouldn't say Ashley's record is much better in this regard. We had Joe fucking Kinnear, Alan Pardew, John Carver and Steve McLaren let's not forget. Apart from that he brought KK back home to much furore and abused him to the point of constructive dismissal within 9 months, gambled on Hughton (success until he fired him because he was siding with his players) and Shearer (failure and another club legend disrespected). Basically his saving grace is Rafa Benitez, who landed on his lap really and is probably only here because he's trying to force a chance of ownership so he can continue work on a project he took a fancie too. If it was for Ashley and without the prospect of a possible takeover he would probably already have walked after being lied too repeatedly.

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morla84

morla84

Posted
Posted

Watched these yesterday for the first time this season, and honestly couldn't believe how bad they were. The amount of crosses that were just bobbling about in their box and not getting dealt with was frightening, keeper clueless, hard to believe they just let someone even worse go. Did create some good chances tho, but don't have anyone to finish them now.

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Stifler

Stifler

Posted
Posted

Short went out and brought in managers who were involved in the game and trusted in the game. Ok they were all PFM’s and one day their bubble would burst, he got unlucky somewhat that pretty much all their bubbles burst at Sunderland.

 

Short is a bad owner because he never did his homework properly and brought the wrong people in who then brought the wrong players and back room staff in.

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Heron

Heron

Posted
Posted

Short went out and brought in managers who were involved in the game and trusted in the game. Ok they were all PFM’s and one day their bubble would burst, he got unlucky somewhat that pretty much all their bubbles burst at Sunderland.

 

Short is a bad owner because he never did his homework properly and brought the wrong people in who then brought the wrong players and back room staff in.

That's what I thought. He was a bit ignorant or didn't do his homework but he's not been owt like Ashley.
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Guest chopey

Guest chopey

Posted
Posted

I think the big difference between us and them is the amount of fans that constantly turn up at Newcastle and I think Ashley would have gone long before now if there were 16000 fans rattling around St James every other week .

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Stifler

Stifler

Posted
Posted

Short went out and brought in managers who were involved in the game and trusted in the game. Ok they were all PFM’s and one day their bubble would burst, he got unlucky somewhat that pretty much all their bubbles burst at Sunderland.

 

Short is a bad owner because he never did his homework properly and brought the wrong people in who then brought the wrong players and back room staff in.

That's what I thought. He was a bit ignorant or didn't do his homework but he's not been owt like Ashley.

Yeah for the most part. One thing you do have to have a go at him for is that for a long time their biggest signings were all loan deals, the sold some players for decent fee’s as well. They are massively in debt now, but the TV money they had coming in and the fact that they never bought a lot of their players means that they should have had a lot more money available to them. Financially they have been ruined, and there is no reason why a team who were in the Premier League for as long as they were should be in the financial position they find themselves in.

Speaking of their finances, it’s long been rumoured that Short is about to cut ties with the club and place them into admistration. If he does then that would result in them being deducted between 10-12 points. As a result some have said that he is waiting until they are safe before he places them into admistration. It’s looking increasingly likely that they won’t get to a point where they are 10-12 points clear of the relegation zone, however if you get a points deduction in or after March then it’s applied for next season instead. It will be interesting to see if the rumours are true and Short will place them into admistration when he can.

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Guest neesy111

Guest neesy111

Posted
Posted

Re: Short being worse than ashley

 

He's left them high and dry (doesn't even come to the UK now) and they are on the way to league 1 with a mental pile of debt and are about to go into administration from what I'm told and have no money for transfers (least Ashley supported us with a £30m loan)  That's a lot worse than what ashley has done to us although we are a bigger club than them, we aren't that much bigger.

 

 

Also I've got family who at ST holders for them, and they've explained that Short's been lucky for seasons that sacking managers kept getting a bounce without any plan to go along with them and he really doesn't care about the club now apart from getting as much money back which will probably mean administration which will affect 100's of local businesses who won't be paid bills etc. 

 

They are both absolutely rotten owners and NE football deserves better, just look at how it is at the moment.  Hartlepool needing to crowd fund £200,000 to keep themselves afloat etc.

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Stifler

Stifler

Posted
Posted

Re: Short being worse than ashley

 

He's left them high and dry (doesn't even come to the UK now) and they are on the way to league 1 with a mental pile of debt and are about to go into administration from what I'm told and have no money for transfers (least Ashley supported us with a £30m loan)  That's a lot worse than what ashley has done to us although we are a bigger club than them, we aren't that much bigger.

 

 

Also I've got family who at ST holders for them, and they've explained that Short's been lucky for seasons that sacking managers kept getting a bounce without any plan to go along with them and he really doesn't care about the club now apart from getting as much money back which will probably mean administration which will affect 100's of local businesses who won't be paid bills etc. 

 

They are both absolutely rotten owners and NE football deserves better, just look at how it is at the moment.  Hartlepool needing to crowd fund £200,000 to keep themselves afloat etc.

Pretty much the nail on the head there. Both clubs have been ran terribly, both clubs deserve better.
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Guest Howaythetoon

Guest Howaythetoon

Posted
Posted

Short is nowhere near as bad as Ashley. He has invested his own money, showed some degree of ambition, but has made some very poor appointments. Had Big Sam stayed, they would be mid-table now or comfortable. I agree both are run by idiots who couldn’t care less and it’s atrocious really. If I had the choice I’d choose Short. Bit like choosing between two types of cancer mind...

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Guest neesy111

Guest neesy111

Posted
Posted

Short is nowhere near as bad as Ashley. He has invested his own money, showed some degree of ambition, but has made some very poor appointments. Had Big Sam stayed, they would be mid-table now or comfortable. I agree both are run by idiots who couldn’t care less and it’s atrocious really. If I had the choice I’d choose Short. Bit like choosing between two types of cancer mind...

 

Look at where sunderland are now though.....  Short's allowed that to happen.

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Kevo

Kevo

Posted
Posted

As if somebody would prefer Short over Ashley  :kasper: Neither are great, but at least Ashley has got us into a decent financial situation.

 

Sunderland are on their arse. They’ve got no money, history of players on high wages, big loan fees, sacking managers for fun, no crowds, free tickets thus no matchday revenue, no value in the squad.

 

Despite having zero ambition, we have a decent wage structure, fairly stable in relation to manager fees over the years, sell out every week, no free tickets = big matchday revenue, most players worth at least £5-10 million.

 

 

 

That’s not saying Ashley is good, mind. But we are streets ahead of them lot. Praying for another relegation and them to rot in League One for a few years.

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Dokko

Dokko

Posted
Posted

As if somebody would prefer Short over Ashley  :kasper: Neither are great, but at least Ashley has got us into a decent financial situation.

 

Sunderland are on their arse. They’ve got no money, history of players on high wages, big loan fees, sacking managers for fun, no crowds, free tickets thus no matchday revenue, no value in the squad.

 

Despite having zero ambition, we have a decent wage structure, fairly stable in relation to manager fees over the years, sell out every week, no free tickets = big matchday revenue, most players worth at least £5-10 million.

 

 

 

That’s not saying Ashley is good, mind. But we are streets ahead of them lot. Praying for another relegation and them to rot in League One for a few years.

 

The difference between the clubs is paying fans. We have them, they don't. Ashley has been a far worse owner but we the fans have saved him. Short has put massive amounts of his own money in as their fans wouldn't do so. They've had to pay over the odds to attract players, imagine us doing that? 

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Doctor Zaius

Doctor Zaius

Posted
Posted

On the whole American owners have been a disaster for PL clubs.

 

Ellis Short, Randy Lerner and Hicks and Gilette all ending badly. The Glazers saddling Man Utd with debt, Shahid Khan hasn't achieved anything other than championship mediocrity. Aren't Swansea American owned too?

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Guest neesy111

Guest neesy111

Posted
Posted

On the whole American owners have been a disaster for PL clubs.

 

Ellis Short, Randy Lerner and Hicks and Gilette all ending badly. The Glazers saddling Man Utd with debt, Shahid Khan hasn't achieved anything other than championship mediocrity. Aren't Swansea American owned too?

Swansea, palace and Liverpool are the others.

 

I still don't think Fenway have been brilliant for Liverpool.

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Stifler

Stifler

Posted
Posted

On the whole American owners have been a disaster for PL clubs.

 

Ellis Short, Randy Lerner and Hicks and Gilette all ending badly. The Glazers saddling Man Utd with debt, Shahid Khan hasn't achieved anything other than championship mediocrity. Aren't Swansea American owned too?

They are used to American sports though where there is limited ownership of players, bigger cities where there is more fans (so fan discontent is less of a concern, even then you could just move the club elsewhere), equal spread of finances, no relegation etc. There are many more variables that effect the finances of a football club over here, and you need to be very much involved or aware of what’s going on all the time. They don’t get that.
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Guest Howaythetoon

Guest Howaythetoon

Posted
Posted

The Glazers have been a huge success at Man Utd, it’s the likes of Ashley and co who are the bad owners and not the likes of the Glazers.

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