Sunderland

[jarralad]

They are screwed and the club is £20 million out of pocket.

 

This and our takeover will destroy them.

[Dokko]

They are screwed and the club is £20 million out of pocket.

 

This and our takeover will destroy them.

 

Aye. If we're spending a reported £200m 1st window, 10 times their clubs worth then it'll kill them inside. It was bad enough when they were worth 1 Joelinton. 

[midds]

Important to understand that the accounts only go as far as last July. Things will have obviously changed over the last 10 months and the situation right now could be far, far worse. Could be better too obviously but I'd be surprised seeing as they're sitting in 7th and look like they'll be there at least another season. Income from all normal sources will dry up very soon. Looks bleak 

[woppy101]

Sunderland could start next season with a 12 point deduction as the club looks likely to file for administration following a "financial black hole" with the clubs parachute payments ending, if the takeover was announce now it will still be the second best thing to come out of today

[Danh1]

Fuck these cunts.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

HTT[/member] the academy isn't viable in their current situation. It's holding them back. They have a lot of pride in it but its a noose around their neck and until someone has the balls and mothballs it then it will continue to bleed them dry (something in the region of the entire league one transfer budget per year or a terrace chant - game changer if they had that every season to put back in to the playing staff)

 

That NUFC offer still open for the bairn? If so get him moved.

 

It’s not viable as a League One side in terms of the cost to keep it going as is (a PL academy), but as a business, long term, it’s the only and most certain business model for the club that’s proven viable as it provides the club with a revenue stream that far outstrips the costs of running it or and provides the club with players for the senior squad, reserves  and development squad. Without an academy and various programmes running, they could actually be expelled from the football league or face sanctions which as a member of the FA and the EFL they must adhere to operating a senior team, a reserve team, a development team etc.

 

Sadly I can see them scrapping programmes for the under 15s down and running the academy on part-time basis. I mean most of their staff are volunteers, part-timers or are on work placement schemes or affiliated to college programmes anyway.

 

They could sell the freehold/lease/land however it’s set up (I’m not sure) and rent it all back, but it’s not worth significant money and would make less business sense to property developers than to the club running it as a PL standard academy as a League One club.

 

To sell it off though for what would be pennies in relative terms would remove a business model that in terms of costs, saves the club money, generates money for the club and is the one true asset that belongs to the club not just short-term, bit forever how long they exist and on top of that it plays a vital role in many other areas in terms of the community, grassroots game, developing local talent and acting as the foundations in which the club stands on.

 

Remove that and it’s a long way back from there and no amount of money from TV, sponsors, rich owners or whatever will sustain the club in the way the academy can, does and will and as long as they have it, will do so forever.

 

That’s why it angers me more just how run down, neglected and forsaken our own academy set up under Ashley become far more than any relegation, star player sold or Rafa leaving or losing or whatever else because the academy is the lifeblood of the club in terms of the team in the way fans are in terms of the club.

 

I’d rather invest 20m in the academy than in any player or manager.

 

For all the stick Chelsea get over letting the likes of Salah go or de Bruyne, their academy earns them more money than ticket sales as they can get 2m a year just buy loaning a player out as a fee and have that club go halfers on that player’s salary or even take over that payout.

 

And should one of their academy players turn out to be the next Lampard or a Terry or decent enough but not too good enough for them they can sell to say Newcastle for 20m, well, that’s the equivalent of cash is king or as precious as gold.

 

If their owners had any sense, they wouldn’t go anywhere near the academy, if new owners had any sense, they’d buy SAFC for the academy alone which since it opened, has generated over 100m in revenue and enabled SAFC to operate a reserve side, a development side and a senior side, and always will providing it exists.

 

Barcelona and a German and Dutch clubs know the value of academies, youth programmes and look at England, our national team, the benefits we are now seeing from having enforced all clubs have an academy set up and development programmes and links with their community and the grassroots game.

 

If I had 40m SAFC would be the bargain of all time. I’d snap their hands off to own them. NUFC at 350m is a bargain because the value isn’t in how much money TV companies pay, how many tickets you can sell or how much you get for a player but what our clubs really are worth, solid fixed year on year, forever, global assets, like gold, like oil, like land and property.

 

Imagine owning NUFC and treating it as some kind of high street tatty shop, what a waste, what a complete and utter failure and clear stupidity not valuing what you have.

 

That’s Ashley.

 

Thankfully it seems our new owners value NUFC as something worth buying, owning, having, more than money and that’s why I’m far happier having them own us than Ashley who values the sum total of NUFC as fuck all and only values money which is actually worth fuck all in terms of any real value unless it buys you an actual asset. 350m or NUFC?

 

40m Joelinton or 40m on the academy?

 

Bruce 2m a yea or Rafa 6m a year?

 

Wise or KK?

 

The list goes on.

 

Andy Carroll, 35m, that would cover the cost of operating our own academy under Ashley for another 125 years. 1 Andy Carroll every decade or one Andy Carroll every year, if not in terms of resale value, but potential, benefit to the first team, potential to loan out for a million or two every season.

 

Nah, here’s a cheque for some wheelie bins, a few bags of ice and a blow up paddling pool.

 

Don’t fill them all the way up with water, that stuff costs money.

[Sima]

Sartori got 20% of the club for £1

 

It looks like he was the 'proof of funds' and Donald and Methven relatively didn't have anywhere near the cash needed to buy the club.

[Guest godzilla]

It was obvious from day one they were chancers. Just need the takeover confirmed to really put the boot in and send them spiralling out of control

[xLiaaamx]

So Sartori has actually done nowt for them? He was the rich saviour when he was announced.

[GWN]

They are screwed and the club is £20 million out of pocket.

 

This and our takeover will destroy them.

 

 

Nah, “6 in a row marra, we will always have that over yas “ 

[My Silent Face]

I read every word of your posts and I do like the passion HTT[/member]

[Sima]

That last £25m should have been left in the club, but Ellis's pride wouldn't let him do that. Supporters might have grumbled, but they would have understood better if the parachute had been used to clear a debt that was still in the club's books.

 

 

Poor fucker spent a fortune on them clearing the debt yet he's being begrudged taking a comparatively little chunk out.

[Scoot]

They are screwed and the club is £20 million out of pocket.

 

This and our takeover will destroy them.

 

 

Nah, “6 in a row marra, we will always have that over yas “ 

 

We relegated the mags. 6 in a row marra.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

They got SAFC for nowt, they got others to pay for their bit and they’ve taken money out and should they sell their bit, they get even more. Either way they end up way up on their ‘investment’. Sadly for fans SAFC is only worth it to people like them because no real businessman worth his salt would touch it with a barge-ole unless for him/them SAFC is worth more as an asset than any money to be had which quite frankly, you’d have to be an idiot to put your own money into a club for a profit. In that sense, you could say Donald and Methven are actually quite smart and not as daft as they look. Fair play to them, they stand to coin it in from a bankrupt game and sport which allows them to which as ever, the game doesn’t pay the price, but fans do.

 

As we are seeing now, no fans, no game, no business. Ashley would not sell if Covid-19 didn’t force the suspension of football and pretty much close him down. Without fans paying up, it’s either pay up yourself or get someone else to pay up and that’s what he’s done because if he had to pay up for real like he claims to have done but it’s complete and utter lies and fraudulent he would have and he do that because he values his asset more than money.

 

Something we do as fans

 

If only the ruling bodies of our game did our clubs would be protected and not be at the mercy of an Ashley, a Saudi regime or chancers like them lot at SAFC.

 

History will show Short was one of the good guys, who valued SAFC as an asset more than money but couldn’t make it work enough to make it financially worth it. So much sl he gave it away or paid others to come in and take it off his hands.

 

Shame on them the most.

 

 

[Geordie Ahmed]

That last £25m should have been left in the club, but Ellis's pride wouldn't let him do that. Supporters might have grumbled, but they would have understood better if the parachute had been used to clear a debt that was still in the club's books.

 

 

Poor fucker spent a fortune on them clearing the debt yet he's being begrudged taking a comparatively little chunk out.

 

 

That's brutal, he's lost millions after bankrolling that club, his mistake was appointing the wrong managers and then pandering to the fans, their entire season and world revolved around us and the derbies

 

The 6 in a row they love so much has partly contributed to them being in the situation they are in

[Dokko]

HTT[/member] the academy isn't viable in their current situation. It's holding them back. They have a lot of pride in it but its a noose around their neck and until someone has the balls and mothballs it then it will continue to bleed them dry (something in the region of the entire league one transfer budget per year or a terrace chant - game changer if they had that every season to put back in to the playing staff)

 

That NUFC offer still open for the bairn? If so get him moved.

 

It’s not viable as a League One side in terms of the cost to keep it going as is (a PL academy), but as a business, long term, it’s the only and most certain business model for the club that’s proven viable as it provides the club with a revenue stream that far outstrips the costs of running it or and provides the club with players for the senior squad, reserves  and development squad. Without an academy and various programmes running, they could actually be expelled from the football league or face sanctions which as a member of the FA and the EFL they must adhere to operating a senior team, a reserve team, a development team etc.

 

Sadly I can see them scrapping programmes for the under 15s down and running the academy on part-time basis. I mean most of their staff are volunteers, part-timers or are on work placement schemes or affiliated to college programmes anyway.

 

They could sell the freehold/lease/land however it’s set up (I’m not sure) and rent it all back, but it’s not worth significant money and would make less business sense to property developers than to the club running it as a PL standard academy as a League One club.

 

To sell it off though for what would be pennies in relative terms would remove a business model that in terms of costs, saves the club money, generates money for the club and is the one true asset that belongs to the club not just short-term, bit forever how long they exist and on top of that it plays a vital role in many other areas in terms of the community, grassroots game, developing local talent and acting as the foundations in which the club stands on.

 

Remove that and it’s a long way back from there and no amount of money from TV, sponsors, rich owners or whatever will sustain the club in the way the academy can, does and will and as long as they have it, will do so forever.

 

That’s why it angers me more just how run down, neglected and forsaken our own academy set up under Ashley become far more than any relegation, star player sold or Rafa leaving or losing or whatever else because the academy is the lifeblood of the club in terms of the team in the way fans are in terms of the club.

 

I’d rather invest 20m in the academy than in any player or manager.

 

For all the stick Chelsea get over letting the likes of Salah go or de Bruyne, their academy earns them more money than ticket sales as they can get 2m a year just buy loaning a player out as a fee and have that club go halfers on that player’s salary or even take over that payout.

 

And should one of their academy players turn out to be the next Lampard or a Terry or decent enough but not too good enough for them they can sell to say Newcastle for 20m, well, that’s the equivalent of cash is king or as precious as gold.

 

If their owners had any sense, they wouldn’t go anywhere near the academy, if new owners had any sense, they’d buy SAFC for the academy alone which since it opened, has generated over 100m in revenue and enabled SAFC to operate a reserve side, a development side and a senior side, and always will providing it exists.

 

Barcelona and a German and Dutch clubs know the value of academies, youth programmes and look at England, our national team, the benefits we are now seeing from having enforced all clubs have an academy set up and development programmes and links with their community and the grassroots game.

 

If I had 40m SAFC would be the bargain of all time. I’d snap their hands off to own them. NUFC at 350m is a bargain because the value isn’t in how much money TV companies pay, how many tickets you can sell or how much you get for a player but what our clubs really are worth, solid fixed year on year, forever, global assets, like gold, like oil, like land and property.

 

Imagine owning NUFC and treating it as some kind of high street tatty shop, what a waste, what a complete and utter failure and clear stupidity not valuing what you have.

 

That’s Ashley.

 

Thankfully it seems our new owners value NUFC as something worth buying, owning, having, more than money and that’s why I’m far happier having them own us than Ashley who values the sum total of NUFC as fuck all and only values money which is actually worth fuck all in terms of any real value unless it buys you an actual asset. 350m or NUFC?

 

40m Joelinton or 40m on the academy?

 

Bruce 2m a yea or Rafa 6m a year?

 

Wise or KK?

 

The list goes on.

 

Andy Carroll, 35m, that would cover the cost of operating our own academy under Ashley for another 125 years. 1 Andy Carroll every decade or one Andy Carroll every year, if not in terms of resale value, but potential, benefit to the first team, potential to loan out for a million or two every season.

 

Nah, here’s a cheque for some wheelie bins, a few bags of ice and a blow up paddling pool.

 

Don’t fill them all the way up with water, that stuff costs money.

 

I get what you are saying, but when they are in such a shit state with no real return then what's the point in keeping it going? Ours is fuck all compared to theirs yet we've knocked out Carroll, 2 x Longstaffs, Dummett, Woodman plus others depending how far you want to go back. In the end of the day if they are talented enough then it doesn't matter, they'll make it. Problem is, everything else is so fucked the ones with talent depart for peanuts. Its not a working model.

 

If they don't start investing in the team in the very near future then they will become League 1 for a long time and tbh, easily could be worse than that. A couple of academy players in 3-4 years time isn't going to stop this rot and going off what's happened so far if a Pickford came through the ranks right now he'd be snapped up by one of the big clubs before he even gets a game.

 

I'm not saying closed it down for good but mothball it and run the bare min until the club is in a position to be able to support it properly. From what it sounds like now its not fully functional therefore just a black hole in terms of money and nothing back in return.

 

What the club needs to do for me is to be in contact with the top English clubs and snap up players being released every year. Benefit from other academies who have put the time in and developed a late teen early twenties player who is good, but not going to cut it there. So many of those types of payers go off to make great careers for themselves. If they bring in those type of players they'll soon get a rep for it and more will be willing to come and hopefully push the club on or move on themselves, at a good fee. Reinvest and keep doing that as a model. When the team is full of young decent players and turning over a profit, then they can bring the academy back up and spend the right amount of money and time on it. Right now shields are down the hull is breached and they need to deflect all power to their rear before being bum fucked in to oblivion.

[UncleBingo]

That last £25m should have been left in the club, but Ellis's pride wouldn't let him do that. Supporters might have grumbled, but they would have understood better if the parachute had been used to clear a debt that was still in the club's books.

 

 

Poor fucker spent a fortune on them clearing the debt yet he's being begrudged taking a comparatively little chunk out.

 

Short hosed approx £260M on them, walked away with fuck all and is called worse that shite by the MLF's. Ashley will walk away with a tidy profit from NUFC (& all advertising/merch over the years) and they call us ungrateful and deluded.

 

Mackematics.

[Rafalove]

would be nice to see them drop in to league two or even further. Wouldn’t want them to go completely bust though.

[Skeletor]

 

[Dokko]

Accidental Donald 

[SUPERTOON]

They won’t have any match day revenue for the foreseeable future either.

[woppy101]

They won’t have any match day revenue for the foreseeable future either.

Bankrupt and out of business is what I see in there future 

[geordiedean]

I cant see anything other than dropping into league 2 for a bit they are pure fucked the standard of players will only get worse

[Menace]

So essentially bought them with their parachute payment, hope to get them up and then sell them and make a quick profit.

 

Worked well.

[Guest]

Is this not going to apply to the bulk of football clubs?