Allan Saint-Maximin (now playing for Fenerbahce, on loan from Al-Ahli)

[Bompeter]

13 minutes ago, KaKa said:

 

Regularly, before Pardew got jealous of all the adulation he was getting.

 

This guy came in on his full debut and won the game at Everton with a fantastic showing right off the bat, and an exceptional goal.

 

The idea that Ben Arfa was "regularly" putting in devastating attacking performances is just an out-and-out fabrication. Claiming that ten years ago would've been seen as obviously absurd.

 

He put in a handful of performances as good as ASM on Tuesday. There's a number of reasons for that and most of them weren't Ben Arfa's fault but there's some crazy rose-tinted glasses going on when it comes to what he was able to actually achieve on the pitch. 

[KaKa]

5 minutes ago, Bompeter said:

 

The idea that Ben Arfa was "regularly" putting in devastating attacking performances is just an out-and-out fabrication. Claiming that ten years ago would've been seen as obviously absurd.

 

He put in a handful of performances as good as ASM on Tuesday. There's a number of reasons for that and most of them weren't Ben Arfa's fault but there's some crazy rose-tinted glasses going on when it comes to what he was able to actually achieve on the pitch. 

 

Well I think you're being a prisoner of the moment with ASM to be honest. 

 

I know for sure Ben Arfa put in performances better than that more than a handful of times. I don't know if it's because this team is so poor in general and has been for a while now that people are getting so excited, because quite frankly, there isn't much else that exciting in this team outside of ASM. I though his performance had its ups and downs and if that result had gone the wrong way he would have been getting slated on here. 

 

 

[AJ9]

We’re still debating ASM vs HBA? Coolio.

[Consortium of one]

 

Just saw on twitter that ASM had more than twice as many successful dribbles than the next highest player.

[Hanshithispantz]

3 hours ago, Kid Icarus said:

I used to love that sort of thing, but I dunno if it's reached saturation point, I've reached saturation point, or I'm just getting older. 

I don't think I believe anyone's really knowledgable or insightful until I've heard them about Newcastle, because quite often it's clear that they don't know what they're talking about. Gary Neville has been especially guilty of this and it does make me wonder whether the same applies to other clubs. Tifo, HITC, James Lawrence, and a fair few journalists on TFS and other podcasts have all done it too. It makes me think that a huge part of it with a lot of them is just blagging and relying on the majority of the audience being blaggers too, similar to TalkSport. 

 

 

 

Yeah I feel the same. It's sort of like looking behind the curtain when nthe talk about us.

 

It's weird though because both James Lawrence and Tifo have put out things very recently which I pretty much completely agreed with, so I assume they've been paying more attention since January.

[Guest HTT II]

No-one at the club since I’ve been following us has put in the kind of second half performance ASM put in against Everton the other night. He tore them to shreds, not just one or two but an entire midfield and back line and at will and time and time again.
 

He was literally unplayable in that half and had we had another ten minutes to play after the 90, he would have likely scored himself, he would have drew a red card foul no doubt and likely a penalty too.
 

He is so dangerous and what made me giddy was that even putting 3 men on him couldn’t stop him. He has that ability and can totally dominate, destroy and win a game on his own or turn a game in and instant.
 

Like I said a few posts up, however, you have to accept that’s as much him as it’s as much him the way he ‘performed’ in the first half. Having Targett behind him frees him up, don’t underestimate the importance of him/his role and what having a solid LB brings to ASM’s game…

 

 

Edited February 11, 2022 by HTT II

[Chris_R]

Players who dribble or try to create will always lose the ball. It comes with the territory. I imagine every single winger in history who can carry the ball has been described as "frustrating".

[Super Duper Branko Strupar]

3 hours ago, Bompeter said:

 

The idea that Ben Arfa was "regularly" putting in devastating attacking performances is just an out-and-out fabrication. Claiming that ten years ago would've been seen as obviously absurd.

 

He put in a handful of performances as good as ASM on Tuesday. There's a number of reasons for that and most of them weren't Ben Arfa's fault but there's some crazy rose-tinted glasses going on when it comes to what he was able to actually achieve on the pitch. 

 

 This is just patently untrue

[Unbelievable]

13 hours ago, Super Duper Branko Strupar said:

 

 This is just patently untrue

I don’t think it is. Or you view ASM’s performance level on Tuesday different than me and a few others. It was special. Disregarding the first 20 minutes I’d say 10/10 special, the type of performance level you only see a fee times a season across all teams in an entire PL season. Ben Arfa was great on his day and very good most of the time, but let’s not pretend he was consistently on a league dominating level.

 

Can I just say this back and forth about Ben Arta is quite simply bewildering to me. Can we not be glad that we have a player on our hands who reminds us of him and his impact, is still only 24 and looks like he could be here for a good while yet? I will always cherish the memories of Ben Arfa’s exploits in black and white, but boy am I excited to have Saint-Maximin in out team today.

 

 

Edited February 11, 2022 by Unbelievable

[Hanshithispantz]

Maybe just time but I cannot remember Hatem putting in a match like that, where he was consistently taking 4-5 defenders out of the game. He could do it, and did it often, but Maxi did it time and time again in the same match from different areas of the pitch. He didn't just have the beating of 1 man on the night. Not saying Hatem never had better matches, just cannot remember seeing that kind of a performance - it was pretty unique.

 

I actually didn't find Hatem frustrating at all though, he had quiet games but I didn't find him detrimental to the team in the way I did with Maxi against Watford before he scored. I think his game was much more rounded but hopefully Howe can smoothen Saint-Maximin out.

 

 

 

 

Edited February 11, 2022 by Hanshithispantz

[Groundhog63]

I called Maxi "dog shit" after Cambridge because, imho, he was. Beyond frustrating.

Massive performance on tues. Quite rightly being described, by many former players, as unplayable. Actually passed first time balls, caused absolute havoc. In a team full of top players where the opposition can't afford to even double up is the next level.

HBA was frustrating too but I will never forget, sitting in the Leazes, rising from my seat the second he received the ball in our half v Bolton. You just knew, just knew he was away. Special moments.

[Kid Icarus]

Fuck it, yous are getting on my nerves now.

 

Just off the top of my head:

West Brom away 11/12 - 1 goal, 2 assists, took on their entire team 2 or 3 times.

Aston Villa home 12/13 - 1 goal, completely took the piss throughout.

Spurs home 12/13 - won and scored a pen, constantly took them on through the middle.

Aston Villa away 13/14 - scored, assisted, completely ran riot.

Stoke home 13/14 - won a penalty, assisted, hit the bar twice, and completely took the piss (dropped by Pardew the next match)

 

All were comfortably at the same level of performance as ASM's vs Everton.

 

There were others where the quality was the same but he wasn't on the ball as much, I'm thinking Everton 10/11, Sunderland, Liverpool, Swansea, Bolton, Blackburn and Stoke 11/12, Norwich, Everton, Arsenal 12/13.

 

Can we get back to enjoying ASM now?

 

 

 

Edited February 11, 2022 by Kid Icarus

[Yorkie]

3 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said:

Fuck it, yous are getting on my nerves now.

 

Just off the top of my head:

West Brom away 11/12 - 1 goal, 2 assists, took on their entire team 2 or 3 times.

Aston Villa home 12/13 - 1 goal, completely took the piss throughout.

Spurs home 12/13 - won a scored a pen, constantly took them on through the middle.

Aston Villa away 13/14 - scored, assisted, completely ran riot.

Stoke home 13/14 - won a penalty, assisted, hit the bar twice, and completely took the piss (dropped by Pardew the next match)

 

All were comfortably at the same level of performance as ASM's vs Everton. 

 

 

Debut v Everton too. 

[1964]

What we should be excited about is rather than squabbling about which of them had the bigger cock, revel in the fact that no matter how good he is, or gets, Maxi will be going nowhere, because we have a shitload of money to build a team of 11 Maxi's

[Hanshithispantz]

https://youtu.be/sIS-xsl3rFs

 

The Villa performance mentioned is there (not sure if the others are on Youtube). Agree it looks a better overall game than Maxi against Everton but it's still just a typical Ben Arfa on a good day game, isn't it? He was a much better all round footballer.

 

For me the thing that stands out about Tuesday was how often ASM was able to run at Everton, and regardless of how many players were in his way, he was able to carve through them. I just cannot remember seeing a player for us doing that, to that extent, in a single game.

 

Cannot find the other ones and really should get myself to work  ... So may be wrong, my memory is shit like.

 

 

 

[Kid Icarus]

I honestly don't see the difference between the two tbh like. Could be a bit of recency bias with ASM's. WBA 11/12 would be the one where he almost had 2 or Bolton style goals or assists on top of scoring and assisting. Don't think it's on YouTube though. It was a 10/10 performance in every way though. 

 

Little bits of the WBA match are here, with a couple of the runs.

 

https://youtu.be/iTiQhiZe9cE

 

 

Edited February 11, 2022 by Kid Icarus

[Hanshithispantz]

Probably is recency bias like, I'm not going to pretend my memory is infallible because it's absolute shite 

 

I was just completely awe struck by Tuesday, which I've never been since I started watching again.

[Kid Icarus]

25 minutes ago, Hanshithispantz said:

Probably is recency bias like, I'm not going to pretend my memory is infallible because it's absolute shite 

 

I was just completely awe struck by Tuesday, which I've never been since I started watching again.

 

and that's the bit that matters like. Obviously I love HBA, but the constant need to compare (not from you, but just as some sort of reflex thing on here that we all end up taking the bait over) doesn't do either of them justice.

 

Always feels weird to watch ASM, think how good a performance he had and then find myself looking for his flaws because someone's decided to compare him to my favourite player of the last 20 years. 

 

 

Edited February 11, 2022 by Kid Icarus

[54]

 

[KaKa]

1 hour ago, Kid Icarus said:

Fuck it, yous are getting on my nerves now.

 

Just off the top of my head:

West Brom away 11/12 - 1 goal, 2 assists, took on their entire team 2 or 3 times.

Aston Villa home 12/13 - 1 goal, completely took the piss throughout.

Spurs home 12/13 - won and scored a pen, constantly took them on through the middle.

Aston Villa away 13/14 - scored, assisted, completely ran riot.

Stoke home 13/14 - won a penalty, assisted, hit the bar twice, and completely took the piss (dropped by Pardew the next match)

 

All were comfortably at the same level of performance as ASM's vs Everton.

 

There were others where the quality was the same but he wasn't on the ball as much, I'm thinking Everton 10/11, Sunderland, Liverpool, Swansea, Bolton, Blackburn and Stoke 11/12, Norwich, Everton, Arsenal 12/13.

 

Can we get back to enjoying ASM now?

 

 

 

 

 

I admire the effort you put into this man. I gave up. Couldn't be bothered spelling it out. My God how quickly people forget. Kind of sad really.

 

I think maybe a big part of over looking some of his performances was the fact the team had more balance to it, with the likes of Ba, Cisse, Tiote and Cabaye regularly putting in decent performances as well, so his performances were maybe not as memorable for some because he didn't have to always get the ball and do everything all the time, which is pretty much still our style with ASM.

[Consortium of one]

both players could make the opponent shit themselves.

 

Not to get into the argument but ASM is more choppy with his stops and starts.  He's like that ankle breaking PG at the top of the key.  HBA was more elegant almost.  He saw what he could do and one second he was there and the next second he was by his man.  Both are/were incredibly effective but in different ways, IMO

[Rich]

Now can we all just take a moment to imagine them in the same team on opposite sides of a quality lone striker? Mama mia.

[Mike]

5 hours ago, Kid Icarus said:

Fuck it, yous are getting on my nerves now.

 

Just off the top of my head:

West Brom away 11/12 - 1 goal, 2 assists, took on their entire team 2 or 3 times.

Aston Villa home 12/13 - 1 goal, completely took the piss throughout.

Spurs home 12/13 - won and scored a pen, constantly took them on through the middle.

Aston Villa away 13/14 - scored, assisted, completely ran riot.

Stoke home 13/14 - won a penalty, assisted, hit the bar twice, and completely took the piss (dropped by Pardew the next match)

 

All were comfortably at the same level of performance as ASM's vs Everton.

 

There were others where the quality was the same but he wasn't on the ball as much, I'm thinking Everton 10/11, Sunderland, Liverpool, Swansea, Bolton, Blackburn and Stoke 11/12, Norwich, Everton, Arsenal 12/13.

 

Can we get back to enjoying ASM now?

 

 

 

 

 

[Mike]

10 minutes ago, Pardiola said:

Now can we all just take a moment to imagine them in the same team on opposite sides of a quality lone striker? Mama mia.

 

 

 

 

We could have had it!!! We could have done it!

[Rich]

Another Chris Wood fan, excellent!