Nucasol Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 3 minutes ago, Dokko said: Canny disappointed we've just experienced one of the worst injury crisis we've ever seen, players health and wellbeing are on the line, yet we're halfway through Jan and we've brought no one in to help them through it. Even the manager looks fucked. If we've tied ourselves up in ffp knots, then this summer window and the signings made were ludicrous. We needed a squad that was ready now. Without kicking off another debate on ‘should we have known’, Tonali’s circumstances have caused a fucking massive headache. He was ready and would have played a good chunk of the October - December fixture logjam. Tino has contributed progressively and when required. Barnes has been unlucky. Hall is the puzzler in the four deals. Could argue the Minteh money could have been used but what’s £6m and doing deals like him are key to building a City/Chelsea conveyor belt of FFP problem solvers alongside the academy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 11 minutes ago, Dokko said: Canny disappointed we've just experienced one of the worst injury crisis we've ever seen, players health and wellbeing are on the line, yet we're halfway through Jan and we've brought no one in to help them through it. Even the manager looks fucked. If we've tied ourselves up in ffp knots, then this summer window and the signings made were ludicrous. We needed a squad that was ready now. A lot of premium signings. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERTOON Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 6 minutes ago, TheBrownBottle said: I don’t think that there is anyone daft on here, but I wonder what the portion of the support who thinks we’re going to be Real Madrid MkII think of Eales stating that the club’s aim is to be ‘top six’? I think that with the constraints that’s a hell of a challenge, but there will be a chunk of the fan base who bought into the ‘we’re going to be number 1’ patter In fairness the winning titles and champions leagues came from Staveley. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheInfiniteOdyssey Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 Wonder if there’ll be some kind of internal inquest about the scale of injuries we’ve experienced this season, as well as the delayed recovery times. As an external observer, and someone with no medical qualifications whatsoever admittedly, it’s nonetheless been grating to read contradictory public statements from Howe watering down the seriousness of injuries and then a player having a seemingly endless string of setbacks. Does FFP extend to staff recruitment? If not, don’t really see the excuse for not putting into place a world-class supporting structure - physios, recruitment, scouting etc, given the resources PIF have. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keegans Export Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 40 minutes ago, Dokko said: Canny disappointed we've just experienced one of the worst injury crisis we've ever seen, players health and wellbeing are on the line, yet we're halfway through Jan and we've brought no one in to help them through it. Even the manager looks fucked. If we've tied ourselves up in ffp knots, then this summer window and the signings made were ludicrous. We needed a squad that was ready now. Seems a little over-dramatic? We had Tonali and Barnes who, suspension/injury aside would have presumably been first team regulars. Livramento has been one of our best performers this season when called upon. Hall is loan-to-buy so has had little impact on our FFP position this window. Truth is, our squad was miles away from being able to compete on multiple fronts. We were never going to bridge that gap in one or two windows and the injury issues have just highlighted that fact. I'm absolutely fine with the three signings we made on the basis that the three of them can expect to be regular first-team players in the next few seasons. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBG Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 Half of 31 also isn't 12. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
80 Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 50 minutes ago, Keegans Export said: Seems a little over-dramatic? We had Tonali and Barnes who, suspension/injury aside would have presumably been first team regulars. Livramento has been one of our best performers this season when called upon. Hall is loan-to-buy so has had little impact on our FFP position this window. Truth is, our squad was miles away from being able to compete on multiple fronts. We were never going to bridge that gap in one or two windows and the injury issues have just highlighted that fact. I'm absolutely fine with the three signings we made on the basis that the three of them can expect to be regular first-team players in the next few seasons. The irony is the perception of the summer window was that we'd chosen to double down on our current player types and add depth to the squad - to deal with a four competition campaign - rather than getting some alternative styles in and stretching a winning formula thin. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GEFAFWISP Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 1 hour ago, TheInfiniteOdyssey said: Wonder if there’ll be some kind of internal inquest about the scale of injuries we’ve experienced this season, as well as the delayed recovery times. As an external observer, and someone with no medical qualifications whatsoever admittedly, it’s nonetheless been grating to read contradictory public statements from Howe watering down the seriousness of injuries and then a player having a seemingly endless string of setbacks. Does FFP extend to staff recruitment? If not, don’t really see the excuse for not putting into place a world-class supporting structure - physios, recruitment, scouting etc, given the resources PIF have. There absolutely will be, if not already, and it'll be a difficult conversation to have. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myleftboot Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 Wonder if the Saudis will ever look at us and think we haven’t got much chance of progression with FFP and move on. ? But I suppose we don’t know what they’re thinking. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbandit Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 Massively doubt it. There’s a way to build us up as a top ten club worldwide in the next 5-10 years even with FFP Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myleftboot Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 1 minute ago, gbandit said: Massively doubt it. There’s a way to build us up as a top ten club worldwide in the next 5-10 years even with FFP Hopefully. ?? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrownBottle Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 1 minute ago, gbandit said: Massively doubt it. There’s a way to build us up as a top ten club worldwide in the next 5-10 years even with FFP It’s impossible with all the other regs in place at the moment. FMV and all that nonsense. The other clubs can literally block everything. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 3 hours ago, SUPERTOON said: In fairness the winning titles and champions leagues came from Staveley. In fairness I'm sure we want to win titles and go for the Champions league as soon as we are allowed to compete for the best players. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myleftboot Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 5 minutes ago, gbandit said: Massively doubt it. There’s a way to build us up as a top ten club worldwide in the next 5-10 years even with FFP But they did buy us when there was no regulations. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrownBottle Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 4 minutes ago, Myleftboot said: But they did buy us when there was no regulations. No, the FFP regs were there. FMV wasn’t and the related party transactions was watered down. These were brought in to block NUFC’s growth, and they’ve meekly accepted them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
timeEd32 Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 I'm really surprised at the reaction to yesterday, though all the headlines certainly aren't helping. Frustrations from the events of this season are clouding the momentum that is building and I get it because it's incredibly annoying how many what-ifs there are. But, we announced record revenues yesterday that don't include Sela, Adidas, or European money. Our 2023/24 accounts will almost certainly show revenue north of £300m and, even without European football, our 2024/25 accounts should be at least in the same ballpark. That's still a long ways from Spurs, let alone the Manchester clubs that are in a different stratosphere, but we also have a lot of untapped opportunity. There is lots of room to run. We added 102 new employees in 2022/23, roughly evenly split between "business operations" and "playing squads, academy, team management, and support." Things are happening every day in all facets of this club that no one was even thinking about a little over two years ago. FFP is annoying in our present position, but an equal amount of anger should still be directed at our previous owner. The club was basically left with two groups of players -- ones that Howe and co. could make useful/good and ones that literally no club in the world wants to give us money for (whether because of talent, age, and/or wages). So yes, we're going to have to sell players. Every club in the world does this. The problem for us is our list of salable assets is shorter than most and our highest valued player is both beloved and our most important. It sucks. But if he is sold (and I think it's still a fairly strong if) it will likely be a top-10ish transfer of all-time with the express purpose of reinvesting in the first team. Lastly, comparisons to Man City or Chelsea are really quite pointless. Their timing was impeccable. Not only did they enter the wild west of financial regulation with more money than anyone, but there was also less competition. Chelsea got rich right when Leeds went bust, we started to fall away, and Champions League qualification expanded to four teams. It was Man United, Arsenal, Liverpool, and essentially an empty seat at the table. Man City joined a party of four and happened to catch the tail end of Ferguson and Wenger (with Arsenal in a period of austerity due to their new stadium). Spurs have created a group of six and we, along with Villa, are trying to expand that to 7 or 8. No one is assured their place in the Champions League or the revenue that comes with it. The Europa League isn't just a consolation prize anymore if this group grows to 8 - it will still be an achievement. Look at recent Premier League finishes since 2009/10 (which I think can be pointed to as the beginning of the Big 6): Spurs: 4th, 5th, 4th, 5th, 6th, 5th, 3rd, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 6th, 7th, 4th, 8th Chelsea: 1st, 2nd, 6th, 3rd, 3rd, 1st, 10th, 1st, 5th, 3rd, 4th, 4th, 3rd, 12th Man Utd: 2nd, 1st, 2nd, 1st (Fergie leaves), 7th, 4th, 5th, 6th, 2nd, 6th, 3rd, 2nd, 6th, 3rd Arsenal: 3rd, 4th, 3rd, 4th, 4th, 3rd, 2nd, 5th, 6th, 5th, 8th, 8th, 5th, 2nd City is the only one that hasn't been outside the top 4 for multiple seasons in that timeframe. The last seven seasons or so have been defined by Guardiola and Klopp, but that will likely change at some point. This isn't the Premier League of 15 years ago, which makes the challenge even more difficult on top of FFP and the massive head start some have had. But if you zoom out from the current transfer window and the insanely long injury list then it's pretty clear we're going places. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe1984 Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 11 hours ago, r0cafella said: I don’t think most members want to get rid of FFP or FMV let’s remember they are the ones who actually came up with these rules and implemented them. Our best hope is someone like Everton gets punished heavily and challenges the whole thing whilst we wait on the sidelines. I think levelling the flaying field is good, but that’s what it has to be. If Chelsea are allowed to spend 1b so should everyone. Levelling the flaying field!? Jesus! ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbydazzla Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 (edited) Was talking to a non-playing staff senior manager from Man Utd this week. Even with the size of their resources and global reach, agreeing new commercial deals can take ages. And Man Utd’s commercial team is in the opposite place to us. Too many people compared to City, Arsenal etc, deals already in place for pretty much everything that can possibly be sponsored Compounded by consistently underachieving on the pitch and players with such high transfer fees and wages that they can’t sell them. They’d planned for getting £100m for Maguire and McTominay in the summer for instance Sounds like Ineos are going to have to wield the axe to sort the situation out Edited January 12 by bobbydazzla Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stifler Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 3 minutes ago, bobbydazzla said: Was talking to a non-playing staff senior manager from Man Utd this week. Even with the size of their resources and global reach, growing the commercial sponsors and agreeing new deals can take ages. And Man Utd’s commercial team is in the opposite place to us. Too many people compared to City, Arsenal etc, deals already in place for pretty much everything that can possibly be sponsored, consistently underachieving on the pitch and players with such high transfer fees and wages that they can’t sell them. Sounds like Ineos are going to have to wield the axe to get costs under control and sort the situation Aye, and in Man Utd’s position they have recent (compared to us) success to back up their deals. Like it or not, we will still be in a position where companies will be wanting to see how we sustain our improvements. It’s ok having 1,000 companies chasing us for the shirt sponsorship, but it’s going to be a bit more difficult to get those companies to stump up money for a 30 second pitch side advertising and a club website press release for their money. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbydazzla Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 1 minute ago, Stifler said: companies to stump up money for a 30 second pitch side advertising and a club website press release for their money. This is exactly what the Man Utd person said. LED boards and press release is about all a minor partner will get And that’s not likely to excite a potential partner and demonstrate worthwhile ROI And Man Utd are able to go around the world touting for partners by pitching their trophy cabinet and international fan base. Neither of which we have, so we’re immediately in a weaker position Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfcastle Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 Definitely brought in to save the likes of Bury these rules like. It might stop us supplanting the usual suspects who themselves supplanted others but the real beneficiaries of that will be Sutton and Newport. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfcastle Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 7 hours ago, Ghandis Flip-Flop said: We signed Speed that summer, no? No following January. He was terrible under Dalglish to be brutally honest too. Until Gullit came he'd have been in the bad signing pile with 90% of the other ones. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cubaricho Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 7 hours ago, Ronson333 said: Haven’t Man City been under investigation for like five years in relation to FFP and we might finally see something about it this year? There could be something wild to come out of that (not holding my breath). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrownBottle Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 (edited) 1 hour ago, Wolfcastle said: No following January. He was terrible under Dalglish to be brutally honest too. Until Gullit came he'd have been in the bad signing pile with 90% of the other ones. Yep, this is often forgotten. He used to get pelters - and he was utter shite to be frank. He was played on the left, like he was at Leeds, and it was patently obvious that he wasn’t up to snuff. In terms of transfer values at the time, we absolutely overpaid. Still don’t think he was great under Gullit either, tbh, but at least he wasn’t on the left wing anymore. Looked so much better alongside Dyer in Robson’s team. Edited January 12 by TheBrownBottle Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloydianMag Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 Article by Jason Burt in the Telegraph this morning……..behind a paywall?♂️ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/01/12/footballs-spending-rules-widening-gulf-between-have-nots/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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