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The "delighted Ashley has gone, but uncomfortable with Saudi ownership" thread

UncleBingo

by UncleBingo
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Tiresias

Tiresias

Posted
Posted
Just now, RUHRLYASLEEVESUP said:

2 bald blokes arguing over a comb

 

non of the rhetoric I’ve read here will change one single thing, PIF own the club, the rights, the entire shooting match, not one person or group of individuals can ever change that or alter their course.

 

 

 

Aaah yes isn't it wonderful that fans have no power. Joyous viewpoint :D. And again I am excited for what this takeover can do for the club and area.

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Wullie

Wullie

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Posted
1 minute ago, ManDoon said:

Sportswashing is a weird concept yeah, it arguably brings the stuff they don’t want into the limelight, but on the flip side there are Saudi flags in usernames, people waving them about at the stadium, people dressing up as Sheik’s etc, so maybe in that degree it does work.

 

I guess they get to do the whole “see we ain’t that bad guys! “ thing, so maybe. I dunno. 

 

James Montague on Second Captains was saying that one of the big benefits is that you instantly acquire tens of thousands of fans ready to go to bat for you online. I've seen it myself, Man City fans on Twitter who spend much more time defending Abu Dhabi than talking about football.

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Tiresias

Tiresias

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Posted

Always wonder about that, assume some of it is artificial, there are definitely lot of shady firms running lots of fake accounts to create fake twitter storms and social media pressure, and how many people are weirdly spending their time on twitter. Who would waste their time arguing with people on the internet, what total losers....oh....wait

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Disco

Disco

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3 minutes ago, Wullie said:

 

James Montague on Second Captains was saying that one of the big benefits is that you instantly acquire tens of thousands of fans ready to go to bat for you online. I've seen it myself, Man City fans on Twitter who spend much more time defending Abu Dhabi than talking about football.

 

It’s more about having another card to play against the government is it not? Qatar is evermore hugely embedded within the French economy as Saudi and UAE are here and I’m guessing people being against that has reduced over time as they can point to examples of good they’ve done to each. Eg Manchester regeneration.

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Tiresias

Tiresias

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Posted

I think there are different benefits, one of them is certainly cementing position within worldwide economy and stops governments getting serious with any pressure going the other way if you are essentially enmeshed in as much of the economy and culture as possible

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Guest neesy111

Guest neesy111

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, veriaqa said:

So sportwashing is working then... so it's inevitable for thousands of NUFC fans defending Saudi online then

 

Thousands out of what?  It'll not be a sizeable percentage as we do have a large fanbase.  I don't know a single fan out of my friends who are defending the Saudi regime in any way.

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Smal

Smal

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1 minute ago, Wullie said:

 

James Montague on Second Captains was saying that one of the big benefits is that you instantly acquire tens of thousands of fans ready to go to bat for you online. I've seen it myself, Man City fans on Twitter who spend much more time defending Abu Dhabi than talking about football.

This kind of sportswashing is evident even in this thread. Ironically on other forums the only people I've seen defending this takeover are... Man City fans. There is also the other side of sportswashing that Saudi Arabia get to entrench themselves within the UK economy. Strengthening their position at the table. It's a thing. 

 

Ultimately people are free to support their football club how they want. If you want to/can differentiate the football side from the political side then that's fine. But there isn't a moral case for defending the political side of this takeover, so it's frustrating when people even try to. 

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Tiresias

Tiresias

Posted
Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, RUHRLYASLEEVESUP said:

Who’s metaphorically  licking arse?

 

Just arguing that noone should feel obligated to defend saudi arabia's human rights record. Fans should be allowed to question the ethics without being attacked and assumed to hold opinions they don't have

 

 

Edited by Tiresias

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Disco

Disco

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Got to say as much as I disagree with:

 

- nations being able to own football clubs

- the PL encouraging it

- pretty much everything to do with Saudi and how they operate

- fans being blamed for the above

- fans going into bat for a disgusting regime

- some of the guff that’s come out from fan groups

- the overall state of the game in Europe

 

if the group and the PIF do invest in Newcastle and improve the city where myself, my friends and family live for the better, raising aspirations and standards of living, particularly for young people, that the actual government of this actual country has been happy to let slide and erode for over a decade then I’ll absolutely welcome it. We fucking need it.

 

And that makes me a massive hypocrite and tbh I’m comfortable with that.

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Happinesstan

Happinesstan

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Posted

I think this thread is invaluable. And we need to keep it civil. I don't believe anybody that states they don't care. I think if they bothered to have a conversation with themselves they'd find they do care. Stating you don't care who our owners are, or acknowledging that you feel powerless is perfectly acceptable, but are we? Only if we continue to pretend we don't care. 

 

This might be a business partnership between the wealthy elites of two cultures which appear to clash, but it can also be a partnership between the two groups of dissatisfied people that are mostly effected by these global deals.

 

It's a very sensitive situation and I think once the excitement settles everybody will be more thoughtful. We are at the heart of a wonderful opportunity let's not spoil it.

 

I've got no interest in dictating to anybody as I think, for the majority, it is unnecessary.

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Tiresias

Tiresias

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Posted

I think that makes you normal, a lot of internet debate is screaming match as if we don't go through our lives with a million moral compromises or hypocrisies. A lot of people have had a hand in creating a situation where clubs are reliant on sovereign state funds to compete and what do you know that's what happens. It is not anyone here's fault, and there should be work to build a football league where fans have power and the spending isn't out of reach of 99% of clubs but until then we should appreciate that there will be good that comes out of it, local joy, local jobs and local investment. People who feel it is too immoral should be respected as should those who want to enjoy something incredible. 

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UncleBingo

UncleBingo

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Happinesstan said:

I think this thread is invaluable. And we need to keep it civil. I don't believe anybody that states they don't care. I think if they bothered to have a conversation with themselves they'd find they do care. Stating you don't care who our owners are, or acknowledging that you feel powerless is perfectly acceptable, but are we? Only if we continue to pretend we don't care. 

 

This might be a business partnership between the wealthy elites of two cultures which appear to clash, but it can also be a partnership between the two groups of dissatisfied people that are mostly effected by these global deals.

 

It's a very sensitive situation and I think once the excitement settles everybody will be more thoughtful. We are at the heart of a wonderful opportunity let's not spoil it.

 

I've got no interest in dictating to anybody as I think, for the majority, it is unnecessary.

Good shout on your final line, the thread wasn't about judging people on their thought process. Just wondered if I was alone in being conflicted by this.

 

Playing devil's advocate here but I wonder what the 'I don't care' brigade thought about the Mackems playing Adam Johnson knowing what he'd done?

 

It's football, anything goes right?

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Smal

Smal

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Posted
5 minutes ago, Disco said:

Got to say as much as I disagree with:

 

- nations being able to own football clubs

- the PL encouraging it

- pretty much everything to do with Saudi and how they operate

- fans being blamed for the above

- fans going into bat for a disgusting regime

- some of the guff that’s come out from fan groups

- the overall state of the game in Europe

 

if the group and the PIF do invest in Newcastle and improve the city where myself, my friends and family live for the better, raising aspirations and standards of living, particularly for young people, that the actual government of this actual country has been happy to let slide and erode for over a decade then I’ll absolutely welcome it. We fucking need it.

 

And that makes me a massive hypocrite and tbh I’m comfortable with that.

Yeah, nobody can refute that more investment, jobs etc. in the area isn’t a good thing. I don’t think it makes you a hypocrite to welcome that. Where it has come from is not good but it is an unstoppable (for us, individually) symptom of the exaggerated capitalism we live in.

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Wolfcastle

Wolfcastle

Posted
Posted (edited)
28 minutes ago, Wullie said:

 

James Montague on Second Captains was saying that one of the big benefits is that you instantly acquire tens of thousands of fans ready to go to bat for you online. I've seen it myself, Man City fans on Twitter who spend much more time defending Abu Dhabi than talking about football.

 

When I think back my problem with Man City was that it meant the money was going to get even more ridiculous rather than the human rights record, which was a given for any group from the middle east, goes without saying, maybe bit of the discomfort wsa to do with that but never once have I accused Man City fans of anything political. Saudi and UAE had played in world cups and nobody batted an eyelid.  I think it reasonable that I should apply that to my own club and arguably when it comes down to for football fans is how it effects the game, which isn't good. The political side of it is always there for those that are more into that more.

 

 

Edited by Wolfcastle

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