Eddie Howe

[TRon]

8 minutes ago, r0cafella said:

 

 

 

A high press shouldnt be the sole focus of play, competent and capable teams set pressing traps and funnel play to certain areas of the pitch and when it back in those areas. The fact we default to doesn't run enough is pretty dire. 

 

If you have a world class player which we know we do the manager should be looking to get the most out of him by employing tactics which suits him not binning him off for some inferior because he runs a bit. 

 

 

I don't know if I mentioned this already, but Maresca's interview after the game really stuck in my head. He criticised his own players for lack of patience which turned the game into "basketball". In one way you could count that as a success for Howe because it's an admission that we imposed our game on them. But on the other hand we are often coming out losers in these exchanges as some of our players can't cope with the high speed turnovers. So yeah, the players don't really seem comfortable with the tactics. They certainly aren't executing them effectively.

[The College Dropout]

Isak can press - but he can only do it for an hour.

[Lotus]

Just now, The College Dropout said:

Isak can press - but he can only do it for an hour.

I also think it takes that bit of spark out his legs that allows him to do something special.

[The College Dropout]

3 minutes ago, TRon said:

 

 

I don't know if I mentioned this already, but Maresca's interview after the game really stuck in my head. He criticised his own players for lack of patience which turned the game into "basketball". In one way you could count that as a success for Howe because it's an admission that we imposed our game on them. But on the other hand we are often coming out losers in these exchanges as some of our players can't cope with the high speed turnovers. So yeah, the players don't really seem comfortable with the tactics. They certainly aren't executing them effectively.

We don't look as fit, strong and motivated as we should.

[Mahoneys Tache]

1 minute ago, The College Dropout said:

We don't look as fit, strong and motivated as we should.

Maybe toned down the training to avoid all the injuries. 

[r0cafella]

2 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

Isak can press - but he can only do it for an hour.

So this is a big question mark that needs to be resolved imo. Is it he/we as a team press in a manner which isn't efficient? Is it a lack of application on his part? Is it poor strength and condition preparing? 

[TRon]

1 minute ago, The College Dropout said:

We don't look as fit, strong and motivated as we should.

 

Maybe not, but I don't think fitness is going to fix the pace deficit of players like Burn, Schar and Bruno. All of them are good players, but they are not designed to recover from losing the ball implementing a high press.

[SUPERTOON]

This discussion really does highlight how poorly we built the squad tbh.

[Ash]

1 minute ago, SUPERTOON said:

This discussion really does highlight how poorly we built the squad tbh.

 

And this is ultimately what Mitchell was getting at but people took it the wrong way. 

[TheBrownBottle]

It’s tricky for me because I don’t know football like Howe does - I’m an old school terrace gobshite, who took a long time to accept I didn’t know more than the manager (unless that manager is Steve Bruce).

 

But I can’t get away from the thought that I think Isak is a phenomenal footballer and we’re failing to make the most of his gifts.  

 

 

Edited yesterday at 10:02 by TheBrownBottle

[SUPERTOON]

Just now, TheBrownBottle said:

It’s tricky for me because I don’t know football like Howe does - I’m an old school terrace gobshite, who took a long time to accept I didn’t know more than the manager (unless that manager is Steve Bruce).

 

But I can’t get away from the thought that I think Isak is a phenomenal footballer and we’re failing to make the most of his gifts.  

 

 

 

Think that part has been pretty obvious for a while tbh.

[Shearergol]

6 minutes ago, Mahoneys Tache said:

Maybe toned down the training to avoid all the injuries. 

 

We barely trained last season did we?

[Sibierski]

1 hour ago, TheBrownBottle said:

It absolutely broke our squad last year.  We’ve got too many injury-prone players to actually play like that for an extended period.

 

We needed to evolve into a different playing style - spunking lots of money usually allows you to do that.  As yet, we haven’t evolved.  I’m fully prepared to give Howe time to evolve the style - though to date there’s been little indication that he will. 

Weren’t most of the injuries just a bit freakish rather than muscle strains? 
 

I believe the squad can still play high intensity, just requires Isak coming off after 60-70 mins for Osula so the press doesn’t go to shit because he’s shagged (like we saw plenty of times last season). 

 

Like if there’s some use from Almiron/Murphy, it’s pressing. 

[KaKa]

13 minutes ago, Shearergol said:

 

We barely trained last season did we?

 

This is interesting actually.

 

Not necessarily the right approach for injury prevention, as there's specific training that needs to be done to help with that.

 

These are the sorts of things Bunce should be helping with, and so hope that's the case.

[TheBrownBottle]

20 minutes ago, Sibierski said:

Weren’t most of the injuries just a bit freakish rather than muscle strains? 
 

I believe the squad can still play high intensity, just requires Isak coming off after 60-70 mins for Osula so the press doesn’t go to shit because he’s shagged (like we saw plenty of times last season). 

 

Like if there’s some use from Almiron/Murphy, it’s pressing. 

Some were, but the style does increase the chances of suffering injuries

 

We’ve got a very injury-prone squad, either way 

[JEToon]

I had expected us to look a lot more drilled and more energetic given our schedule this season.

 

I could understand an element of getting by last season, a lot of the work load was new to Howe and something different to deal with, but this season we are back to a schedule of play he is used to.

 

 

[Cf]

47 minutes ago, SUPERTOON said:

This discussion really does highlight how poorly we built the squad tbh.

 

I think this is a little harsh based on what we were left with after Ashley.

 

We could have definitely done better. But we could certainly have done much worse.

 

We've managed 4th/7th so far with the business we have done, and despite a rocky start to the season I think 7th+ could still be on the cards this season.

 

Our transfer business was never going to be 100% right.

[The Butcher]

Plenty of managers have created possession styled teams with worse players than ours.

 

It's not Howe's style.

 

If the pressing doesn't work, nowt else will work, imo. It's just not him.

 

 

[Super Duper Branko Strupar]

Are the people saying possession based football not being Howes style just people that never watched his Bournemouth side? Or just haven't listened to him talking about wanting to implement more possession based football since he first arrived. He went on about it loads when he first joined, but that they were all working with what we had.

 

Im guessing some of it is just lack of awareness, some of it is disingenuous. Whether it's working as intended or not ATM is a different question.

[Sibierski]

1 hour ago, TheBrownBottle said:

Some were, but the style does increase the chances of suffering injuries

 

We’ve got a very injury-prone squad, either way 

I think whilst we’ve got the many limited players we have, the pressing high intensity is needed. It masks their technical flaws IMO. Can’t evolve the side too much if likes of Longstaff etc are having more of the ball in possession. 

 

Feels squad in bit of a shit place, and Howe caught in two minds to how to move forward. 

[JEToon]

surely by default nigh on every team has to be coached to be possession based to some level, otherwise you end up with the Brighton game when you have a load of the ball, but look like you don't really know what to do with it. 

 

it's a bit deluded to think you can just get to press all the time, during games you are going to end up playing teams who don't actually want to be pressed or care if they are being pressed, you do need a form of quality when you have the ball, and that has been one of our biggest issues this season, and the idea that is solely down to the players isn't an idea I personally agree with, we have a lot of good football players 

 

there is a lot of copy cat coaching in the league, if teams find out a flaw in a team others will typically copy it and expose it 

 

 

Edited 22 hours ago by JEToon

[Dr Jinx]

2 hours ago, r0cafella said:

So this is a big question mark that needs to be resolved imo. Is it he/we as a team press in a manner which isn't efficient? Is it a lack of application on his part? Is it poor strength and condition preparing? 

 

You're asking the wrong question.

 

If other teams can win more than we do by putting in less effort on that front, then isn't the fundamental principal of what we're doing inefficient?

 

It's tactical. And unfortunately, it's what our whole style of play is based around.

 

Eddie Howe isn't going to have an epiphany and come up with something better. He's spent years developing something he feels is the right way and he'll die on that hill.

[yiman]

For me Eddys key issue is the midfield. We have depth in numbers and a good mix of skills and technique but the right mix and balance as a unit is not there ,certainly this year. At times last year we did boss midfield in some matches but not in all styles of opponents setup. Currently it’s not working so he has to solve the problem with the resources he has. Of course the other parts of the team affect how successful the midfield is but if he can get the balance and mix right so we are competitive in the middle in every game that would be a step forward  for me. Challenge is that means a degree of change/experimentation beyond Sandro/Bruno/Big Joe.

[Kanji]

Club should open up the HR inbox for the amount of rock solid tacticians we have on here. 

 

 

Edited 21 hours ago by Kanji

[Holmesy]

3 hours ago, STM said:

 

Eddie Howe is a manager who's philosophy is pressing, high energy football (I agree we aren't seeing much of it at the moment). 

 

Asking him to change (evolve) won't work and isn't necessary. Klopp won loads playing a similar way. Also you don't hire a manager and then ask them to change. Imagine asking Pep to play more direct?

 

Howe could change his formation or his line up and keep the same philosophy.

 

And while I agree that this style is taxing on the players, the answer isn't to change the manager, it's to change the players.

 

If you won't a manager more possession based, that's totally understandable, just don't ask Howe to do it. A complete waste of time IMO.

Interestingly, I think I heard that Man City have played more direct balls than any other team this season (unless I dreamt it).
The different between Pep and every other manager is he continually iterates, evolves and adapts. All build around possession-based football but never standing still and becoming stale.
This Man City team are a far cry from his vintage Barca tika-taka team but still ruthlessly efficient. Every time he sees teams starting to find ways to combat his tactics, he changes it up eg. by going more direct.

 

Asking Eddie to change isn't something the club should ever do, but expecting him to continually improve and evolve should be. It should be a requisite of any manager we hire.