Sven Botman

[El Prontonise]

That was painful watching him play today.

[kenlau88210]

2 hours ago, The College Dropout said:

The goal is 50:50 between them both.  Botman should never give Tavernier an opportunity to shoot. He should command the entire sequence and clear it at the worst.  
 

Ramsdale  should be sweeping that up easy.  It’s typical of how hesitant he is off his line. The goal is scored near the 6 yard box ffs. He won’t even domnate that area even if he got there at the last it’s a sign of the lack of command he has in general.  Pope looks to get that ball as soon as the pass is made. 
 

Biggest factor is 2 players not used to playing with each other 

 

 

 

 

If you watch the highlights, you will probably change your mind. No way would you say again it's 50:50 between Ramsdale and Botman. Botman was 100% at fault, he had to take control there and clear the ball. BDB would not let that happen if he was on the pitch

[Fak]

2 minutes ago, Rod said:

Out of form for over a year?

 

He hasn't been playing shit for over a year Rod you and I both know that. 

[Lush Vlad]

2 hours ago, Shak said:

He doesn’t look good and I would strongly be in favour of selling and getting someone else in.

 

That said, I think anyone blaming him for the third goal is nuts.

 

 

The ball has just been played here. Taverniwr gets to it about two yards outside the six yard box. Ramsdale must be standing about three yards from where the ball ultimately next gets touched, Botman redirects Tavernier enough that it should be a very easy claim for an even somewhat competent goalkeeper.

 

Don’t think I can blame Botman for not just assuming his keeper wouldn’t come and claim a routine through ball.

I can see both sides mate. That was I think the 4th time this afternoon I was wondering when Ramsdale might come into frame. But he just never appeared. I think a couple of his saves were from

him just not coming out in the first place. 
 

However, at that stage of the game. You can’t sort of try and shepherd the player and shield the ball for such a long time. I felt like he had ample time to get to the ball and just clear his lines. 
 

Both take some blame. But Botman could have dealt with it to stop Ramsdale’s shit positioning from mattering. 
 

Thiaw doesn’t help matters, either. Sort of just wanders over in his own time and doesn’t do anything  
 

“Alright lads. What’s going on here then…. Ah fuck. They’ve scored.”

[Yorkie]

Page 359 onwards for evidence of 'out of form for a year.'

[Rod]

Just now, Fak said:

 

He hasn't been playing shit for over a year Rod you and I both know that. 

He has been very poor for over a year. When he first signed, his passing range and reading of the game were excellent. When he first got injured, I'm guessing  about a year ago, he regressed massively. He's never been the same since. I see him now in our team and cringe. I honestly think he's that poor. That's never going to improve. It kills me to say it but .......

Get rid. He's a traitor.

Edit: I got carried away at the end of my post. I still think he's a Faithful but a poor Faithful. 😳

[Fak]

[RUHRLYASLEEVESUP]

Progress being made on his new improved contract

Reckon Eddie knows more than most 

[Colos Short and Curlies]

I get we need this now, but he's going to be making people take back their judgements next season

[Sandrotastico]

Just in from the game - He was very poor today and 100% to blame for that late goal, aswell as a few other moments where he's lost track of where he was positioning wise.

 

He's never been blessed with pace but just coming back, he looked like he was running in mud towards the end. (as a few were understandably).

Let's hope he can get up to match fitness and find old form. He's still a player, just a rusty one right now.

 

 

 

Edited January 10 by Sandrotastico

[arnonel]

Why can't we just support our players. Why is everyone shit? It's tiring 

[Rod]

1 minute ago, Colos Short and Curlies said:

I get we need this now, but he's going to be making people take back their judgements next season

Don't think so. Is he suddenly going to turn into Alan Welles (no googling).

[RUHRLYASLEEVESUP]

2 minutes ago, Rod said:

Don't think so. Is he suddenly going to turn into Alan Welles (no googling).

Wells Surely Rodders 

[Rod]

1 minute ago, arnonel said:

Why can't we just support our players. Why is everyone shit? It's tiring 

If they are playing shit then tell them. Simples. I slag them off in here but would NEVER ever do it in the stadium. 

[The Prophet]

24 minutes ago, Yorkie said:

Page 359 onwards for evidence of 'out of form for a year.'

 

As established with Elanga, once some fans turn on a player, that's it, anything good they do is ignored and every mistake is met with maximum scrutiny.

[Andy]

He's had good and bad games like almost everyone else this season. However, his apparent loss of agility is definitely a concern, as he tries to make up for it by defending deeper than our other defenders a lot of the time.

 

He generally still looks great when we're backs-to-the-wall, but when we're pushing on he is getting caught out quite frequently this season. A lot of that will be rustiness, but it's hard not to wonder if injuries have caught up and it's just a permanent feature of his game now. 

[The College Dropout]

1 hour ago, kenlau88210 said:

 

If you watch the highlights, you will probably change your mind. No way would you say again it's 50:50 between Ramsdale and Botman. Botman was 100% at fault, he had to take control there and clear the ball. BDB would not let that happen if he was on the pitch

I could agree to say it’s fundamentally Botmans fault. He needs to control the situation. 
 

But from where the pass is played to where to the shot is taken it’s criminal that the goalie doesn’t come to collect it. Absolutely glued to his line until the last - doesn’t read the situation at all, he’s far too deep from the start.  It’s just totally the wrong attitude. 
 

Pope will have moments like Auba where he comes out and totally misjudges.  But he’s always looking to relieve pressure from his defenders by sweeping up. It also requires a different level of mental awareness.  any ball played in behind or in the air - Pope is anticipating and making a decision whether to come out or not. He’s ready to come out.  When you play like that you’re always switched on because you’re always making decisions. 
 

But Ramsdale will have a lot more moments like today.  Absolutely not engaging with the threat and the game until it’s too late.  Everyone has to defend more. 
 

Being comfortable with the ball doesn’t change that.  
 

If Howe had Pope instead of Ramsdale Bournemouth would never have been relegated. I think he’s learnt a lesson there. 

[The College Dropout]

From what I saw Botman looked bad but he’s not match sharp.  I’ve been Burn > Botman all season but I’m not calling Botman finished. He’s not match sharp. He needs to stay fit for the rest of the season and then we can make a call on him.  

 

 

Edited January 10 by The College Dropout

[Geordie_once_removed]

He didn't look fit today at all. Moving uncomfortably all game and second guessing himself as a result.

[kenlau88210]

10 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

I could agree to say it’s fundamentally Botmans fault. He needs to control the situation. 
 

But from where the pass is played to where to the shot is taken it’s criminal that the goalie doesn’t come to collect it. Absolutely glued to his line until the last - doesn’t read the situation at all, he’s far too deep from the start.  It’s just totally the wrong attitude. 
 

Pope will have moments like Auba where he comes out and totally misjudges.  But he’s always looking to relieve pressure from his defenders by sweeping up. It also requires a different level of mental awareness.  any ball played in behind or in the air - Pope is anticipating and making a decision whether to come out or not. He’s ready to come out.  When you play like that you’re always switched on because you’re always making decisions. 
 

But Ramsdale will have a lot more moments like today.  Absolutely not engaging with the threat and the game until it’s too late.  Everyone has to defend more. 
 

Being comfortable with the ball doesn’t change that.  
 

If Howe had Pope instead of Ramsdale Bournemouth would never have been relegated. I think he’s learnt a lesson there. 

 

I just re-watched it again. If you were Ramsdale or Thiaw, you fully expect Botman to clear the ball. I re-watched a couple of times and still struggle to understand why people said Ramsdale should be expected to sweep that. That ball was a weighted pass, and it stopped/came close to a stop near the corner of the box. Botman's defending was absolutely atrocious. Terrible instinct to prioritise holding off the player instead of taking control and clear the ball. 

[Sir Joel Inton]

Botman should have dealt with it when it was clear Ramsdale was sellotaped to his goal line but it’s mainly on Ramsdale that goal. 
 

Botman held the player up sufficiently for Ramsdale to claim it. He couldn’t have predicted that Ramsdale was once again away with the fairies and ignoring what was in front of him.

[alexf]

I don't think anyone can take anything from today as any indication that he is done or finished. If it wasn't for the fact there were no other fit defenders available he wouldn't have likely started but definitely not played 120+ minutes of the back of 30+ mins a few days ago. 

 

His worst mistake came at 120mins. Go figure. I also don't blame him completely, Ramsdale didn't come for anything all day which makes the defense nervous. Neither did I think we protected him very well today considering we knew hew wasn't up to speed yet, we got done on turnovers often and left them exposed at times. 

 

Yes I agree he has been mostly poor since his first injury, his lack of mobility is a real issue when exposed.

 

However... There was a period maybe two years ago when Dan Burn was returning from injury and looked shocking at times, exactly like Botman at times. But over time Burn got his confidence, his rhythm and sharpness by playing games and turned into the reliant beast he has been over the past 18 months.

 

So it's not impossible for him to get back to some kind of form in future but he needs to stay healthy and play lots of games. It's been so long since he had a consistent run of games without breaking down.

[Guillaume]

He's not getting back to what he was, injury has finished him. He'll be snapping the clubs hands off to sign a new deal.

[TRC]

1 hour ago, Andy said:

He's had good and bad games like almost everyone else this season. However, his apparent loss of agility is definitely a concern, as he tries to make up for it by defending deeper than our other defenders a lot of the time.

 

He generally still looks great when we're backs-to-the-wall, but when we're pushing on he is getting caught out quite frequently this season. A lot of that will be rustiness, but it's hard not to wonder if injuries have caught up and it's just a permanent feature of his game now. 

He was never that quick to begin with tbf

[Super Duper Branko Strupar]

1 hour ago, Andy said:

He's had good and bad games like almost everyone else this season. However, his apparent loss of agility is definitely a concern, as he tries to make up for it by defending deeper than our other defenders a lot of the time.

 

He generally still looks great when we're backs-to-the-wall, but when we're pushing on he is getting caught out quite frequently this season. A lot of that will be rustiness, but it's hard not to wonder if injuries have caught up and it's just a permanent feature of his game now. 

 

Aye he's not been close enough recently.