Sven Botman

[Fezzle]

[Zero]

No fucking way we don’t go that route if the medical team final advice is “surgery”

 

and instead we keep on playing him 90 mins every game.

 

jesus Christ

[GEFAFWISP]

I can't believe Ashworth has done this to us.

[Theregulars]

To me that came across as throwing Botman under the bus a little. 

[arnonel]

Love the idea a doctor can tell me what to do and I just have to accept and do it

[arnonel]

48 minutes ago, frankpingel said:

Don't think people are saying we should have physically forced the op but simply have done everything (more) to convince him it was the best and only long term solution.

Eddie confirmed they did try

 

Why don't we trust out manager/team?

[frankpingel]

4 minutes ago, arnonel said:

Eddie confirmed they did try

 

Why don't we trust out manager/team?

Have you listened to the press conference? Especially the second journalists further questioning, Eddie Howe does suggest Botman trusted his own judgement/body over what the manager/team wanted. 

 

[healthyaddiction]

18 minutes ago, arnonel said:

Eddie confirmed they did try

 

Why don't we trust out manager/team?

Why doesn't Botman trust the advice of the manager/team? Has Eddie lost the dressing room?

[TheHoob]

Had him playing at 75% all season then this, worst of both worlds. Hopefully getting surgery helps sort him a bit mentally and stop him playing within himself. 

[Cf]

Doesn't sound like a huge deal to me. Sounds like it was somewhat 50/50 whether the surgery was required, medical team erred on the side of caution to get it done, and Botman presented with the options decided he wanted to proceed without. He knows his own body and I'm sure there'll have been scans etc as time went on. 

 

Just yet another injury related issue that's fallen the wrong way for us. 

[Cf]

Howe's comments though are a little more fanning the flames than we've come to expect. 

 

"There was conflicting advice from specialists as to whether surgery was required or not. Between the player and our medical team we decided to proceed without and monitor the situation as time went on. In hindsight surgery might have been the better choice but it wasn't a clear cut decision".

 

Done. 

[The Butcher]

2 minutes ago, Cf said:

Doesn't sound like a huge deal to me. Sounds like it was somewhat 50/50 whether the surgery was required, medical team erred on the side of caution to get it done, and Botman presented with the options decided he wanted to proceed without. He knows his own body and I'm sure there'll have been scans etc as time went on. 

 

Just yet another injury related issue that's fallen the wrong way for us. 

You don't know your own body when it comes to first time ACL injuries mind.

[Kanj]

Shadow puppets had pretty much told us that specialists also said no surgery needed if he rests and heals up. So that’s what he went with and it didn’t work out.

[Cf]

Just now, The Butcher said:

You don't know your own body when it comes to first time ACL injuries mind.

 

In that sense perhaps not but surgery entails risks. Risks someone might not want to take with their body when some medical experts are telling them they don't think you need it. 

[Kanj]

Just now, Cf said:

 

In that sense perhaps not but surgery entails risks. Risks someone might not want to take with their body when some medical experts are telling them they don't think you need it. 

Are you at all shocked that NO has posters who are appalled the club didn’t MAKE Sven get surgery?

[et tu brute]

What a fucking balls up with this injury. He had a slight tear on his ACL and he's still allowed to play. It's been totally obvious that he was nowhere near ok to play and according to Howe  the medical team advised him to get the surgery. The player should have been told that if he wasn't going to get surgery then he wouldn't be playing. I wonder if Botman would be still wanting to play if a certain tournament wasn't taking place this summer. So now we have had a player totally being sub standard as a result of an injury and is now facing a minimum of 9 months out due to this injury, when he should have been in for surgery when it first occurred. Absolute shambles.

 

 

Edited March 29, 2024 by et tu brute

[TRon]

1 hour ago, frankpingel said:

Don't think people are saying we should have physically forced the op but simply have done everything (more) to convince him it was the best and only long term solution.

 

Yep. Feels like we went with the fingers crossed decision rather than than the safest one. Maybe there's some hindsight in there, but given our awful injury situation this season, it feels like we are getting these decisions wrong more often than right.

[madras]

6 minutes ago, Kanji said:

Shadow puppets had pretty much told us that specialists also said no surgery needed if he rests and heals up. So that’s what he went with and it didn’t work out.

But where's the blame ?

[Cf]

Just now, madras said:

But where's the blame ?

 

Not everything needs blame apportioned. 

[Kanj]

Again, the medical team cleared him to play AFTER rest, rehab and regular scans and doctors and the club deemed he had healed. However, his knee failed again. rotten luck, and yeah surgery probably would have been the better bet in hindsight. 
 

^all stuff Shadow Puppets has confirmed before. 

[Kanj]

1 minute ago, madras said:

But where's the blame ?

On Nickson for scouting him obv. 

[Abacus]

1 minute ago, Cf said:

Howe's comments though are a little more fanning the flames than we've come to expect. 

 

"There was conflicting advice from specialists as to whether surgery was required or not. Between the player and our medical team we decided to proceed without and monitor the situation as time went on. In hindsight surgery might have been the better choice but it wasn't a clear cut decision".

 

Done. 

 

If that's what happened, I think that's what Howe has to say rather than keep this in-house. It would only take one specialist or Botman himself to come out and deny this version of events for the whole thing to come tumbling down.

 

I guess the thing here is that, if, with hindsight, it was the wrong call that they do learn from this. Maybe it was a coin toss decision that could have gone the right way and everyone would have been congratulating themselves, but from the outside it does seem a gamble in retrospect.

 

Incidentally, if the advice was to rest to avoid surgery, maybe he should have just actually rested instead of playing professional football repeatedly.

[madras]

1 minute ago, Cf said:

 

Not everything needs blame apportioned. 

Are you new here ?

[TRon]

3 minutes ago, Kanji said:

Again, the medical team cleared him to play AFTER rest, rehab and regular scans and doctors and the club deemed he had healed. However, his knee failed again. rotten luck, and yeah surgery probably would have been the better bet in hindsight. 
 

^all stuff Shadow Puppets has confirmed before. 

 

There were specialists who advised an op immediately and some who didn't. It was diagnosed as a slight tear, which is not like it was just feeling a bit sore. Maybe we should lean more towards the more cautious specialists in future.

[Kanj]

3 minutes ago, Abacus said:

 

If that's what happened, I think that's what Howe has to say rather than keep this in-house. It would only take one specialist or Botman himself to come out and deny this version of events for the whole thing to come tumbling down.

 

I guess the thing here is that, if, with hindsight, it was the wrong call that they do learn from this. Maybe it was a coin toss decision that could have gone the right way and everyone would have been congratulating themselves, but from the outside it does seem a gamble in retrospect.

 

Incidentally, if the advice was to rest to avoid surgery, maybe he should have just actually rested instead of playing professional football repeatedly.

Did you magically forget he was out for some time, resting and rehabbing? People are going on here like he played every single match this season on a torn ACL. 
 

for the millionth time the doctors at club and outside the club cleared him to play. Scans revealed he had healed.