The defence next season

[WillingtonMag]

Wondered what people's views were on our back four going into next season and where do we look to improve. Know some times after a big defeat it's easy to blame the defence but hopefully when the rest of the team improves the defence will be under less pressure and heavy defeats will become more rare. Obviously we know Trippier is good enough and I like Schar could we do better than Burn and Targett though? both seem pretty solid and better than we've had in recent years but if we want to push on do we need to be more ambitious?

[SUPERTOON]

I think the only guaranteed starter for next season is Trippier. I expect a new LB and CB In. No idea who out of Schar and Burn will be first choice.

[David Edgar]

I think we'd rather have 4 new players and Trippier.  

[bowlingcrofty]

I think Burn has shown that he’s a decent PL centre back but if we want to be challenging for 8th or so then he should really be back up. 
 

I’d like to see us go for Botman again.

[TheInfiniteOdyssey]

Burn looks badly exposed when he plays against the better sides in the league.

 

 

[Heron]

I think once Trippier is back in and we have another solid CB we'll be sound. Our issue centres more around our retention of possession and the quality/output of that possession at present. By retaining possession with more ease we'll be able to remove some of the pressure we often face against top sides. 

[WillingtonMag]

1 minute ago, SUPERTOON said:

I think the only guaranteed starter for next season is Trippier. I expect a new LB and CB In. No idea who out of Schar and Burn will be first choice.

Aye its a hard one to judge personally think Schar is the better defender out of the two but Burn is obviously a big presence so has benefits Schar doesn't

 

[SUPERTOON]

1 minute ago, WillingtonMag said:

Aye its a hard one to judge personally think Schar is the better defender out of the two but Burn is obviously a big presence so has benefits Schar doesn't

 

From the players linked, it still seems Howe wants a left footed cb as well.

[WillingtonMag]

2 minutes ago, David Edgar said:

I think we'd rather have 4 new players and Trippier.  

How many players in total are we realistically going to bring in though and got to think we'd definitely want another midfielder, striker, right winger and maybe a goal keeper?

[WillingtonMag]

1 minute ago, SUPERTOON said:

From the players linked, it still seems Howe wants a left footed cb as well.

Wonder if we try again for Carlos?

[SUPERTOON]

Just now, WillingtonMag said:

Wonder if we try again for Carlos?

I’d hope we go for someone a bit younger tbh, I was never convinced by him and think there are better options. Ideally we need to inject pace into the defence (ideally all over the pitch).

[The Prophet]

We'll most likely bin Clark, Fede, and Ritchie. Then sign Targett permanently and upgrade one of the CB positions. That'll leave us with a first choice of:

 

Trippier-Schar/Burn-New CB-Targett

 

...and a second choice of:

 

Krafth-Lascelles-Burn/Schar-Lewis/Dummet.

 

That means we could also switch to a back three.

[Joey Linton]

6 minutes ago, TheInfiniteOdyssey said:

Burn looks badly exposed when he plays against the better sides in the league.

 

 

When he plays without Schar. 

[HaydnNUFC]

Trippier, Schar, new CB and either a new LB or Targett. Not fussed which. I like Dan Burn but he often gets a rush of blood and storms out of position towards the ball and that exposes us more often than not; happened a couple times today, at Spurs and at Everton. He also can be a bit rash, got very angry in the second half at Rodri(?) for a reason I don't know.

[Kanji]

Trip - Schar - New CB - New LB. 

[WillingtonMag]

Aye kind of what inspired the thread was a feeling that Burn probably isn't good enough despite some good performances but felt a bit harsh as he's played a big part in us staying up.

 

 

Edited May 8, 2022 by WillingtonMag

[Kanji]

Burn is a good player, but he’s a backup at best for me. I really like him and think he’s kind of class when he’s putting in his shift. But there’s a damn good reason why we were linked with 30m+ CBs in Jan. 

[Paullow]

Trippier obviously fine. Jury out on Targett - he would be a familiar face instead of a(nother) completely new one, which could be important, but he's probably mid table at best / bottom half, and Villa looking to replace him does kind of suggest something. I think a quality CB is essential, whether we go back to Carlos or Botman (if not Milan bound), or someone completely new, and then Schaar and Burn rotating will probably be fine for a year, before improving again the following season. I'd put Dubravka in a similar boat, lower mid table, could certainly do better, but probably fine for at least one more season. So:

 

--------------------------------Dubravka-------------------------------------

 

Trippier--------------New CB-------Burn/Schaar-------------New LB / Targett

 

[brummie]

1 hour ago, Paullow said:

Trippier obviously fine. Jury out on Targett - he would be a familiar face instead of a(nother) completely new one, which could be important, but he's probably mid table at best / bottom half, and Villa looking to replace him does kind of suggest something. I think a quality CB is essential, whether we go back to Carlos or Botman (if not Milan bound), or someone completely new, and then Schaar and Burn rotating will probably be fine for a year, before improving again the following season. I'd put Dubravka in a similar boat, lower mid table, could certainly do better, but probably fine for at least one more season. So:

 

--------------------------------Dubravka-------------------------------------

 

Trippier--------------New CB-------Burn/Schaar-------------New LB / Targett

 

 

 

We've already replaced Targett with Digne.

 

I like him as a player, but he'd be second fiddle here and it really depends whether he fancies that.

 

I genuinely wouldn't be at all surprised to see Ashley Young get another year as back up and Targett go.

[Abacus]

The current first choice back line has mostly been good under Howe, so I don't want to exaggerate any problems after a bad result.

 

I also don't know how much the weaknesses the back 4 have are due to deficiencies in other parts of the team. 

 

For example, whilst I like Dubs, I'd probably upgrade there and have him as my backup. Just having a keeper communicating more to the defence on when he's got a ball covered, organising them more or coming to claim the ball in a commanding way immediately takes the pressure off the central defence and makes them look better. Likewise, not spilling shots back out into dangerous areas.

 

Also, whilst Shelvey has done an OK job there, he's not a specialist defensive midfielder, so that again exposes your defence. Longstaff being there today exposed them even more as he was pretty anonymous. Although, in fairness, de Bruyne was all but unplayable.

 

Then at left back, Targett has been very dependable, but sometimes exposed against top teams. Without wishing to get into that argument again, though, some of that will be down to the gaps ASM leaves him to cover, which you just can't do against the best.

 

All that aside, a central defender is a must - both Schar and Burn have their strengths and weaknesses, but either would improve with a quality first choice addition there.

 

Targett - I'd probably bring him in, but longer term I'd like another specialist LB too.

 

 

Edited May 8, 2022 by Abacus

[Paullow]

21 minutes ago, brummie said:

 

 

We've already replaced Targett with Digne.

 

I like him as a player, but he'd be second fiddle here and it really depends whether he fancies that.

 

I genuinely wouldn't be at all surprised to see Ashley Young get another year as back up and Targett go.

Sorry yeah, I realise that wasn't the most clear sentence. What I meant was a(n albeit fellow ambitious) Villa side who finished mid table last year and have been in the bottom half for about 90% of this one, looking to replace him (at the time) kind of says that they don't think he's good enough for where they ultimately want to go, so we should perhaps be having the same mindset, even if he was largely been good / solid since he came in.

 

He'd certainly be fine for next season, but I'd think we'd be looking for better after that, and then he would pretty much be in the same situation as he was at Villa in a years time, and he obviously didn't fancy waiting in the wings at your place, so would surely be similar here.

[nemtizz]

A DM will drastically improve our defence. 
 

CB and keeper are imperative, though. 

[Dr Jinx]

Can’t be too harsh on Burn, if he wasn’t here we’d be down perhaps.

 

I think him and Schär deserve a place in the squad but the observations about him playing the bigger teams is true. He loses his cool too easily and then looks to be a liability. Schär also has that element to him, he’s a better footballer than all of the other cb’s but he also gets found out at a certain level.

 

The question is, what’s our aim? Certainly not just survival again. Top 10? Yeah sure but what does that actually do for you? 

 

It would have to be top 6, or at least whatever the Europa place will be at?

 

We currently don’t have anyone consistent enough to take us that high right now.

[Dr Jinx]

The red lines are the easy decisions on who has to/ probably will go.

 

I still think there will be harder ones to make, like ASM for example but maybe that will be for the following season.

[Wolfcastle]

Depends on what each of our objectives are.

For those of us that are fine with midtable, no relegation battle and looking to Europe, Dubs, Targett and Burn are fine for that.

Be looking at too much of a new team to upgrade them specifically, though there's too much smoke about a keeper. New centre-back is pretty imperative. I'd see whoever it is as partnering Schar/Burn whilst one of them replaces Lascelles.

CF, CM, CB.

 

 

Edited May 8, 2022 by Wolfcastle