Still not worthy of a thread

[Erikse]

Had a dream that we tried out the 4-4-2 formation against Spurs, but they beat us 7-6. Somehow Wilson had 3 goals and 4 assists despite us scoring just 6. The game before that he had 3 goals and 3 assists, but I don't remember the opponent or the result in that one.

 

 

Edited November 15, 2023 by Erikse

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Erikse said:

Had a dream that we tried out the 4-4-2 formation, and that lead to Spurs beating us 7-6. Somehow Wilson had 3 goals and 4 assists despite us scoring just 6. The game before that he had 3 goals and 3 assists, but I don't remember the opponent or the result in that one.

 

 

 

 

Sounds like FM24 tbh

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Paully said:

Shock!

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/nov/15/chelsea-fc-face-new-questions-over-how-roman-abramovich-funded-success

 

Aye, Todd Bohley is saying because he helped them investigate and it wasn't him, Chelsea shouldn't be punished. But the sad thing here is, if his team were able to sus these payments out (Eto and William) while doing due dillegence then why the hell weren't the EPL accountants?

[Yorkie]

Had an NUFC dream myself last night. We were 2-0 down against Milan before getting it back to 2-2 with a late equaliser from Elliott Anderson. Next thing I know we've won 5-4 and a very sour Roberto Mancini (Milan's manager) is throwing money at Eddie Howe after the game. 

[gbandit]

2 hours ago, OCK said:

 

Aye, Todd Bohley is saying because he helped them investigate and it wasn't him, Chelsea shouldn't be punished. But the sad thing here is, if his team were able to sus these payments out (Eto and William) while doing due dillegence then why the hell weren't the EPL accountants?

Interesting that Newcastle are faced with a 10-month ban for Tonali due to his actions at Milan. There need to be punishments for Chelsea for any historical actions of corruption in the same way that Olympic athletes are stripped of their medals years down the line 

[wormy]

It'll be some bollocks about 'not fair on the fans to be punished for previous ownership's misdeeds' all while footballing authorities continue to spaff their pants rotten over lower league clubs going to the wall because they let the poor sods get taken over by chancers.

[Joelinton7]

2 hours ago, OCK said:

 

Sounds like FM24 tbh

So his dreams are scripted

[Guest]

37 minutes ago, Yorkie said:

Had an NUFC dream myself last night. We were 2-0 down against Milan before getting it back to 2-2 with a late equaliser from Elliott Anderson. Next thing I know we've won 5-4 and a very sour Roberto Mancini (Milan's manager) is throwing money at Eddie Howe after the game. 

 

I need to see this animated in the style of those cheap chinese CGI news reports. 

[OCOCOL]

17 hours ago, Charlies said:

Toys out the pram from the horse botherer 

 

 

 

Well done he's 13...

 

[rgk_lfc]

Rumors that Everton are going to be hit with a 12 point deduction due to FFP breaches.

[Kid Icarus]

Honestly if there's a season for them to luck out and take the hit it's this season. They're noticeably not as bad as the last few years and the promoted teams are almost all write offs. 

[lxsln]

If you are bored.. Article in a swedish newspaper. I copied the text and ran in GT, hence the text about pictures.

 

 

Some claim that Newcastle sold their soul to Saudi Arabia, others that it was a necessary evil.

The big question is: Who is responsible?

It's a perfectly normal Tuesday in October on Tyneside. Cloudy, with imminent risk of rain, and a couple of degrees colder compared to the capital, London, roughly 45 miles from here.

Outside the heart of Newcastle, St James' Park, a retired couple from York are taking pictures of their two teenage grandchildren in front of the statue of club legend Alan Shearer.

The man was born in Newcastle and thus got the supporter status in the bargain. Now he is happy that the grandchildren are studying at the city's university, a stone's throw from the arena.

- We will never get out of here now. He can talk football all afternoon, his wife says with a laugh, nodding at her better half.

Generally, English people from the northern parts of the country are just like this family, more open compared to the stressed Londoners and charming with their broad dialects.

On one long side of St James' Park are portraits of the club's current players. Somewhere in the middle hangs Alexander Isak, an image that stands out for two reasons.

For one thing, it is placed a couple of notches lower compared to his teammates. In addition, Isak is wearing Newcastle United's green away shirt instead of the classic black and white stripes.

Photo: Nils Petter Nilsson
A little boy walks by with his father and puts his hands on the Swede, looks up at his smiling face.
That green shirt may go unnoticed by most people, but its symbolic value is enormous.

It is pretty much the only physical sign that this city in north-east England is now heavily influenced by a Gulf state.

 
To really get to know Newcastle's residents - so-called Geordies - in depth, a trip back in time is required.

During the Industrial Revolution of 1750–1850, Newcastle flourished, mainly thanks to the discovery of coal. With its strategic location on the coast, shipbuilding and heavy industry also became important for the city.

After the end of the Second World War, more and more industries disappeared and thus also job opportunities.

1980s Newcastle is described as a depressing place, where unemployment was high and the city center deserted in the evenings. Anyone who ventured out into the streets after dark did best to look over their shoulder.

The divisions in the country increased and to this day there is a palpable division between the southern and northern parts of England. Studies show that people living in the south live longer and have access to better education and better infrastructure compared to their compatriots in the north.

High unemployment also leads to poverty, a widespread problem in Newcastle. Between 2015 and 2020, there was a marked increase in children living in poverty, from 28.4 percent to 41.2 percent.

The general increase for the rest of the country was just over two percent.

- The figures that have been published are terrible. They are not just numbers or statistics, these are innocent children who are suffering, commented Nick Forbes from the municipal board.

- We want to ask the government to show its support for the families and get our country back on track. The government needs to take action to help us end inequality and lift families out of the poverty trap that so many are caught in.

Photo: Nils Petter Nilsson
Newcastle residents have long felt abandoned by the UK government and its lack of investment.

Britain breaking away from the EU worsened the situation as even more businesses left the area (it should be said that Newcastle, by a narrow majority, voted to remain).

Since 2010, the municipality has been forced to make cuts of 335 million pounds, roughly four billion kroner.

Once actors appear who are willing to pump in money, it will thus be difficult for the city to say no.

- The Saudis' investments were the first real attempt to revive Newcastle, explains Jacob Whitehead, a reporter at The Athletic who has scrutinized Saudi Arabia's dealings in the north-east of England more closely than most.

An important piece of the puzzle became the football club, which had long been run half-heartedly under the leadership of British entrepreneur Mike Ashley.

- I think it's fascinating to see how many parallels can be drawn between the football club and the city itself, says Whitehead.

- You have the club that lacked investment under Mike Ashley and when the takeover was completed many celebrated, above all because he disappeared from the picture. The same can be said about the city. It is not a matter of the Saudis investing, but of someone doing it.

Jacob Whitehead, reporter at The Athletic.
Jacob Whitehead, reporter at The Athletic.
Photo: Nils Petter Nilsson
Several of the most lucrative buildings in central Newcastle are owned by the Reuben family, Britain's second richest family and long-standing investors in the city.

The Reuben family also owns land around St James' Park as well as ten percent of the club, as does intermediary Amanda Staveley's company PCP Capital Partners.

 

PIF, the Saudi investment fund, is the majority owner with 80 percent.

Staveley, 50, from North Yorkshire, an hour's drive from Newcastle, became the face of negotiations with Mike Ashley and the Premier League. It should be added that she also had a hand in the game when the United Arab Emirates bought Manchester City in 2008.

- It's not sportswashing, it's an investment, Staveley said when the transition was finally approved and she was asked about Saudi Arabia's lack of human rights.

From being a bottom team in 2021, Newcastle now play Champions League games against Paris Saint Germain, Milan and Dortmund.

There is also a lot happening around the city. The municipal board has promised to invest more than SEK 18 billion in the city center itself and at the same time develop the harbor area.

Buildings owned by the Reuben family.
Buildings owned by the Reuben family.
Buildings owned by the Reuben family.
1 of 2
PHOTO: NILS PETTER NILSSON
But why Newcastle in particular? It is likely that Saudi Arabia was inspired by the UAE's investment and transformation of Manchester City over the past decade.

It also helped that Newcastle United were a relatively cheap buy.

- Through minimal investment, they got a foundation that has since grown at a furious pace over the past 18 months, explains Jacob Whitehead.

- For PIF, the club generates a lot of money, because the value has increased. At the same time, it extends far beyond that, it's not just about football. They invest in various sectors across the North East of England, including in Middlesbrough.

Whitehead cites an example following Newcastle's win at home to Arsenal in spring 2022. Then-chairman Majed Al-Sorour posted a video on LinkedIn showing the celebration from the owners' box at St James' Park.

One of the comments under the post reads: "This shows what can happen if you invest a little in the northeast", to which Al-Sorour replies: "Very soon we will turn to the city and the whole area and develop these for the better".

The video shows Britain's Saudi ambassador Prince Khalid bin Bandar Al Saud and his wife Lucy Cuthbert, a member of the Percy family that owns around eight percent of Northumberland (a county north of Newcastle) as well as properties on Tyneside and in London.

Newcastle United's management usually hold meetings at the Percy family's castle Alnwick, also known as Hogwarts in the first two Harry Potter films.

The heir George Percy has studied Arabic and worked in the Middle East in one of Saudi Arabia's main interests, renewable energy.

In the spring of 2022, it was announced that a Saudi conglomerate would invest close to a billion pounds in sustainable energy on Teesside, the area around Middlesbrough.

Coincidentally, former Prime Minister Boris Johnson happened to be in Riyadh at the same time.

Photo: Nils Petter Nilsson
The day before Newcastle's home game against Dortmund, The Strawberry is half-full, mainly occupied by visiting away supporters.
The pub is well known in football circles, mainly because it is next door to St James' Park.

Charlotte Robson looks out the window at the newly built high-rises at the back of the pub.

- They don't really fit in, do they?, she says and sweeps her arm meaningfully in the charmingly worn pub.

It should be added that the aforementioned Reuben family is behind the buildings. Jamie Reuben, son of David, is seen as the direct co-owner of Newcastle United.

At every home game, he matches the donations to the club's own food bank - NUFC Foodbank - with the same amount that the organization collects.

- But then he also donates a lot of money to the conservative party whose policies contribute to poverty in the northern parts. So that's… Well, that's what it is, Robson notes.

 

She is one of the Newcastle supporters who is acutely aware of the moral dilemma of ownership.

Born and raised in the city, she loves the football club more than anything and runs a club-related podcast and YouTube channel. At the same time, she realizes that Saudi Arabia's governance is not in line with her own ideology.

- I know that Newcastle was built from the water up, but it feels more like the city was built around the club. Everyone agrees that this is the center point, explains Robson.

- There were a lot of big questions to address when the takeover happened, but mainly people just wanted their club back. They didn't want Mike Ashley. They wanted to see the city prosper.

Gradually, probably with the success on the pitch, more and more supporters have let go of the idea of the owners as problematic.

- For many, it has been tough to come to terms with the new owners. For others, it has been very easy, explains Robson.

- They think, "why should it be up to me as a football fan to be some kind of moral police?" That it should be at the government level rather than the individual. Personally, I just thought "oh my god, everything is going to change" when the takeover was completed. Not just for the club but the whole region.

Newcastle supporter David.
Newcastle supporter David.
Photo: Nils Petter Nilsson
Of the Newcastle supporters visiting the pub this evening, it appears almost impossible to find anyone who completely dissociates himself from the owners.

David, who is in attendance with his mother and younger sister, toasts a couple of Dortmund fans before taking the plunge and delivering the straight answer:

- No one has ever cared about us. Why should we care now?

A long explanation follows about politics, the government and other things that are possibly not completely connected. He clearly goes into a defensive position and is eager to explain himself, to make me, as a Swedish Londoner, understand what it is really about.

Nobody ever cared about us. Why should we care now?
David, supporter
A little further into the pub sits a family who have traveled from the Midlands to support their team, father Gary, mother Nicola and daughters Sophie and Beth.

- My youngest daughter cried every time Newcastle lost in the past, which used to be often, says Gary, happily pointing to 18-year-old Beth.

On Monday night, the family sat in the audience during an event with Kevin Keegan and Eddie Howe. That the latter coach was seen in a public context less than 48 hours before such an important match is highly unusual.

- It was a really good evening, says 24-year-old Sophie, who has a Newcastle Brown Ale placed in front of her.

Gary, who is from Newcastle, gets to lead the family's case against the new owners. He agrees with the other respondents during the evening, that it is difficult to put the responsibility on the supporters in this case.

But Gary also has some admiration for the few who actually take the fight.

- I have no problem with people protesting outside the arena before matches. They must be allowed to think what they want, and everyone else must accept and respect that, he says.

Newcastle supporters Gary, Nicola, Sophie and Beth.
Newcastle supporters Gary, Nicola, Sophie and Beth.

 

For Hird, there was never any hesitation in airing his concerns about the club's chosen direction.

He mentions the German and Swedish model with the 51 percent rule, leagues where supporters have more opportunities to make a difference.

- It is not the ultimate solution in my opinion, but fans get more say and greater control over the sport, says Hird.

- I expected lots of fans to get involved in the campaign so I started writing articles on different supporter pages and got in touch with other people on social media. It's not about me being against the club in any way. I love Newcastle, I love the whole region. This is where I come from.

As a result, NUFC fans against sportswashing was founded.

- We were Newcastle fans for several decades before the Saudi regime stepped in and we will be fans when they disappear. I hope we manage to remove them. It is important that we put our foot down, he says.

Photo: Nils Petter Nilsson
Right from the start, there were suspicions that the British government was involved in the protracted affair in one way or another.

In April 2021, for example, parliamentary representative Chi Onwurah wondered how many discussions Boris Johnson had actually had regarding the takeover.

- These are commercial issues for the parties involved. The Government has at no time been involved in the sale of Newcastle United, the Prime Minister replied at the time.

Exactly two years later, The Athletic came across an email correspondence that again raised the question of whether the government was actually involved.

The new information indicated there was said to have been concern over the possible consequences of a collapsed deal, which was seen as a threat to the UK's relationship with Saudi Arabia.

In addition, the Prime Minister is believed to have received private text messages from the PIF chairman, who then flagged that the country's economy would be affected if the Premier League refused to approve the purchase.

That the issue is sensitive can explain the silence from politicians, not least on a regional level.

- Everyone here in Newcastle is on the same team. Criticism of the club is seen as criticism of the city. It is unimaginable that the ties are so strong between the two, says Jacob Whitehead and adds:

- A few individuals have spoken openly, but most do not want to.

Whitehead cites 58-year-old Chi Onwurah, MP for Newcastle since 2010, as an exception.

- She has stated that Saudi Arabia's values do not go hand in hand with Newcastle's and has expressed concern about what is going on in the country. But that hasn't necessarily led to any changes.

Criticism of the club is seen as criticism of the city. It is unimaginable that the bonds are so strong between the two
Jacob Whitehead, reporter at The Athletic
John Hird from NUFC fans against sportswashing is familiar with that silence, that many turn the other cheek.

During a peaceful protest in connection with Newcastle's meeting with Chelsea, the atmosphere was downright threatening.

- We were actually threatened, people who said they would beat us up. "We will do this and this to you". The only response we made was that, of course, the majority of Newcastle fans may not support our cause, but they agree that we have a right to express our opinion, says Hird.

- We are just ordinary supporters, not professionals in any way. Sometimes some people say "why don't you just shut up". But if we don't say anything, no one else will either.

Human rights activist Lina al-Hathloul, here during a gala for PEN America in New York in 2019.
Human rights activist Lina al-Hathloul, here during a gala for PEN America in New York in 2019.
Photo: Evan Agostini/AP
In recent years, the organization has collaborated with human rights activist Lina al-Hathloul, sister of Loujain al-Hathloul who was imprisoned because of her fight for gender equality in Saudi Arabia.

When Al-Hathloul visited Newcastle something happened.

- She did interviews for radio and television and it was interesting to see the reaction of the press corps, because the local media and football media had chosen to ignore the problems and only talk about football, says Hird.

- Here we have Lina whose sister led a campaign for women to be allowed to drive in Saudi Arabia and was imprisoned, tortured and exploited. When you have someone talk about such things, face to face, many people say "oh, I didn't know it was like that". This is the point! Saudi Arabia is taking advantage of our club.

In September, two international matches were arranged at St James' Park, Saudi Arabia against Costa Rica and South Korea respectively.

Despite low ticket prices, interest from the local population was weak and John Hird believes that the matches became a wake-up call for many.

- Now they have taken it too far, many thought. So they use St James' Park, not just our club. They are taking advantage of our region, says Hird, who brought the situation to the municipal board's attention without receiving a proper response.

 

In addition to being the world's biggest football league, the Premier League is also one of the most closed.

There are different types of owners, some more loved than others.

Some more controversial than others.

Charlotte Robson knows a couple of supporters who have stopped going to Newcastle games, while most deny any responsibility.

- For many, it does not matter who owns the club. It could be ordinary workers who don't make a lot of money and just want to go to football every other week, says Robson.

But do they have more power than they pretend? A couple of years ago, supporters of some of England's biggest clubs took to the streets and loudly protested plans for the Super League, a league closed only to the biggest clubs.

They succeeded in getting their message across. The then Chelsea owner Roman Abramovich was not prepared for the huge opposition from the supporters, but he listened.

- Yes, I hear what you are saying. That the counterargument is that the fans could actually have come together and said no to the Saudis, says Robson.

- But far too many people just want to see the club succeed. In a way, I even think there is a sense of pride in some, "they wanted us and no one else".

Photo: Nils Petter Nilsson
It's raining like a feather in Newcastle, as if someone up in the clouds is handling a giant spray bottle.
At the station this early morning it is full of people waiting to jump on a train to Edinburgh, London, Manchester, Liverpool or Birmingham.

The HS2 project, the high-speed rail project that the government promised would improve the infrastructure of northern Britain, has been put on hold. "The two roughest fingers pointed north in decades," as a headline in the Independent put it.

Once on a train south, scenic views of dark green terrain and highlands flicker past outside the window.

Not far from Newcastle, a scandal occurred a couple of months ago, when someone decided to cut down the iconic tree at Hadrian's Roman Wall.

One who was questioned about the incident was Newcastle manager Eddie Howe.

- I am very, very sorry that I did not have time to see it before it happened. "It makes me sad," replied Howe, who had planned to visit the tree with his family.

For John Hird, it is incomprehensible that the manager can answer those kinds of non-football-related questions, while avoiding awkward ones about the state of Saudi Arabia.

Earlier this year, Hird and his allies were contacted by a human rights organization that told them about Hassan Al Rabea, a Saudi man who was to be deported from Morocco and faced the death penalty for criticizing the regime, charges labeled "terrorism."

- The family wrote a letter which we received and delivered to Eddie Howe's office. A lot of fans questioned us saying "why did you involve him?" but why shouldn't we be able to do that? He works for the club and has been to Saudi Arabia several times. Then he doesn't want to say anything but "focuses on football", says Hird.

- But this thing with the tree, on the other hand, was a "terrible thing". It was as some pointed out, that he can talk about trees being cut down but not about a journalist being hacked to pieces.

 

Something that often comes up about Newcastle is how isolated the city has been in relation to the rest of the country, which can partly be explained by poor logistical connections.

It is rare for Englishmen raised in the south to move to Tyneside.

Supporter Charlotte Robson usually even has to defend the fact that she spent ten years of her life in London.

- People can say "did you really live there for ten years?!". They think it's too big, too stressful. That it is difficult to get around. The divide between north and south absolutely exists, says Robson, who finally felt it was time to move home.

John Hird has his own description of the place he grew up in:

- Tyneside is like a bubble, that's what we usually say. People there do not realize what is happening outside it.

Furthermore, Hird says he understands the arguments of many, that the responsibility for the club's ownership should not fall on the individual supporter.

- Those who should know better are the municipal board, the parliamentary representatives and, in my opinion, people involved in fanzines, he says.

- From the beginning, they gave everyone a promise that they would continue to talk about human rights, which they have not. So I think "regular" fans have a point, people who should have said something haven't.

Photo: Nils Petter Nilsson
In addition, there seems to be a belief among many Newcastle supporters that other Premier League supporters are jealous of the club's nouveau riche, hence any criticism.

John Hird does not feel that it is so at all.

- Many fans are rather worried about the future of the sport, he says.

During Newcastle's home game against Crystal Palace a few weeks ago, the visiting supporters carried a banner with the text:

The mask has fallen off,

PIF = Saudi State,

EPL act.

- Why do Crystal Palace fans say that? It's probably not because they're jealous, but because if this continues, more clubs will soon be owned by states, not just Manchester City and Newcastle, says Hird.

- Can the Chinese state buy a club? The American state? Iran? North Korea? Where will it end? Football came from the working class, Newcastle United represent our whole region. Why should we allow a dictatorship in the Middle East to take advantage of our social movement that has contributed so much for more than a hundred years?

At the end of October came the news that Saudi Arabia will be awarded the World Cup in 2034. Various columnists are furious, but no one is particularly surprised by Fifa's decision.

As The Athletic calls it: “Welcome to the future”.

What Eddie Howe Says?

- I think you can be sure that the tournament will be structurally very good.

The debated championship is a decade ahead.

Until then, everyday life goes on as usual for the residents of Newcastle, with the challenges it brings.

Football on the weekends.

Most people may not even realize that they are a significant pawn in a political power game.

Photo: Nils Petter Nilsson
The Newcastle supporters who choose to protest may be in the minority, but are doing their best to be heard.

John Hird grew up in the small community of Felling, on the opposite side of the River Tyne. The whole family was – of course – at Newcastle United.

- I'm a bit older than you so I can still remember the last time Newcastle won something, says Hird on a link from the Basque Country where he is at the moment.

From the start he was committed to getting Mike Ashley out of the club. Mainly because of the lack of investment but also the owner's substandard treatment of his employees.

Ashley is primarily associated with sports retail chain Sports Direct, whose billboards adorned every corner of St James' Park.

- He gave his employees zero-hours contracts and made a lot of money, explains Hird, referring to employment contracts without minimum requirements for working hours.

- When Ashley left, people gathered in the streets, danced and were genuinely happy. But I remember looking at them and thinking "there's something wrong here". Some were dressed in Saudi attire, others held the Saudi flag. I just felt like this wasn't going to end well. I wanted Ashley gone but this is a bloody dictatorship.

 

 

Edited November 15, 2023 by lxsln

[FloydianMag]

Clubs in Spain still whinging about a super league.

 

https://x.com/deadlinedaylive/status/1724830606536687883?s=46&t=RaLdCRuzyWBbm603Y3eUgg

[Elric]

"B-b-but they took all the best players!"

 

It wasn't that 20 years ago when your clubs were actively and publicly tapping up players aaahl owa the shop. Shut the fuck up

[duo]

If you ever needed proof that VAR just needs scrapping  - just listen to Howard Webb.  What a ridiculously over engineered system trying to prove it's worth.

 

 

[KetsbaiaIsBald]

 

12 hours ago, duo said:

If you ever needed proof that VAR just needs scrapping  - just listen to Howard Webb.  What a ridiculously over engineered system trying to prove it's worth.

 

 

to counter that.  I believe in var I think it just needs to be continually improved.  
 

Even current Var fixes both these decisions in seconds. 

 

https://x.com/fanzinewsl/status/1724913737717395946?s=46&t=lkNEu-V5PpvC89SXW8Ms0A

[leffe186]

On 14/11/2023 at 21:56, Geordie Ahmed said:

I mean there is a chance, I agree it's very, very unlikely but no need to take that on if you don't need to 

 

(Also it prpbably wastes a few extra seconds as well as)

Yeah, I actually did this once in a game when I was a teenager. IIRC I partly did it to be a cocky little shit though.

[BergenMagpie]

1 hour ago, KetsbaiaIsBald said:

I believe in var I think it just needs to be continually improved.  

 

Agreed. We have seen a lot of dumb mistakes, but it will gradually improve. 

 

Obviously it takes some of the pleasure out of the games, but Id rather have to contain my excitement for a while when we score than to have to live with more bad memories like the following:

Bolys mid-air albow on Perez 

Van Persies elbow on Cabaye before scoring

The 2015 3-0 loss vs sunderland where we didnt get a penalty for a foul+handball seconds before the counter attack that saw Colo get sent off + pen to sunderland

[Geordie Ahmed]

39 minutes ago, leffe186 said:

Yeah, I actually did this once in a game when I was a teenager. IIRC I partly did it to be a cocky little shit though.

Tbf it is a cocky move and I respect that, as I don't think many people will know the rule 

 

I played an 11 a side charity game once, I intentionally was standing ahead of the defender from goal kicks, he asked me why I was standing offside, he didn't realise you can't be offside from goal kicks which I took great delight in explaining it to him (Our keeper couldn't even kick that far so was pointless me standing there  )

[duo]

The game managed to function perfectly well with out VAR. It is totally subjective, over engineered and slows the game down. It just needs scraping.

[Guest]

VAR won't go anywhere now, they'll keep it and learn with it. I wouldn't be surprised if we had specifically trained VAR Technicians or whatever developed over the next 10 years. I think the major issue is that we as fans are starting to learn the laws of the game, and the specifics that we might not have been aware of several years ago. I was amazed at the amount of people who didn't know the whole of the ball over the whole of the line thing, I thought that was a given 

[The College Dropout]

27 minutes ago, duo said:

The game managed to function perfectly well with out VAR. It is totally subjective, over engineered and slows the game down. It just needs scraping.

I don't think it did. We just have bad memories.

 

Aguero scored a goal against us from an indirect freekick where he was stood in an offside position the entire time. It wasn't even close. We lost the game 1-0 and City didn't create much else. We were then relegated by 1 point.

 

Nobody remembers that because it was a routine mistake. People would have a fit and demand a rematch if this happened with VAR:

 

[The College Dropout]

31 minutes ago, OCK said:

VAR won't go anywhere now, they'll keep it and learn with it. I wouldn't be surprised if we had specifically trained VAR Technicians or whatever developed over the next 10 years. I think the major issue is that we as fans are starting to learn the laws of the game, and the specifics that we might not have been aware of several years ago. I was amazed at the amount of people who didn't know the whole of the ball over the whole of the line thing, I thought that was a given 

The biggest issue is fans expect the 100% correct all the time even when it's subjective.

 

Even with VAR sometimes things are missed. But that's totally unacceptable now. (and this is increasingly rare)

 

And with VAR some things are subjective. If it doesn't fall your team's way - it's totally unacceptable.

 

I personally like the high bar rule. Only interject in stonewall decisions. VAR gets too involved these days. Like if there's a bit of contact in the box but not a massive amount - go with the refs decision either way. Like the ref called for the City penalty against Chelsea. It was a bit soft but it can be given. That's fine. If he didn't give it... that's also fine.

 

 

Edited November 16, 2023 by The College Dropout

[80]

1 hour ago, The College Dropout said:

I don't think it did. We just have bad memories.

 

Aguero scored a goal against us from an indirect freekick where he was stood in an offside position the entire time. It wasn't even close. We lost the game 1-0 and City didn't create much else. We were then relegated by 1 point.

 

Nobody remembers that because it was a routine mistake. People would have a fit and demand a rematch if this happened with VAR:

 

I think that's his point. Something that didn't used to be the end of the world is now catastrophised in the stressed out pursuit of an unobtainable perfection. And yet before this, when it "didn't function well", football had spent 150 years rising from an intra-village bun fight into the most popular, financially valuable sport in the world.

 

On the current trajectory, there will never be a moment where the game's major players say "that's enough accuracy thanks - big money's riding on this game but it doesn't really matter".

 

 

Edited November 16, 2023 by 80

[The College Dropout]

Just now, 80 said:

I think that's his point. Something that didn't used to be the end of the world is now catastrophised in the stressed out pursuit of an unobtainable perfection. And yet before this, when it "didn't function well", football had spent 150 years rising from an intra-village bun fight into the most popular, financially valuable sport in the world.

Fair enough. But the world has changed a bit in 150 years... we couldn't go back... so what's the answer going forward?