NUFC Transfer Rumours

[ponsaelius]

The Matt Targett signing is probably for me what a misstep for us in the market looks like. It was well reported at the time he wasn't our first choice for left back, but we ended up going for him permanently to get the requisite body in the door early and get our window rolling that summer.

 

Ultimately though he was right in the 'buy wrong, buy twice' category given that we've since signed two new left backs in his position. Wrong age, wrong pricepoint and ultimately just the wrong profile. Unlucky with injuries no doubt but ultimately even without those injuries he's an example of a bad signing I'd say given that he'd only ever have plugged a gap and then depreciate in value. He's obviously better and more expensive but I think Joe Gomez would fall into a similar category and would be a mistake of a signing. 

 

What I would say is I feel like we've lost all confidence in the Nickson type signings from Europe. There has to be Bruno, Botman type profiles we can go for in that £30-40 million price point with minimal fuss negotiating with European clubs. There has barely been a single solid rumour of that type except for Thiaw.

 

This is the first window so far where I'm really struggling to get my head around what we're doing, and as a result also worrying that we don't really know either.

[midds]

1 minute ago, Theregulars said:

I get this line of thinking but I think we’d be hard-pressed to spend the money poorly. It’s not difficult to imagine an upgrade at centre half and at right wing for a combined £65-70m, especially if you purport to have hired one of the most exciting scouting minds in the game. 
 

If the club’s formal position is that they don’t think those players exist I’d have to take it at face value, but I’d have serious reservations about the new set-up and the ownership’s continued appetite to improve.

I broadly agree mate, I'm just trying to weigh it up myself. Spend nothing and wait until target#1 becomes available or buy badly and be saddled with target#3 for 4 years. We're in the unfortunate position where we have to get our buys correct or it'll fuck us 3 years down the line. We need direct hit after direct hit after direct hit and settling for a player we're not 100% convinced about could potentially shaft us. It's not an exact science, we all know we're short but it's stick or twist time 

[gbandit]

I agree with your post @ponsaelius. I remember we all expected the deal to be done at the start of the window and it dragged on for a bit while we were linked with that Brazilian LB who went to Forest? It felt to me like Howe didn’t want to go for Targett but like has been said, it was an easy transfer to do and it did improve us at the time. In terms of value, he was never going to increase but he could have held his value. It’s possible we could still make our money back on him if he goes on loan this season and performs well. It’s hardly a disastrous signing but has hampered us 

[Theregulars]

3 minutes ago, midds said:

I broadly agree mate, I'm just trying to weigh it up myself. Spend nothing and wait until target#1 becomes available or buy badly and be saddled with target#3 for 4 years. We're in the unfortunate position where we have to get our buys correct or it'll fuck us 3 years down the line. We need direct hit after direct hit after direct hit and settling for a player we're not 100% convinced about could potentially shaft us. It's not an exact science, we all know we're short but it's stick or twist time 

Yeh that’s a really good analysis - the conversations likely include those very points. Is it worth going with number 2/3 for this number now when he may be available for that number next year etc.

 

FWIW I think it’s worth doing now if a player is 25 and under - Howe would likely at least turn them into a saleable asset. 
 

Against that backdrop, a loan and one big buy seems reasonable. 

[RobsonsWonderland]

4 minutes ago, gbandit said:

I agree with your post @ponsaelius. I remember we all expected the deal to be done at the start of the window and it dragged on for a bit while we were linked with that Brazilian LB who went to Forest? It felt to me like Howe didn’t want to go for Targett but like has been said, it was an easy transfer to do and it did improve us at the time. In terms of value, he was never going to increase but he could have held his value. It’s possible we could still make our money back on him if he goes on loan this season and performs well. It’s hardly a disastrous signing but has hampered us 

He also benefitted massively from being better than Matt Richie at Fullback.

 

Do think its sliding doors as injury free he might have pushed on as a player (like others have)

[J7]

Obviously we can only really judge at the end of the window, but I do find it a bit odd that we’d be able to attract someone of the pedigree of Mitchell, then seemingly draw a blank on signing first team players when we have two obvious gaps. 
 

I do wonder if there’s more going on behind the scenes than we know about with this reported power play by Howe and the ‘final say’ stuff. 
 

That said, I’m purely speculating. Let’s hope we’re just not hearing about who we’re after.

[midds]

18 minutes ago, Theregulars said:

Yeh that’s a really good analysis - the conversations likely include those very points. Is it worth going with number 2/3 for this number now when he may be available for that number next year etc.

 

FWIW I think it’s worth doing now if a player is 25 and under - Howe would likely at least turn them into a saleable asset. 
 

Against that backdrop, a loan and one big buy seems reasonable. 

That would be a canny compromise

 

It's not an enviable position to be in for Mitchell and I'll understand whatever he chooses to do. He seems a smart bloke and I'm sure he's working as hard as he can for the club, just because little is leaking out doesn't mean nothing is actually happening. In years gone by I'm sure Charnley was 100% sitting on his hands without any intention of spending a single penny but this lot absolutely want the club to be as good as it possibly can be. I'm totally convinced they're working on things behind the scenes and making the decisions they think are correct for the club. 

 

If nothing happens - ok, go with it and see what the crack is like in January

If they go big - we've got target#1 and we're sure he'll slot in immediately

If they go medium/small - it'll refresh the squad a little and we'll probably get value for money with money still to spend in January

 

I'm just going to trust them and try and enjoy the games personally 

[Gallowgate Toon]

I'm all for trying to get A1 players etc. but there's more than one way to build a squad if that route isn't available. If anything, PSR has introduced more chess playing that you should be doing to maximise the game, as shit as that is.

 

If we don't get any additional competition for at least either CB or RW by the end of the window then it would be very poor - no other way to spin it.

[Whitley mag]

56 minutes ago, ponsaelius said:

The Matt Targett signing is probably for me what a misstep for us in the market looks like. It was well reported at the time he wasn't our first choice for left back, but we ended up going for him permanently to get the requisite body in the door early and get our window rolling that summer.

 

Ultimately though he was right in the 'buy wrong, buy twice' category given that we've since signed two new left backs in his position. Wrong age, wrong pricepoint and ultimately just the wrong profile. Unlucky with injuries no doubt but ultimately even without those injuries he's an example of a bad signing I'd say given that he'd only ever have plugged a gap and then depreciate in value. He's obviously better and more expensive but I think Joe Gomez would fall into a similar category and would be a mistake of a signing. 

 

What I would say is I feel like we've lost all confidence in the Nickson type signings from Europe. There has to be Bruno, Botman type profiles we can go for in that £30-40 million price point with minimal fuss negotiating with European clubs. There has barely been a single solid rumour of that type except for Thiaw.

 

This is the first window so far where I'm really struggling to get my head around what we're doing, and as a result also worrying that we don't really know either.

Fully agree with the part that we’ve lost confidence in our scouting and the Ashworth, Staveley episodes confirm power lines at the club have been blurred.

 

Mark Douglas alluded to this last night and questioned the point of our world wide scouting network currently.

 

There’s a lot of dynamics at play here, the relationship between Howe and Mitchell, also Eales is very much under pressure as Staveley appears to have been the deal maker previously, we end this window with nobody and there’s serious questions to be answered.

 

 

Edited August 20 by Whitley mag

[gbandit]

I do like serious questions. One thing I can’t handle is casual or half-hearted questions. Serious or nothing for me. Love to read a good post about power lines and dynamics when there’s no evidence to really back it up as well

[Terrymac1966]

Fits nicely with the end of June panic. Those in charge of driving us forward have left and we are in a mess of pottage with no obvious scouting network involved here ...bet my bottom dollar minor European clubs have picked up some damn good centre backs due to how effective their scouts are. Why are we not hearing of Argentinian Brazilian Eastern European up and coming. It seems messy and to a certain extent more reactive than preplanned.

[timeEd32]

It's not out of the realm of possibility that even spending what's been reported on Guehi is tied to Miggy / Trippier leaving. There's a lengthy list of theories you could come up with at the moment.

 

We'll know more in a couple weeks, but unfortunately won't really have the full picture for another 10 months.

 

[Whitley mag]

12 minutes ago, gbandit said:

I do like serious questions. One thing I can’t handle is casual or half-hearted questions. Serious or nothing for me. Love to read a good post about power lines and dynamics when there’s no evidence to really back it up as well

Keep burying your head what do you think the Howe interview in Germany was about for starters, was that not a power play ? 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

2 hours ago, HaydnNUFC said:

Will preface this by saying I have plenty faith that we'll do something; in summer 2022 everyone knew we needed a striker that wasn't as absent as Wilson and was better than Wood. We got Isak. 5 days before the window shut. That's what I'm clutching to.

 

If we get one but don't get the other: RW/CB that is, I'll still be slightly disappointed tbh. We knew we lacked depth at CB going into this season after Lascelles did his ACL v West Ham way back on the 30th March. And for RW: we last signed a RW 7 years ago, it's a position that's needed upgrading for a while. If don't get either though then this window has been a failure.

 

 

 

It’s not really clutching, the window is open so it can’t be judged yet. I’m not sure we’ll get a CB and RW because finding those two deals for players of high enough quality is tough in 10 days. 

[Izakaya]

2 hours ago, andycap said:

We turn our noses up at every fucker linked it seems. 

It's crazy thinking when our finances aren't great. 

When we bought gordon a lot thought he was no better than maxi

But howe has transformed him into a beast. 

So anyone we bring in could be developed the same way. 

 

Exactly. We seem to be incredibly picky and are hunting for these absolute unicorn players who will be perfect for us, but in reality footballers are simple people. As long as you aren't singing utter pricks like Richarlison you can mould them to whatever you want them to be. 

[HaydnNUFC]

9 minutes ago, AyeDubbleYoo said:

It’s not really clutching, the window is open so it can’t be judged yet. I’m not sure we’ll get a CB and RW because finding those two deals for players of high enough quality is tough in 10 days. 

 

I agree but we've had since early July after resolving the PSR shite tbf.

 

I hate being or sounding negative/misanthropic but it's not been inspiring at all, the whole window. I've doubts about us getting top 6 without signings in both of those positions and without top 6 this season I can't see us holding onto all of our better players in Isak, Bruno, Gordon and Botman next summer.

 

Got everything crossed we get one in at the very least.

 

 

Edited August 20 by HaydnNUFC

[gbandit]

13 minutes ago, Whitley mag said:

Keep burying your head what do you think the Howe interview in Germany was about for starters, was that not a power play ? 

Going to keep my head buried in the sand thanks and wait for Mitchell and the ownership structure to have been in place for longer than two months cheers 

[ExiledGeordie]

I know there are lots of factors at play including the dreaded PSR but if you’d said to me a few years back we would potentially coming out of the 24/25 season summer transfer window with no first 11 signings I’d have been shocked and bemused. Fwiw I still think we’ll make a signing or two and it  does appear that there’s a log jam in lots of the market and things will probably really hot up from here on in or certainly in the last week. Pressure is on though.

 

 

Edited August 20 by ExiledGeordie

[Abacus]

11 minutes ago, gbandit said:

I do like serious questions. One thing I can’t handle is casual or half-hearted questions. Serious or nothing for me. Love to read a good post about power lines and dynamics when there’s no evidence to really back it up as well

Well then, here's one. I'm not convinced about Eales.

 

I think we've lost something with Staveley going, but aside from that I keep going back to that soft soap documentary where they were all filmed talking about how the amount of money spent makes you successful. When challenged on this he deflected and said we had a secret weapon in Howe, who could make us overperform, or words to that effect.

 

It felt to me like the manager was being thrown under the bus there. I do not think it is a viable strategy to buy anyone you can afford and then just expect Howe to turn them all into world-beaters. And then after that, I didn't expect Eales to recently come out and say that he could concentrate on what he's good at, i.e. training players on the pitch, instead of being a key part of decision making, which he was before.

 

Then again, I've had a pint and been watching traitors on here, so my threat sensors are probably still on high alert.

 

As for transfers, let's buy whoever Mitchell scouts if that's our system now. I've no doubt the club are trying their best on this, so I'll wet the sheets if and only if the confetti goes out of date.

[Theregulars]

57 minutes ago, midds said:

That would be a canny compromise

 

It's not an enviable position to be in for Mitchell and I'll understand whatever he chooses to do. He seems a smart bloke and I'm sure he's working as hard as he can for the club, just because little is leaking out doesn't mean nothing is actually happening. In years gone by I'm sure Charnley was 100% sitting on his hands without any intention of spending a single penny but this lot absolutely want the club to be as good as it possibly can be. I'm totally convinced they're working on things behind the scenes and making the decisions they think are correct for the club. 

 

If nothing happens - ok, go with it and see what the crack is like in January

If they go big - we've got target#1 and we're sure he'll slot in immediately

If they go medium/small - it'll refresh the squad a little and we'll probably get value for money with money still to spend in January

 

I'm just going to trust them and try and enjoy the games personally 

Spot the fuck on.

[Guest]

Just now, ExiledGeordie said:

I know there are lots of factors at play including the dreaded PSR but if you’d said to me a few years back we would potentially coming out of the 24/25 season summer transfer window with no first 11 signings I’d have been shocked and bemused. Fwiw I still think we’ll make a signing or two and it  does appear that there’s a log jam in lots of the market and things will probably really hot up from here on in or certainly in the last week. 

 

How about being told a few years back that we'd have 8-9 new first team regulars including 2-3 in the £100m bracket and competing for a top 5 spot?

[timeEd32]

2 minutes ago, Abacus said:

Well then, here's one. I'm not convinced about Eales.

 

I think we've lost something with Staveley going, but aside from that I keep going back to that soft soap documentary where they were all filmed talking about how the amount of money spent makes you successful. When challenged on this he deflected and said we had a secret weapon in Howe, who could make us overperform, or words to that effect.

 

It felt to me like the manager was being thrown under the bus there. I do not think it is a viable strategy to buy anyone you can afford and then just expect Howe to turn them all into world-beaters. And then after that, I didn't expect Eales to recently come out and say that he could concentrate on what he's good at, i.e. training players on the pitch, instead of being a key part of decision making, which he was before.

 

Then again, I've had a pint and been watching traitors on here, so my threat sensors are probably still on high alert.

 

As for transfers, let's buy whoever Mitchell scouts if that's our system now. I've no doubt the club are trying their best on this, so I'll wet the sheets if and only if the confetti goes out of date.

None of that is how I interpreted that scene.

[The Prophet]

It will be interesting to see if our approach changes once Mitchell has his feet under the table. He's well known for his low risk, high upside approach.

[ExiledGeordie]

3 minutes ago, Optimistic Nut said:

 

How about being told a few years back that we'd have 8-9 new first team regulars including 2-3 in the £100m bracket and competing for a top 5 spot?

haha fair point 😂 That is a different discussion though in terms of our entire progress and looking at this transfer window in isolation and potentially helping secure top four next season and preventing the likes of Bruno, Isak, Gordon leaving.

 

 

Edited August 20 by ExiledGeordie

[SUPERTOON]

Just now, The Prophet said:

It will be interesting to see if our approach changes once Mitchell has his feet under the table. He's well known for his low risk, high upside approach.

Unless me massively increase revenue, we will probably have to tbh.