Nick Woltemade

[TheBrownBottle]

30 minutes ago, Mountain said:

I'll never blame my GOAT.

 

I adore Nick, so unique.

 

It's not his fault he isn't being used properly and the team is set up wrong.

The lad isn’t being supported properly by the system or his teammates, but he still has a responsibility to actually get into goalscoring positions.  No issue re the lad not being the finished article, but we’ve paid a hefty fee and I’m guessing he’s not on YTS wages.  Chelsea match apart, he hasn’t looked like a threat for months now. 

[Mountain]

32 minutes ago, TheBrownBottle said:

The lad isn’t being supported properly by the system or his teammates, but he still has a responsibility to actually get into goalscoring positions.  No issue re the lad not being the finished article, but we’ve paid a hefty fee and I’m guessing he’s not on YTS wages.  Chelsea match apart, he hasn’t looked like a threat for months now. 

 

No idea what YTS means but I don't disagree overall.

 

 

[PauloGeordio]

14 minutes ago, Mountain said:

 

No idea what YTS means but I don't disagree overall.

 

 

Youth Training Scheme

 

Spoiler

The Youth Training Scheme (YTS) was the name in the United Kingdom of an on-the-job training course for school leavers aged 16 and 17 and was managed by the Manpower Services Commission. The scheme was first outlined in the 1980 white paper A New Training Initiative: A Programme for Action, and it was brought into operation in 1983 to replace the Youth Opportunities Programme by the government of Margaret Thatcher. Initially lasting one year or six months, the scheme was amended in 1986 to be so that it could be extended to two years.

The 1981 England riots encouraged that, by bringing into sharp focus the results of large numbers of unskilled unemployed finding their own solutions. The scheme promised training to its applicants and made use of a variety of different training locales such as businesses, colleges of further education or training workshops run by voluntary organisations. Since the training place was guaranteed by the government and trainees were to be paid if they were on the course, eligibility for unemployment benefit was withdrawn.

Accredited organisations were required to provide at least 13 weeks per year of training away from the job and include life skills and social skills. A standardised form of certification was issued at the end of the training period.

In 1989, it was renamed Youth Training and was placed under the management of local training and enterprise councils. The trainees on the schemes could be classified as either trainee status or employed status.

The difference was distinguished by whether the trainee was recruited by an employer and provided with training for the company needs or if the trainee was being trained by a training organisation using employers as training placements. Often, employed status trainees would have their training allowance improved by the employer.

The YTS attracted political and social criticism from an early point. Critics claimed that the scheme enabled employers to exploit school leavers for cheap labour, and it provided little substance in the way of genuine education. The broad left alliance of musicians, artists, comedians and writers, Red Wedge, criticised YTS for its discriminatory nature toward black people and women.[1] The government's line was that the scheme was an effective counter to the drop in apprenticeships and marked rise in youth unemployment that was seen in the early 1980s.

In 1985, schoolchildren across the country went on strike against the YTS, with protests in London and Liverpool

 

 

 

Edited January 19 by PauloGeordio

[TheBrownBottle]

40 minutes ago, Mountain said:

 

No idea what YTS means but I don't disagree overall.

 

 

Hopefully no-one will see what I wrote as an attack on the lad - he’s clearly an extremely gifted forward who could be a world-beater, and I’d much rather we do everything possible to integrate him and build the forward line around him.  But he’s not immune from criticism. 

[Mountain]

1 hour ago, PauloGeordio said:

Youth Training Scheme

 

  Reveal hidden contents

The Youth Training Scheme (YTS) was the name in the United Kingdom of an on-the-job training course for school leavers aged 16 and 17 and was managed by the Manpower Services Commission. The scheme was first outlined in the 1980 white paper A New Training Initiative: A Programme for Action, and it was brought into operation in 1983 to replace the Youth Opportunities Programme by the government of Margaret Thatcher. Initially lasting one year or six months, the scheme was amended in 1986 to be so that it could be extended to two years.

The 1981 England riots encouraged that, by bringing into sharp focus the results of large numbers of unskilled unemployed finding their own solutions. The scheme promised training to its applicants and made use of a variety of different training locales such as businesses, colleges of further education or training workshops run by voluntary organisations. Since the training place was guaranteed by the government and trainees were to be paid if they were on the course, eligibility for unemployment benefit was withdrawn.

Accredited organisations were required to provide at least 13 weeks per year of training away from the job and include life skills and social skills. A standardised form of certification was issued at the end of the training period.

In 1989, it was renamed Youth Training and was placed under the management of local training and enterprise councils. The trainees on the schemes could be classified as either trainee status or employed status.

The difference was distinguished by whether the trainee was recruited by an employer and provided with training for the company needs or if the trainee was being trained by a training organisation using employers as training placements. Often, employed status trainees would have their training allowance improved by the employer.

The YTS attracted political and social criticism from an early point. Critics claimed that the scheme enabled employers to exploit school leavers for cheap labour, and it provided little substance in the way of genuine education. The broad left alliance of musicians, artists, comedians and writers, Red Wedge, criticised YTS for its discriminatory nature toward black people and women.[1] The government's line was that the scheme was an effective counter to the drop in apprenticeships and marked rise in youth unemployment that was seen in the early 1980s.

In 1985, schoolchildren across the country went on strike against the YTS, with protests in London and Liverpool

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thank you.

[Mountain]

39 minutes ago, TheBrownBottle said:

Hopefully no-one will see what I wrote as an attack on the lad - he’s clearly an extremely gifted forward who could be a world-beater, and I’d much rather we do everything possible to integrate him and build the forward line around him.  But he’s not immune from criticism. 

 

I think that's fair.

[nufcjb]

Personally, I feel for the guy right now. He obviously is trying his best and seems desperate to succeed here and not dissapoint the fans. Something is not clicking or working like it was eralier on and it looks like it's frustrating him. Hopefully, a goal would help his confidence short term but long term, we need a solution to getting the best out of him. No one wants him to fail here so hopefully we continue to supporting the fella. 

 

If we knock him too much now, then he goes on to have a brilliant World Cup, he probably wouldn't take too kindly coming back here afterwards if big clubs are after him.  Don't think it's in his personality to do so but we had a freaking agent turn the head of our so called best player last summer. Don't need another repeat.

 

 

Edited January 19 by nufcjb

[HMSIllustrious]

5 hours ago, nufcjb said:

Personally, I feel for the guy right now. He obviously is trying his best and seems desperate to succeed here and not dissapoint the fans. Something is not clicking or working like it was eralier on and it looks like it's frustrating him. Hopefully, a goal would help his confidence short term but long term, we need a solution to getting the best out of him. No one wants him to fail here so hopefully we continue to supporting the fella. 

 

If we knock him too much now, then he goes on to have a brilliant World Cup, he probably wouldn't take too kindly coming back here afterwards if big clubs are after him.  Don't think it's in his personality to do so but we had a freaking agent turn the head of our so called best player last summer. Don't need another repeat.

 

 

 

Wholeheartedly agree, it’s so early and still people are so negative/desperate.

As a team we don’t function atm, but we first have to sort out the system/ game plan and become a cohesive unit again, only then I will judge individual players.

 

[Chicken Dancer]

Some pretty damning comments on this lad amongst my group at the minute. 

 

I still think he's an absolutely glorious footballer (though not a striker) who will thrive in the right system. We haven't changed for him and we can barely get him involved in the game. I certainly wouldn't write him off just yet but there has to be a way where we can get him and Wissa on the pitch without Wissa being pushed out left.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

10 minutes ago, Chicken Dancer said:

Some pretty damning comments on this lad amongst my group at the minute. 

 

I still think he's an absolutely glorious footballer (though not a striker) who will thrive in the right system. We haven't changed for him and we can barely get him involved in the game. I certainly wouldn't write him off just yet but there has to be a way where we can get him and Wissa on the pitch without Wissa being pushed out left.

Strange way to put it, unless you hang out with members of the NUFC coaching staff. 

[La Parka]

The issue is the formation.. we literally create a void around him.

 

 

 

 

                 Wolte

 

 

Lw.                                 Rw

            Cm.  Cm Cm.                                       

 

 

 

 

Edited January 19 by La Parka

[Armchair Pundit]

To be honest, I just think Wolts needs to work on his hold up play more, stop getting knocked off the ball so easily and he'd be sorted.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

6 minutes ago, La Parka said:

The issue is the formation.. we literally create a void around him.

 

 

 

 

                 Wolte

 

 

Lw.                                 Rw

            Cm.  Cm Cm.                                       

 

 

 

 

 

 

That's not how we play, Joelinton and Bruno are usually pushed up when we are moving the ball forward. We just can't get the ball to them and if we do they have to pop it back.

[Deuce]

He’s a terrific player but I think I’d take our money back if Bayern came calling. Square peg in a round hole.

[gbandit]

4 minutes ago, Deuce said:

He’s a terrific player but I think I’d take our money back if Bayern came calling. Square peg in a round hole.

Build the team around him is the solution. You don’t pick up a gem like this and say we’re the problem so off you go. The solution is creating a team that works with his strengths 

[Pixelphish]

4 minutes ago, gbandit said:

Build the team around him is the solution. You don’t pick up a gem like this and say we’re the problem so off you go. The solution is creating a team that works with his strengths 

 

This is where I'm at. He's so unique it's up to the coaching team to make it work.

[Deuce]

5 minutes ago, gbandit said:

Build the team around him is the solution. You don’t pick up a gem like this and say we’re the problem so off you go. The solution is creating a team that works with his strengths 

Not to say neither he nor Howe are capable of change, but changing Wolte to fit Howe’s system risks neutering the player’s best qualities and Howe seems pretty committed to a flat 4-3-3 that demands a hard-pressing target man type up top.

 

And while we wait for them to figure it out, we’ll continue to look disjointed in attack.

 

 

Edited January 19 by Deuce

[Chicken Dancer]

22 minutes ago, AyeDubbleYoo said:

Strange way to put it, unless you hang out with members of the NUFC coaching staff. 

 

Sorry let me rephrase to suit you; 'some of my pals in me group chat and some who I sit around in SJP have been absolutely rinsing this lad lately'.

 

Was more to highlight the huge shift in people's view on him, which doesn't seem to be restricted to my mates either. He couldn't do wrong in the Autumn.

[Abacus]

He had quite a poor game as did a few and as has already been said it's about how we're set up and what we've asked him to do.

 

No chance would I sell him, I think he's going to be something special in time.

 

I'm actually a bit more disappointed in Wissa who you'd imagine was brought in to be the ready made striker until his injury.

 

I get the impatience but still, a point away against a team suddenly realising they are fighting for their lives isn't so bad.

[alexf]

Did anyone see the two misses when the camera was on him for the warm up. Was abit concerning I'll be honest. Once I could understand but he blazed a second over from close range again and didn't give me confidence for the game.

 

Echo others, system we play doesn't suit him. However for the first time I have been disappointed with some of his play in recent games. Just basics like heading timing, and getting a shot away. You hope can be coached and improved on. 

[Adam P]

1 hour ago, Armchair Pundit said:

To be honest, I just think Wolts needs to work on his hold up play more, stop getting knocked off the ball so easily and he'd be sorted.

 

Agree with this, he is trying to be too clever too often, needs to keep it simple, retain possession, find a man and get more in the game. Needs to up his movement too, too static at times means the defenders are tight enough to control him. 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

TBF he has turned his man and been brought down probably once or twice a game recently, he just didn't get the free kick. 

[LFEE]

1 hour ago, gbandit said:

Build the team around him is the solution. You don’t pick up a gem like this and say we’re the problem so off you go. The solution is creating a team that works with his strengths 

Out of interest what is it you see in him? You always speak so highly of him. Would love you to elaborate for me.

[gbandit]

Just now, LFEE said:

Out of interest what is it you see in him? You always speak so highly of him. Would love you to elaborate for me.

I think he’s got excellent feet, excellent vision and excellent weight of pass. I think he’s got major flaws in his movement in the box both in the air and on the ground and I think he plays far too deep all the time in the striker role. He is a very clean striker of the ball but his natural instincts are to take a touch. His lack of pace is an issue in the league especially.

 

Personally, I think he’s got the potential to be an absolutely amazing 10 and amazing 9. He’s still very early on in his development and yet we’ve seen some of those qualities already. What he needs is a lot of work on his movement and reading of where to position himself. This is all stuff that is training-oriented. His actual instinct technique and ability is amazing and he just needs the right coaching for it to develop further. I do think the pace is an issue but it can be mitigated with better quality on the wings by stretching teams more. 
 

Ideally, id like to see him play as a 10 but I think Howe will only want him as a 9 and he will get the coaching he needs to be a top 9

[Elephant]

I’ve said it before and will say it again. He’s much like Thomas Müller, who is absolutely brilliant player. Woltemade is either really useful and important to us or completely useless.

 

I want to see him longterm but we are not playing with our players strengths and Tonali is other prime example of that.

 

It’s not nice and motivating environment for players if fans turn so quickly against them.