TRon

It's not a bad thing at all, but it's only a good thing if those savings in interest payments are reinvested into the club. Would that include ploughing money in the academy and in signing youth players? Not aiming this at anyone in particular, just moving a point along but to a lot on here reinvestment in the club ONLY seems to involve signing players for the first team now. I would suggest (as indeed many others also do) that we need investment into the here and now and also for the future. It would appear that the future has been the boards priority right now. Oh certainly, as long as it as spent wisely and not at too much of a detriment to the immediate needs of the first team. If you or anyone have figures for how much the spending on the academy has increased under Ashley, then you'd certainly improve your arguments for how well the club is being run. However I'd also say that at this time I personally would not be convinced that any improvements in this area were motivated by a desire to make the club successful on the pitch as much as by a desire to sell them on for a profit later. Having the player for 3-5 years and benefitting from their rise to stardom > never having the player and not being able to compete on price for them with Man U/Chelsea when they reach their peak tbh. Sure, but there's a massive difference between developing players like Arsenal or Man U, hanging on to the best and moving on the one's who don't quite cut it, and eg Ipswich or the old days of West Ham where you develop some really good young players but sell them on as soon as they show some promise and are just a feeder club. The contract situation and subsequent sale of Milner (who I consider was out best young player) don't fill me with confidence that we will be following the first route. Everyone sees things coloured by their own opinion. I would class Milner as one of the ones you described as not quite cutting it and being moved on, so not a great example of this proving we are becoming a feeder club. He's hardly a Waddle or a Gascoigne. If you're expecting a conveyor belt of players better than Milner to come rolling off the academy production line, then I think you're setting massively high expectations for it and will be waiting an awfully long time. Milner was a first team player under a number of managers, and is obviously highly regarded by people more qualified to rate him than you or I, yet he was seen as not important enough to keep happy with what I am sure were quite modest contract demands, and was sold not because we had someone better to replace him with, but simply for profit. Milner out for £12m and Jonas in for quite a bit less seems like a fantastic piece of business to me. I find it difficult to fault the club on that I have to say.

It's not a bad thing at all, but it's only a good thing if those savings in interest payments are reinvested into the club. Would that include ploughing money in the academy and in signing youth players? Not aiming this at anyone in particular, just moving a point along but to a lot on here reinvestment in the club ONLY seems to involve signing players for the first team now. I would suggest (as indeed many others also do) that we need investment into the here and now and also for the future. It would appear that the future has been the boards priority right now. Oh certainly, as long as it as spent wisely and not at too much of a detriment to the immediate needs of the first team. If you or anyone have figures for how much the spending on the academy has increased under Ashley, then you'd certainly improve your arguments for how well the club is being run. However I'd also say that at this time I personally would not be convinced that any improvements in this area were motivated by a desire to make the club successful on the pitch as much as by a desire to sell them on for a profit later. Having the player for 3-5 years and benefitting from their rise to stardom > never having the player and not being able to compete on price for them with Man U/Chelsea when they reach their peak tbh. Sure, but there's a massive difference between developing players like Arsenal or Man U, hanging on to the best and moving on the one's who don't quite cut it, and eg Ipswich or the old days of West Ham where you develop some really good young players but sell them on as soon as they show some promise and are just a feeder club. The contract situation and subsequent sale of Milner (who I consider was out best young player) don't fill me with confidence that we will be following the first route. Everyone sees things coloured by their own opinion. I would class Milner as one of the ones you described as not quite cutting it and being moved on, so not a great example of this proving we are becoming a feeder club. He's hardly a Waddle or a Gascoigne.

It would be a pretty stupid mistake if it happened. I agree with the theory that if there's any chance of a takeover then it makes sense not to appoint just yet. I don't hold out much hope on that though. I think it could be a case of letting things drift until fans realise the value of getting someone in. For a short term fix, Hughton is probably ideal. I would imagine he's well liked in the dressing room so should be good for morale.

None of those clubs would take Keegan as manager because he wouldn't be willing to manage on shoestring budgets. Keegan is high maintenance, which isn't necessarily a criticism. If you are going to call a thread ridiculous at least think your arguments through before telling other people to get their head examined.

Not really. UPDATE: Wullie has explained it to you. If you need any more info on this subject, feel free to drop me a PM What for? Is my dropping you a PM going to get Keegan a job better than the one he walked out on?

An education in what? I watched Paraguay this morning and they play like Jack Charlton's Ireland. The less said about Venezuela the better. Well obviously you've learned all you need to know so no need to discuss further.

What I find ironic is that fanzines are jointly promoting action which will harm the club financially and publicly to the delight of the gutter press which they so often rail against.

If you have Sky Sports, try watching the South American WC qualifiers. Quite an education.

Same here. Far too nice to survive here. Poyet would be my choice.

We need to win the football match basically. Then people can shout and protest all they want, deep down that will make most people happy.

Well I had a different reason for hating Oliver, than the populist "LOL, he said we were going to sign Brett Emerton and we never did" crowd. I was appalled at his integrity as a journalist because of his role as a mouthpiece for Shepherd. He would not print anything without the club OK, which is not journalism in my book it's propaganda. Anyway since he's lost his pipeline to information, he's really not stepped up at all to show us his has any journalistic talent, today's reference to Wiki is just further evidence that this guy is the luckiest man alive to have the job he has. Agree 100% with that. Which makes a change. Fucking hell I just seen a pig flying past the window in the office here. And I thought all hope was lost for you Tron, good to see there's still a chance to ward off the men in white coats Well, now you know I'm a man of reason you probably want to re-think some of your other opinions as well tbh

I didn't say it was all Keegan's doing but they all had a better starting point because of where he got us to the first time he was here. You have to also point out John Hall's millions played their significant role. Keegan deserves his dues, it was a special time, better than winning a cup here or there for me. I am quite angry that the decision to bring him back has ended like this though. He's gone, no doubt getting on with his life, but our club is left in a mess due to the mistake of bringing him back to do a job he wasn't prepared to do.

Well I had a different reason for hating Oliver, than the populist "LOL, he said we were going to sign Brett Emerton and we never did" crowd. I was appalled at his integrity as a journalist because of his role as a mouthpiece for Shepherd. He would not print anything without the club OK, which is not journalism in my book it's propaganda. Anyway since he's lost his pipeline to information, he's really not stepped up at all to show us his has any journalistic talent, today's reference to Wiki is just further evidence that this guy is the luckiest man alive to have the job he has. Agree 100% with that. Which makes a change.

The same could have been said for almost every manager we've had for as long as I can remember. I know. I'm just pointing it out because some numb nuts probably haven't figured it out yet.

Why does it matter? I just think it's worth establishing that it's not Mike Ashley who Keegan is going to be suing for £2m, it's our football club. Fine if he wins the case he's entitled to it, but everyone should be aware that Ashley personally won't lose a penny so satisfaction at his losses should probably be less jubilant.

In such case I have no doubt whatsoever such a dispute would have been referred immediately to Llambias. It's all speculation, but very good points are being made by the likes of KaKa, Edd, mrmojo et al - and not being adequately refuted. mrmojorisin75 suggests: So can Keegan's supporters please come up with something other than "It's all speculative bollocks" or "It's all Wise's fault"? UV asks Well, yes and no. He said (with some cheekiness I'm sure) "I didn't have a brochure this time. It came like a whirlwind it is like one of those Lastminute.com holidays! There was no brochure I just came." Secondly, Wise had yet to be appointed, though one must assume negotiations with Wise had already commenced. So no, Keegan was not explicitly told that the hierarchy was Ashley -> Llambias -> Wise -> Jimenez -> Keegan. However, if you think Ashley and Mort hired Keegan without telling him about the imminent appointment of an executive director (football), that Ashley and Mort duped Keegan into believing he would be an old-school manager with sweeping powers while secretly planning to go in exactly the opposite direction, well... I'll take Kaka's logic over yours thanks. raconteur, very few people want to hear this, instead they prefer the following word associations: cockney, lies, wise, southerner, season tickets, 3 years, fabrication, conspiracy KK, no wrong, innocent, victim, beyond criticism i'm still astounded that after years of shepherd leasing warehouses to the club, ridiculing the supporters publicly, taking massive dividends despite deteriorating results on the pitch (etc...) was affored so much time and never once was there a talk of a boycott of club products, marches, none of this s***...before anyone starts about balancing the books i'll point you to bobby robsons first 2 seasons for a parrallel on spend and manager...also to the sacking of bobby as well really is anyone gonna look me in the internet eye and tell me this doesn't just boil down to a nice bit of dirty regionalism against a southern owner and nasty dennis? anyone? really? Well said. Hopefully they take Keegan to court so the truth can come out and get the £2 million he owes the club in the process. anyone wanting them to proceed with that legal action does not have the best interests of the club at heart. it'll just cause a shitload of bother for no good reason. even if they get their £2m, total phyrric victory beyond belief. I have the best interests of the club at heart and it's why I want the record set straight, if Keegan wins in court then I'll happily back down and admit the club were in the wrong but if they win then I hope people drop the emotional s**** and admit Keegan is in the wrong. naive or daft (one of them) to think going to court is in the best interests of the club or the fans. even with they win - which wouldnt prove that much anyway, nor would losing, as it deals with legal technicalities which are only of interest to scrounging lawyers - how do you think it would make 90% of fans feel that the club, rich and owned by a billionaire, is stripping one of the greatest men in the club's history for £2m, for no other reason than they can. if they do that they just want to 'win' a legal argument rather than do what is in our best interests. they dont need the money, keegan probably does. do you think it was in the best interests of the club and fans to release that silly statement of theirs, too? No I don't, I think the statement was dropping down to his level exchanging insults, with the quick response from the LMA they were expecting it. The truth coming out is worth more to Ashley than £2 million, how many people do you think will stop this boycott of club products if the truth comes out that they're not to blame? I'd say quite a few. The costs will be immense; Keegan will no doubt have sought advice before resigning and will have acted upon it. This means that an employment lawyer somewhere thinks he has a case whether it's breach of contract or constructive dismissal. The £2m could be dwarved by costs and the outcome uncertain. Who is going to pay these massive costs to Keegan? Will they come out of Ashley's private bank account or will NUFC be footing the bill? The LMA will fund Keegan in all likelihood, like most professional associations would if it were assessed there is a reasonable chance of winning the case; he's probably already had this advice and this would account for his resignation. The most likely outcome is a settlement and a non-disclosure agreement. The truth for either side is unlikely to come out. That's not really answering the question which was asked. I'm not suggesting that massive costs would be paid to Keegan rather simply that massive costs would be incurred in the prosecution or defence of a case concerning Keegan's employment and its subsequent termination. The most likely outcome is a settlement and NDA. What I asked was, who would be paying the costs? Ashley from his own personal bank account, or Newcastle United Football Club?

In such case I have no doubt whatsoever such a dispute would have been referred immediately to Llambias. It's all speculation, but very good points are being made by the likes of KaKa, Edd, mrmojo et al - and not being adequately refuted. mrmojorisin75 suggests: So can Keegan's supporters please come up with something other than "It's all speculative bollocks" or "It's all Wise's fault"? UV asks Well, yes and no. He said (with some cheekiness I'm sure) "I didn't have a brochure this time. It came like a whirlwind it is like one of those Lastminute.com holidays! There was no brochure I just came." Secondly, Wise had yet to be appointed, though one must assume negotiations with Wise had already commenced. So no, Keegan was not explicitly told that the hierarchy was Ashley -> Llambias -> Wise -> Jimenez -> Keegan. However, if you think Ashley and Mort hired Keegan without telling him about the imminent appointment of an executive director (football), that Ashley and Mort duped Keegan into believing he would be an old-school manager with sweeping powers while secretly planning to go in exactly the opposite direction, well... I'll take Kaka's logic over yours thanks. raconteur, very few people want to hear this, instead they prefer the following word associations: cockney, lies, wise, southerner, season tickets, 3 years, fabrication, conspiracy KK, no wrong, innocent, victim, beyond criticism i'm still astounded that after years of shepherd leasing warehouses to the club, ridiculing the supporters publicly, taking massive dividends despite deteriorating results on the pitch (etc...) was affored so much time and never once was there a talk of a boycott of club products, marches, none of this s***...before anyone starts about balancing the books i'll point you to bobby robsons first 2 seasons for a parrallel on spend and manager...also to the sacking of bobby as well really is anyone gonna look me in the internet eye and tell me this doesn't just boil down to a nice bit of dirty regionalism against a southern owner and nasty dennis? anyone? really? Well said. Hopefully they take Keegan to court so the truth can come out and get the £2 million he owes the club in the process. anyone wanting them to proceed with that legal action does not have the best interests of the club at heart. it'll just cause a shitload of bother for no good reason. even if they get their £2m, total phyrric victory beyond belief. I have the best interests of the club at heart and it's why I want the record set straight, if Keegan wins in court then I'll happily back down and admit the club were in the wrong but if they win then I hope people drop the emotional s**** and admit Keegan is in the wrong. naive or daft (one of them) to think going to court is in the best interests of the club or the fans. even with they win - which wouldnt prove that much anyway, nor would losing, as it deals with legal technicalities which are only of interest to scrounging lawyers - how do you think it would make 90% of fans feel that the club, rich and owned by a billionaire, is stripping one of the greatest men in the club's history for £2m, for no other reason than they can. if they do that they just want to 'win' a legal argument rather than do what is in our best interests. they dont need the money, keegan probably does. do you think it was in the best interests of the club and fans to release that silly statement of theirs, too? No I don't, I think the statement was dropping down to his level exchanging insults, with the quick response from the LMA they were expecting it. The truth coming out is worth more to Ashley than £2 million, how many people do you think will stop this boycott of club products if the truth comes out that they're not to blame? I'd say quite a few. The costs will be immense; Keegan will no doubt have sought advice before resigning and will have acted upon it. This means that an employment lawyer somewhere thinks he has a case whether it's breach of contract or constructive dismissal. The £2m could be dwarved by costs and the outcome uncertain. Who is going to pay these massive costs to Keegan? Will they come out of Ashley's private bank account or will NUFC be footing the bill? The LMA will fund Keegan in all likelihood, like most professional associations would if it were assessed there is a reasonable chance of winning the case; he's probably already had this advice and this would account for his resignation. The most likely outcome is a settlement and a non-disclosure agreement. The truth for either side is unlikely to come out. That's not really answering the question which was asked.

That and, No more John Motson Fuck aye. I'm dreading the day he retires, you just know that THAT clip will be shown a million times. Met him in the lift down from the Bamburgh Suite, he was with Graham Taylor. Got talking to them, Motson was a complete tosser, Taylor was a top, top bloke. My experience of Motson is similar. A complete cock. Fucking awful bloke Well he's always sounded like a complete tosser so gratifying to know it's true in reality as well.

In such case I have no doubt whatsoever such a dispute would have been referred immediately to Llambias. It's all speculation, but very good points are being made by the likes of KaKa, Edd, mrmojo et al - and not being adequately refuted. mrmojorisin75 suggests: So can Keegan's supporters please come up with something other than "It's all speculative bollocks" or "It's all Wise's fault"? UV asks Well, yes and no. He said (with some cheekiness I'm sure) "I didn't have a brochure this time. It came like a whirlwind it is like one of those Lastminute.com holidays! There was no brochure I just came." Secondly, Wise had yet to be appointed, though one must assume negotiations with Wise had already commenced. So no, Keegan was not explicitly told that the hierarchy was Ashley -> Llambias -> Wise -> Jimenez -> Keegan. However, if you think Ashley and Mort hired Keegan without telling him about the imminent appointment of an executive director (football), that Ashley and Mort duped Keegan into believing he would be an old-school manager with sweeping powers while secretly planning to go in exactly the opposite direction, well... I'll take Kaka's logic over yours thanks. raconteur, very few people want to hear this, instead they prefer the following word associations: cockney, lies, wise, southerner, season tickets, 3 years, fabrication, conspiracy KK, no wrong, innocent, victim, beyond criticism i'm still astounded that after years of shepherd leasing warehouses to the club, ridiculing the supporters publicly, taking massive dividends despite deteriorating results on the pitch (etc...) was affored so much time and never once was there a talk of a boycott of club products, marches, none of this s***...before anyone starts about balancing the books i'll point you to bobby robsons first 2 seasons for a parrallel on spend and manager...also to the sacking of bobby as well really is anyone gonna look me in the internet eye and tell me this doesn't just boil down to a nice bit of dirty regionalism against a southern owner and nasty dennis? anyone? really? Well said. Hopefully they take Keegan to court so the truth can come out and get the £2 million he owes the club in the process. anyone wanting them to proceed with that legal action does not have the best interests of the club at heart. it'll just cause a shitload of bother for no good reason. even if they get their £2m, total phyrric victory beyond belief. I have the best interests of the club at heart and it's why I want the record set straight, if Keegan wins in court then I'll happily back down and admit the club were in the wrong but if they win then I hope people drop the emotional s**** and admit Keegan is in the wrong. naive or daft (one of them) to think going to court is in the best interests of the club or the fans. even with they win - which wouldnt prove that much anyway, nor would losing, as it deals with legal technicalities which are only of interest to scrounging lawyers - how do you think it would make 90% of fans feel that the club, rich and owned by a billionaire, is stripping one of the greatest men in the club's history for £2m, for no other reason than they can. if they do that they just want to 'win' a legal argument rather than do what is in our best interests. they dont need the money, keegan probably does. do you think it was in the best interests of the club and fans to release that silly statement of theirs, too? No I don't, I think the statement was dropping down to his level exchanging insults, with the quick response from the LMA they were expecting it. The truth coming out is worth more to Ashley than £2 million, how many people do you think will stop this boycott of club products if the truth comes out that they're not to blame? I'd say quite a few. The costs will be immense; Keegan will no doubt have sought advice before resigning and will have acted upon it. This means that an employment lawyer somewhere thinks he has a case whether it's breach of contract or constructive dismissal. The £2m could be dwarved by costs and the outcome uncertain. Who is going to pay these massive costs to Keegan? Will they come out of Ashley's private bank account or will NUFC be footing the bill?

In such case I have no doubt whatsoever such a dispute would have been referred immediately to Llambias. It's all speculation, but very good points are being made by the likes of KaKa, Edd, mrmojo et al - and not being adequately refuted. mrmojorisin75 suggests: So can Keegan's supporters please come up with something other than "It's all speculative bollocks" or "It's all Wise's fault"? UV asks Well, yes and no. He said (with some cheekiness I'm sure) "I didn't have a brochure this time. It came like a whirlwind — it is like one of those Lastminute.com holidays! There was no brochure — I just came." Secondly, Wise had yet to be appointed, though one must assume negotiations with Wise had already commenced. So no, Keegan was not explicitly told that the hierarchy was Ashley -> Llambias -> Wise -> Jimenez -> Keegan. However, if you think Ashley and Mort hired Keegan without telling him about the imminent appointment of an executive director (football), that Ashley and Mort duped Keegan into believing he would be an old-school manager with sweeping powers while secretly planning to go in exactly the opposite direction, well... I'll take Kaka's logic over yours thanks. raconteur, very few people want to hear this, instead they prefer the following word associations: cockney, lies, wise, southerner, season tickets, 3 years, fabrication, conspiracy KK, no wrong, innocent, victim, beyond criticism i'm still astounded that after years of shepherd leasing warehouses to the club, ridiculing the supporters publicly, taking massive dividends despite deteriorating results on the pitch (etc...) was affored so much time and never once was there a talk of a boycott of club products, marches, none of this shit...before anyone starts about balancing the books i'll point you to bobby robsons first 2 seasons for a parrallel on spend and manager...also to the sacking of bobby as well really is anyone gonna look me in the internet eye and tell me this doesn't just boil down to a nice bit of dirty regionalism against a southern owner and nasty dennis? anyone? really? Well said. Hopefully they take Keegan to court so the truth can come out and get the £2 million he owes the club in the process. anyone wanting them to proceed with that legal action does not have the best interests of the club at heart. it'll just cause a shitload of bother for no good reason. even if they get their £2m, total phyrric victory beyond belief. I have the best interests of the club at heart and it's why I want the record set straight, if Keegan wins in court then I'll happily back down and admit the club were in the wrong but if they win then I hope people drop the emotional shite and admit Keegan is in the wrong. naive or daft (one of them) to think going to court is in the best interests of the club or the fans. even with they win - which wouldnt prove that much anyway, nor would losing, as it deals with legal technicalities which are only of interest to scrounging lawyers - how do you think it would make 90% of fans feel that the club, rich and owned by a billionaire, is stripping one of the greatest men in the club's history for £2m, for no other reason than they can. if they do that they just want to 'win' a legal argument rather than do what is in our best interests. they dont need the money, keegan probably does. do you think it was in the best interests of the club and fans to release that silly statement of theirs, too? if he needs the money that much, he wouldn't have walked out of a job.

Spot on, why the hell should fans just accept being shafted by the likes of Ashley and Wise ? Who said you should accept it? The point some people are making is that the last thing the club needs is more drama, protesting will do the club no good at all and it won't make a difference to Ashley selling, only money will. If you don't make a protest then you are just accepting any shi-te Wise and Ashley come out with. If you do make a protest then you're wasting your time and creating more bad publicity for the club. The choice is yours. And you can be docile and accept anything even if its wrong. That is obviously your choice. You can also be hostile, start costing the football club money and watch the transfer kitty shrink while Ashley tries to cover his losses. Then moan and groan even more when instead of signing a Coloccini he signs some Bolivian centre half for £500,000. That is obviously your choice. I have put money into this club for years, season ticket year after year, shopping at the club shop , going to cup games and some away games, the total amount over the years will come to thousands and thats no big deal there are many more like me. But that cunt Ashley will not get another penny out of me, and I go to the match with half a dozen other matess who are all as angry as me - if not more so. And believe me these aren't the "boo boys" just people who are very pissed off. Once Ashley starts to piss off long standing fans like these then it might just be that we have something to moan about, we've earned the right to be unhappy with the behaviour of both our owner and director of football and have the right to express it. I will be at the game on Saturday- already got the season ticket- but I will follow the True Faith and Mag plan and avoid giving one penny to anything connected to Ashley's businesses. You can do what you want mate, it's your money. By the same token, it's Ashley's money that is going to be spent/not spent on hiring staff, buying players and the rest. If the club starts making less money they'll spend less on new players. I just wonder if these plebs from True Faith and The Mag have thought about this? If they know for sure that there's someone out there about to buy Ashley out then fair enough. But I doubt it.

Spot on, why the hell should fans just accept being shafted by the likes of Ashley and Wise ? Who said you should accept it? The point some people are making is that the last thing the club needs is more drama, protesting will do the club no good at all and it won't make a difference to Ashley selling, only money will. If you don't make a protest then you are just accepting any shi-te Wise and Ashley come out with. If you do make a protest then you're wasting your time and creating more bad publicity for the club. The choice is yours. And you can be docile and accept anything even if its wrong. That is obviously your choice. You can also be hostile, start costing the football club money and watch the transfer kitty shrink while Ashley tries to cover his losses. Then moan and groan even more when instead of signing a Coloccini he signs some Bolivian centre half for £500,000. That is obviously your choice.

Wise was following the programme Keegan wasn't. It's hardly surprising Ashley came down on his side, I doubt personality had much to do with it. Ashley is running the club as a business, that much is clear. I'm just not convinced anyone else who comes in won't do any different, unless they put the club into debt. That's what has happened at Liverpool and Man U and they have far bigger income resources than us. What was "the programme" ? that wise was responsible for bringing in young players. Thats what we were told by Ashley when he brought the poison dwarf to the club. Unless Ashey was lying right from the start................. The programme is buying players whose value will go up instead of down. Most club owners will want that unless they've got limitless funds which they are prepared to write off. There are two so far in the Premier league: Abramovich and now the Abhu Dhabi arabs at City.

...and we have a winner!

I've a feeling Ashley will think he's right to stick to his guns anyway, regardless of the boycott. I don't think he could operate his transfer policy if everybody wasn't singing from the same hymn sheet, and Keegan clearly wasn't.