Geordie_once_removed

For the record I still think he was a good bad buy. He played an important role and when we bought him we never knew we'd go on that run and it could well have cone down the game against Burnley. All that being said. By God he looks useless! It's not that he can't do the things we never expected him to do, e.g. break the line with a burst of pace. It's that he seems toilet at doing the things we thought he could, his knockdowns are shocking and his headers always seem powder puff and straight at the keeper. I can only hope we sell him for 5-10 million in January to the 2022/23 equivalent of us last season.

Our team spirit, tactics and preparation are top 4 worthy. Our starting 11 is top 6 worthy. Our bench..... is full of committed professionals (but is bottom 5 worthy). 3 games in and I'm coming round to the idea that what we need is a versatile forward and a CM, rather than a forward and a RW/RWF. Partly this is due to my own desire to see Willock tried as a RW/RWF and partly it is due to how we struggled to hold possession in the middle against Brighton and City.

I'd start Longstaff. His pressing stats are really impressive and he's a decent progressive passer, see the chipped ball that led to Bruno's goal Vs Arsenal as an example of this.

Can anyone cast any light onto why this deal is seen largely as dead noe? Is it just that one Southampton report? Or just the general outward inaction on it?

The only player who might be able to do it is Anderson and I say that purely due to the fact that what he can do at this level is unknown. I feel confident in our bench being able to help close out a 1 nil. Nothing more. Howe and the recruitment team have done an amazing job sorting out the defence. But short of some big money being sent, I think they will struggle to add sufficient threat to our team to help us push for a European spot. We just don't create enough.

I largely agree but I think its more to do with the fact that things all came a bit too easy for them because of natural gifts. Dyer had terrifying pace over the first 5-10 metres when he first broke through. He also had incredibly quick feet. Both of these were harmed by a couple of injuries and he didn't have the self discipline to work on other areas of his game to compensate and therefore allow him to stay at that level or even improve overall. I've not followed Alli closely but I can imagine you could say a similar thing about him. I know at the very least Owen is a very odd human, but to his credit when he lost his pace due to injuries he really worked on his movement in the box and because of this he was able to largely maintain his overall quality as a player for longer than say Alli and Dyer who both were, or seem to be, largely done at the top level by 24 or so.

Based on our current squad I went for 8th. 7th and maybe 6th is possible with two good attacking additions. I'm trying not to get carried away after what was a very good win and performance that was ultimately against a newly promoted team that due to changes in personnel basically didn't have a pre-season as a team.

Fair point about the elegance of Vieira. Since you mention the looking a bit clumsy thing, I can see the Tiote comparison a bit more. Even when he was great in that season next Cabaye I do remember him looking, but not actually being, clumsy at times. Still I think the two aren't that alike. In our history I think Joelinton is a bit of a one off.

Did that happen before that equaliser against Arsenal? Tiote a his best destroyed like Joelinton but he never carried. The player whose style I think is most similar may be Vieira. He really invented that whole modern box to box midfielder style.

As far as I recall Tiote never burst forward as much as Joelinton.

ASM and Dyer perhaps? I don't think we've ever had a player that is Stylistically similar to Big Joe.

What a nice feeling to be able to wake up and reflect on such a positive performance. With the team as is, I see us finishing 8-10th. We have a really strong first team with only the RWF position a bit of a question mark over if Almiron is good enough for a team aiming for European football. The issue is the lack of a plan B or substitute players who can change the game. We only have Shelvey injured but when you look at that bench we had (Dummett, Botman, Richie, Wood, Fraser, Murphy, Anderson and Longstaff) you ask who can allow us to play a different way or do who you feel would impact the game? There are a few who, like yesterday, will help us see out games with energy and pressing, but none who at this stage I would label proven game changers. As others have said a couple of attacking additions and this changes and we could sneak 6th.

Me after a sound beating and 10 spliffs.

I watched it at home with a Forest supporting friend and what an enjoyable experience it was too. I was really impressed with the team's off the ball work. Forest hardly ever put 4 passes together and that was to do with our organised pressing, if we didn't win the first ball we won the second or pressured a mistake. I really liked the runs Almiron was making and the balls Bruno was playing at times were the sex! I thought Wilson was quite anonymous but his finish was so classy and instinctive.

As a player I couldn't stand him for us, he just offered nothing and always gave away stupid fouls. A pernicious part of me wanted him to totally embarrass himself today. Ultimately I thought he did as well as he could. He was just totally outclassed by our midfield and had no support from his teammates. As others have said he was perhaps their best player, not in defence, today which is the definition of a backhanded compliment!

This whole mini saga seems odd and while I feel we overall have a waaaaaaay more professional and serious outfit now, it does make me question a little the wisdom of our actions. Based on what we know we've bid at least 10 million (closer to 20 million is possible) less than whatever they would have taken. Added to this it seems questionable if Leicester would have sold at all at this stage anyway, given that there is a potential bumper transfer fee from Chelsea incoming for a player in a position that statistically is far cheaper to replace, totally negating any financial need to sell and in fact making any decision to sell highly provocative to their supporters. It just feels a bit like a waste of time and effort. I hope I'm wrong and in retrospect this message looks highly stupid.

As highlighted by that Athletic article, Forest play fast counter attacking football with a relatively low press. Any thoughts on which CB pairing works best for this?

I think there are only 3 positions where it's not clear who will start. CB, Willock or Longstaff (I think Willock will start, I see Longstaff as the away from home/vs top 6 choice as he is more defensive) and Almiron or Fraser. I hope for a Burn - Botman pairing (Schär is too injury prone), Willock and Almiron. I can really see Almiron and Trippier working well, Almiron has needed a smart overlapping FB and in Trippier he has one, pre-season suggested they were getting how to play together.

I think he'll go for version of last season's best 11 with a sprinkling of new signings: Pope Trippier - Schär - Burn - Targett Willock - Bruno - Joelinton Almiron - Wilson - ASM It will be a tough game but home advantage and the sheer disruption to their side due to player ins and outs will see is win the day. Something I don't think you can underestimate is importantance of a relatively settled side at this stage of the season.

An encouraging sign and I think a good decision. With 5 subs and hopefully a decent run in the (whatever it's called this season) cup he should get enough game time and as others have said we have a set up now that is much more likely to help him develop than before.

If this signing comes off I wonder if Howe would try and convert Willock into a RW/RWF. He's got the pace and a eye for goal so I can see it being possible. I'm not 100% convinced of this being the best use of our money. As good a player as he is, I feel based on the players we have and the system we seem to be playing there would be a bit of square peg and round holing going on to get all our best players on the pitch. However, it would be an amazing statement though. Signing the best player of a direct rival, who has consistently and comprehensively outperformed us for the last 5 seasons so. It would really say that players believe in the clubs ambition to compete for the league in relatively short period of time, otherwise why would he move here? Yes he'll clearly be getting a pay rise, but if you look at the salaries at Man U and Chelsea for example and remember that we've been consistent about not wanting to smash our wage structure, you can feel confident that some outrageous salary isn't the sole reason he'd come here. Because a) if money is his motivation we're not the sole big (or even the biggest) pay check in town and b) based on everything we've heard we wouldn't offer that salary in the first place.

Another promising performance and result. Positives: Solid at the back despite a whole other back 5 being played. Botman in particular looks really classy, there is a Terminator cool about him. The midfield in the first half played well and had some good movement that stretched the opposition in ways we could only have dreamt of under Bruce. ASM, albeit sporadically, was challenging back, if he can be convinced of the value in doing this consistently and in in line with the systematic approach Howe has for this team pressing he could go to the next level. Concerns: Right wing. Sometimes Bruno and other midfielders were taking one too many touches, against sharper opposition this could cost us.

For me it more that he's even played there shows a lack of quality and depth in that position. If not him then who? Fraser is solid but not really a top 8 starter. Murphy is a jigsaw when it comes to the final pass or shot. Almiron tends to tuck in more and has been inconsistentent to say the least.

I largely agree but numbers aside bar Richie I don't see how you rate Willock the second worst player. He's been a couple of cms off producing some amazing passes

I think we will too. One of the biggest things that has changed since the Ashley and even the Shepherd years is that our decisions have been smart. So often in the past we had clear weakness that were spoken about on here and in the terraces yet the club never addressed them. Fans aren't dumb they know their club. So far it has been the exact opposite, with signings on and off the pitch strategically addressing key issues. It's so refreshing.