St. Maximin

Sure it would be very shocking to potentially see (a very small and stupid minority of) Newcastle fans cheering MBS on, but you’d hope the club realised inviting him would be a clear own goal. His brother attending the Carabao Cup final didn’t make much news but nobody knows who he is.

I would agree and cynically I also think many people that do genuinely care about human rights aren’t really bothered about sportswashing, but use it to make their concerns about human rights seem relevant and topical. I’m not sure what benefit it really has to fighting human rights abuses by ensuring we have a negative opinion on certain countries, but maybe that’s me not understanding the issues enough. Where I do feel rival fans can comment here with more legitimate frustrations is the ‘separation’ stuff.

Also enjoyed the second episode more than the first. It’s been mentioned before we don’t have to like the people running our club, but they seem very likeable and genuine. When the corporate world can often be quite cold and ruthless, that shouldn’t be overlooked. Might just my way of seeing things though, but even with the cup final defeat it’s so positive it feels a bit cheesy. Quite like the broader range of emotion you get in other series, but that would probably come at a cost of the team struggling more…

Also depends who you count as ‘owners’. I’ve seen the phrase being used to talk about Staveley and co and how great they are (which seems fair). Also heard it being used to refer to the PIF/Saudi state and even that MBS fella. I think it’s not fair to label the state as a load of evil murderers, but MBS has ‘accepted responsibility’ for a journalist murdered under his leadership and we did largely support and celebrate his state taking us over after all.

It comes across differently when written - if you watch the video it’s clearly lighthearted and he has a chuckle, presumably in relation to Tindall. Sure he might be a whingebag but he’s just having a laugh here and we shouldn’t get wound up by that.

Ultimately people pick and choose how much they want to associate the country’s human rights record and morality of its dictator to its investing and growing involvement in our economy and culture. There’s no objectively right moral position here and I don’t really care what varying positions our fans might take here. I personally think while we can still argue about the government selling arms or other clubs having evil owners too, I don’t feel fully satisfied with those justifications. I’m more happy to just say we aren’t celebrating a dictator here - the Saudi state is massive rather than just MBS and his murdering cronies, it is doing what it can do develop economically and if reputation comes into it then it has every right to. Every company or country that has bad press wants to improve its reputation and it’s not like everything or person to do with them are evil and should be made to suffer etc. The fans who decide to become KSA apologists are of course idiots, but they make up a small proportion of our fanbase and also despite being idiots I think many are probably smart enough to realise there’s a moral dilemma here. It’s just their way of justifying it to themselves. Where I do feel uncomfortable is when I try and be empathetic and think this can’t be nice to see if you’re a victim of the state’s brutal acts, like Khashoggi’s family or those locked up unfairly. Is it wrong to concern ourselves with what they think seeing Saudi influence being celebrated? Or when I’m considering other scenarios, like if Russia bought the club instead - aside from the obvious practicalities, would that actually be any less defendable?

Ultimately it’s pretty normal to vote selfishly so it’s not at all surprising the Reubens (and apparently Staveley and Ghodoussi) vote for the party that financially benefits them the most. I get the anger at people voting Tory, but politics is complex and you don’t have to agree with every policy to vote for a party. I doubt they go to the polling station consciously thinking about how keen they are to see more food banks also even if their vote contributes to it. But yeah either way, the other 80% is (the investment fund of) a state with a horrendous human rights record and clearly very evil dictator, so moral issues resulting from our other owners’ charitable deeds pale in comparison.

There’s nothing wrong with that. I’d already given him loads of praise. I’m sure my comment was pretty minor too in the grand scheme of things.

Yes I agree. That was a joke I should make pretty clear relating to a different conversation.

Not in a million years. Thanks for pointing out I forgot to explain that one too.

Look I just said I don’t want to see diving. Pretty sure people on here have said it about Miggy, Joelinton and Wilson before and certainly complained about players like Alli and Grealish doing it. I don’t get this sudden change of reaction. Hardly a controversial opinion

Sorry, I should expect mocking from a load of people behind s keyboard for saying I don’t like someone’s cheating. If you guys don’t mind it I’m sure you can cope with my difference of opinion. The Tory bit was a joke before you get too upset.

Stop being a moron, I’m just stating my opinion. Absolutely ridiculous the way people jump on someone’s back here for having a difference of opinion. I’m sure none of you have ever complained about anyone else diving.

I agree they (and defenders in general) should be criticised for antics like shirt-pulling etc. Strikers of course foul too even without the diving fwiw. I just said I didn’t like it, having talked up what a player he is. It’s not going to change anything. Each to their own but hardly worth the reaction I’ve got

If he’s conning the same refs and defenders who screwed him over I can defend him more, but he’s not.

Oh yes they do and I have called them out previously before. Totally fair to appreciate these guys as players and still criticise behaviour. Quite why you’re having a go at someone calling out cheating from his own players I’ll never know but each to their own.

Yes and I’m also a Tory too as we’ve discussed previously. Sorry I don’t agree with everyone here. Hate it when people dare come on a forum and have a difference of opinion.

Doesn’t take anything away from a cracking performance mate. Was full of praise for him. But it’s still cheating and I don’t like that. He’ll get away with more than other players will, which isn’t really right.

Sorry I forgot I can’t criticise things like cheating. All the other teams do it you know. Great dive Callum, quality shithousery etc. ?

He is class and has been since he arrived aside from a brief spell mid-season this year. Tremendous season. That looked like a dive though and I won’t be tolerating that or defending it just because other teams do it.

Pretty close between him and Richarlison mind. Only 16 goals in it.

Yeah I think it would have been a goal without the deflection, but probably doesn’t get it because it wasn’t en route to Murphy. And I think that ultimately confirms why it’s not an assist because you can’t give it based on hypotheticals. That he created a goal with a stunning run doesn’t change. But there’s definite logic to why it’s not his assist.

It’s not really a joke though. It wouldn’t be his goal if he did the same run, then an off target shot went in off Tarkowski. Stats are overrated anyway. It was a brilliant run that led to a goal however the PL want to see it.

I know it feels stupid he doesn’t get an assist, but it’s like not giving a striker a deflected goal when he’s gone on an amazing run but his shot is off target. Understandable. But it doesn’t make it any less brilliant. Absolutely immoral stuff.

I think his first touch was always pretty good tbh. But he wouldn’t normally get a third touch back then… One of the odd things I find about him is how he never seemed able to outmuscle defenders with his back to goal (obviously not his role in fairness), but now he’s facing the opposite way he’s probably the strongest player I’ve seen here. Absolutely ridiculous.