Steve McClaren

[merlin]

This is becoming a joke - why did they take him back in the first place..? I thought only Ashley was mad enough to do that with a poor manager...

[mighty__mag]

Take a look at @5liveSport's Tweet:

 

How on earth did this fella work for us, infact anywhere?

[Sima]

Take a look at @5liveSport's Tweet:

 

How on earth did this fella work for us, infact anywhere?

 

That 5LiveSport background.  Magedia.

[B-more Mag]

I'd like some literature on this interesting "score the goal" tactic.

[U2]

I'd like some literature on this interesting "score the goal" tactic.

 

[U2]

He's so subservient.  No wonder he was under Thumb at our club.

[mighty__mag]

In that interview he may well have said, I never won anything in Holland, I just ran up and down the touchline while the team ignored me.

[louistoon]

Take a look at @5liveSport's Tweet:

 

How on earth did this fella work for us, infact anywhere?

 

 

I think he makes a good point re the general attitude of the english to tactics, but you have to wonder what the fuck his assistants and team were thinking.

[Guest chopey]

I remember reading something when Rafa was at Liverpool that he couldn't rely on Gerrard to hold down a position he just kept wandering out of position so he just gave him a free role in the team

[John P]

So, Steve McClaren essentially got told how the opposition and Twente were going to play by the 21 year old captain and the coaching staff. Just happened to coincide with the biggest success of his career.......

[Guest Howaythetoon]

I remember reading something when Rafa was at Liverpool that he couldn't rely on Gerrard to hold down a position he just kept wandering out of position so he just gave him a free role in the team

 

Rafa moved him to the right of midfield which Gerrard didn't like but he had his most productive season in that position since he emerged at Liverpool.

[toon25]

Take a look at @5liveSport's Tweet:

 

How on earth did this fella work for us, infact anywhere?

 

That 5LiveSport background.  Magedia.

 

Christ. Is he basically saying that his successful stone in Holland was effectively because the players knew what to do without his instruction?

[mozy]

He's not exactly wrong in saying that the majority of modern English players are thick as pigshit and can't think for themselves. 

[Tooj]

Tbf the whole program was really good and he did make some really good points about the attitude of the English game holding us back.

[The College Dropout]

I remember reading something when Rafa was at Liverpool that he couldn't rely on Gerrard to hold down a position he just kept wandering out of position so he just gave him a free role in the team

 

Rafa moved him to the right of midfield which Gerrard didn't like but he had his most productive season in that position since he emerged at Liverpool.

 

Gerrard was a tactical nightmare. Shelvey has that side of Gerrard's game with less ability and mobility.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

Tbf the whole program was really good and he did make some really good points about the attitude of the English game holding us back.

 

He's a good coach, but he's a wet drip of a man with zero leadership skills. It was a decent program like you said.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

I remember reading something when Rafa was at Liverpool that he couldn't rely on Gerrard to hold down a position he just kept wandering out of position so he just gave him a free role in the team

 

Rafa moved him to the right of midfield which Gerrard didn't like but he had his most productive season in that position since he emerged at Liverpool.

 

Gerrard was a tactical nightmare. Shelvey has that side of Gerrard's game with less ability and mobility.

 

Gerrard was a great player, but as you said tactically he wasn't the best and I always considered his technique suspect at times as well. He often over ran the ball when running with it for example and that meant he was charging around after it, tackling into players etc. which looked good on MOTD, but it was to the detriment of his all-round game. I think its an English disease, we like to run with the ball, but don't seem to have much control over it. Barkley is similar and Oxlade-Chamberlain at Arsenal. They just need to relax more. Now compare the likes of Scholes and Lampard on the ball and when moving with it. Different players of course, but far more technical.

[Mole_Toonfan]

HTT

 

Especially on the whole English players stuff, football intelligence wise most of the players that come through are very thick.

 

Even if they are technically and physically gifted, they don't make the smartest decisions over the last 20 years or so.

 

I really do wonder what the coaches are teaching these players at youth level tbh.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

HTT

 

Especially on the whole English players stuff, football intelligence wise most of the players that come through are very thick.

 

Even if they are technically and physically gifted, they don't make the smartest decisions over the last 20 years or so.

 

I really do wonder what the coaches are teaching these players at youth level tbh.

 

We like our players to run around, to bust a gut, to get stuck in, to win, to battle hard etc. and its something we drill into our kids as parents, as coaches, as fans and as managers when they turn pro. Its something we deem as important or even more important than skill and technique.

 

Gazza was the same by the way, that's why he had those injuries. He would over run the ball, as he did against Germany in the Semi at Italia 90 that got him his booking. And he was gifted technically and skillfully and massively so. But tactically he lacked brains and his decision making was very poor at times for someone as gifted as he was. That said, it is every English player's DNA to charge around, to get stuck in, to be brave, to put a tackle in. That's our game in a nutshell, with skill and technique coming secondary.

 

 

[mozy]

I read an article the other day about Italian managers and the way they are taught, it contained numerous quotes highlighting the importance of teaching the player to make the right decision under pressure. There's no way our young players can be receiving that kind of coaching.

[TRon]

I read an article the other day about Italian managers and the way they are taught, it contained numerous quotes highlighting the importance of teaching the player to make the right decision under pressure. There's no way our young players can be receiving that kind of coaching.

 

That's because it's pointless when our game is played at 100mph and refs are encouraged to be lenient because it's 'a man's game'. You can do that for 12 yr olds maybe, but once kids start maturing, the club coaches are going to want players who can stand up to a physical battering. If you watch football played on the continent it's a totally different game with players bringing the ball out under almost no pressure until they reach the opposition half.

[Killuminati]

So, Steve McClaren essentially got told how the opposition and Twente were going to play by the 21 year old captain and the coaching staff. Just happened to coincide with the biggest success of his career.......

Now to the curious question  Who was this 21 year old captain?

[triggs]

I read an article the other day about Italian managers and the way they are taught, it contained numerous quotes highlighting the importance of teaching the player to make the right decision under pressure. There's no way our young players can be receiving that kind of coaching.

 

That's because it's pointless when our game is played at 100mph and refs are encouraged to be lenient because it's 'a man's game'. You can do that for 12 yr olds maybe, but once kids start maturing, the club coaches are going to want players who can stand up to a physical battering. If you watch football played on the continent it's a totally different game with players bringing the ball out under almost no pressure until they reach the opposition half.

Surely that would make it even more important in the PL?

[The College Dropout]

I remember reading something when Rafa was at Liverpool that he couldn't rely on Gerrard to hold down a position he just kept wandering out of position so he just gave him a free role in the team

 

Rafa moved him to the right of midfield which Gerrard didn't like but he had his most productive season in that position since he emerged at Liverpool.

 

Gerrard was a tactical nightmare. Shelvey has that side of Gerrard's game with less ability and mobility.

 

Gerrard was a great player, but as you said tactically he wasn't the best and I always considered his technique suspect at times as well. He often over ran the ball when running with it for example and that meant he was charging around after it, tackling into players etc. which looked good on MOTD, but it was to the detriment of his all-round game. I think its an English disease, we like to run with the ball, but don't seem to have much control over it. Barkley is similar and Oxlade-Chamberlain at Arsenal. They just need to relax more. Now compare the likes of Scholes and Lampard on the ball and when moving with it. Different players of course, but far more technical.

 

Agreed, the issue is also off the ball and general football intelligence. It speaks to the understanding English players have of the game and their education. Cabaye has no more ability and barely anymore mobility than Shelvey but he thinks quicker on and off the ball. His positioning, tracking runners etc is much better. Someone like Santi Cazorla (or Giggs, Scholes tbf) can play a majority or a lot of their career out wide, second striker, #10 then play CM at a very high level. The ability is there of course but so is the mental know-how. The understanding of the game.

 

We produce very few intelligent players and we often don't rate the ones we have. Players are encouraged to play with little discipline. Ramsey in Spain would be a totally different player - he had the skillset for a really cultured game but the focus on goals and assists for a cm has made him a different (liability) of a CM. I've said it before but playing in England at a pivotal age meant Fabregas couldn't play the Barca style. Another one - off the ball nightmare. It's generally ok as Cesc Fabregas but for the average English clogger - not so much.

[mighty__mag]

So, Steve McClaren essentially got told how the opposition and Twente were going to play by the 21 year old captain and the coaching staff. Just happened to coincide with the biggest success of his career.......

Now to the curious question  Who was this 21 year old captain?

 

Likely it could have been Douglas who was 21 or so at the time. He was not captain of the 2008/9 side though.