Would you take Bellamy back?

[madras]

I remember meeting Bellamy on night out & he honestly thinks he is better player & goalscorer than Beardsley.

 

The rumpus started because I told hunchback he should learn off Peter Beardsley (who was coaching at Newcastle at the time) how to score 1 on 1's.

did he not get pissed off because a fan was criticising him and telling him how to improve his game and doesn't beardsley have that,unfortuntaly too frequent problem of being a once great player who is a shit coach.

[Thespence]

I remember meeting Bellamy on night out & he honestly thinks he is better player & goalscorer than Beardsley.

 

The rumpus started because I told hunchback he should learn off Peter Beardsley (who was coaching at Newcastle at the time) how to score 1 on 1's.

did he not get pissed off because a fan was criticising him and telling him how to improve his game and doesn't beardsley have that,unfortuntaly too frequent problem of being a once great player who is a s*** coach.

 

No, he was calm about it actually.

 

The odds are stacked against great players becoming good coaches as there are hell of a lot more hite players than great players. Also people class the likes of Wegner & Fergie as shite players but they were hardly Jose Mourhino when it comes to playing football.

[madras]

I remember meeting Bellamy on night out & he honestly thinks he is better player & goalscorer than Beardsley.

 

The rumpus started because I told hunchback he should learn off Peter Beardsley (who was coaching at Newcastle at the time) how to score 1 on 1's.

did he not get pissed off because a fan was criticising him and telling him how to improve his game and doesn't beardsley have that,unfortuntaly too frequent problem of being a once great player who is a s*** coach.

 

No, he was calm about it actually.

 

The odds are stacked against great players becoming good coaches as there are hell of a lot more hite players than great players. Also people class the likes of Wegner & Fergie as s**** players but they were hardly Jose Mourhino when it comes to playing football.

as much with beardsley that what made him great.....you just can't teach.

 

 

[Thespence]

I remember meeting Bellamy on night out & he honestly thinks he is better player & goalscorer than Beardsley.

 

The rumpus started because I told hunchback he should learn off Peter Beardsley (who was coaching at Newcastle at the time) how to score 1 on 1's.

did he not get pissed off because a fan was criticising him and telling him how to improve his game and doesn't beardsley have that,unfortuntaly too frequent problem of being a once great player who is a s*** coach.

 

No, he was calm about it actually.

 

The odds are stacked against great players becoming good coaches as there are hell of a lot more hite players than great players. Also people class the likes of Wegner & Fergie as s**** players but they were hardly Jose Mourhino when it comes to playing football.

as much with beardsley that what made him great.....you just can't teach.

 

I would loved him to of been able to each any of our strikers to "dip the shoulder & go." With the likes of him & Andy Cole you sort of knew if they got 1-on-1 it was in.

[Newcastle Fan]

Surely not, i've got nothing against Bellamy and think he's a really good player, but we've got Michel Owen and Oba Martins who are far better players, why sign another shot pacy striker?

[madras]

I remember meeting Bellamy on night out & he honestly thinks he is better player & goalscorer than Beardsley.

 

The rumpus started because I told hunchback he should learn off Peter Beardsley (who was coaching at Newcastle at the time) how to score 1 on 1's.

did he not get pissed off because a fan was criticising him and telling him how to improve his game and doesn't beardsley have that,unfortuntaly too frequent problem of being a once great player who is a s*** coach.

 

No, he was calm about it actually.

 

The odds are stacked against great players becoming good coaches as there are hell of a lot more hite players than great players. Also people class the likes of Wegner & Fergie as s**** players but they were hardly Jose Mourhino when it comes to playing football.

as much with beardsley that what made him great.....you just can't teach.

 

I would loved him to of been able to each any of our strikers to "dip the shoulder & go." With the likes of him & Andy Cole you sort of knew if they got 1-on-1 it was in.

even in his latter days i was never confident of shearer on 1 on 1's or pens.

[Thespence]

I remember meeting Bellamy on night out & he honestly thinks he is better player & goalscorer than Beardsley.

 

The rumpus started because I told hunchback he should learn off Peter Beardsley (who was coaching at Newcastle at the time) how to score 1 on 1's.

did he not get pissed off because a fan was criticising him and telling him how to improve his game and doesn't beardsley have that,unfortuntaly too frequent problem of being a once great player who is a s*** coach.

 

No, he was calm about it actually.

 

The odds are stacked against great players becoming good coaches as there are hell of a lot more hite players than great players. Also people class the likes of Wegner & Fergie as s**** players but they were hardly Jose Mourhino when it comes to playing football.

as much with beardsley that what made him great.....you just can't teach.

 

I would loved him to of been able to each any of our strikers to "dip the shoulder & go." With the likes of him & Andy Cole you sort of knew if they got 1-on-1 it was in.

even in his latter days i was never confident of shearer on 1 on 1's or pens.

 

I am with you as Al never gave me the same level of confidence of Cole & Beardsley when it was striker V keeper.

[Parky]

Surely not, i've got nothing against Bellamy and think he's a really good player, but we've got Michel Owen and Oba Martins who are far better players, why sign another shot pacy striker?

 

Yes we've got Owen for a few months. He will go.

[Benwell Lad]

Yes, yes and yes.

Still one of the best players in the Premiership and would love to see the passion he plays with in a B&W shirt again.

[Cronky]

Surely not, i've got nothing against Bellamy and think he's a really good player, but we've got Michel Owen and Oba Martins who are far better players, why sign another shot pacy striker?

 

Without getting into an argument about who is 'better', I do think Bellamy would offer us something different and something which we really need in order to pull defences around a bit. He's a creative player who operates well when he roams in that area between the striker and the midfield, and out on the wings. Martins and Owen are out and out strikers.

 

[Colos Short and Curlies]

Surely not, i've got nothing against Bellamy and think he's a really good player, but we've got Michel Owen and Oba Martins who are far better players, why sign another shot pacy striker?

 

Without getting into an argument about who is 'better', I do think Bellamy would offer us something different and something which we really need in order to pull defences around a bit. He's a creative player who operates well when he roams in that area between the striker and the midfield, and out on the wings. Martins and Owen are out and out strikers.

 

 

He'd also offer raw passion, something we are missing from our team as a whole

[Parky]

Now we're getting somewhere.

[OzzieMandias]

For what it's worth I do tend to think Ozzie was looking for bites from you with what he's been posting in here, to be honest, but then really what the fuck is new there?

 

It's unfortunately what he appears to do most of the time in the football forum.

 

To be honest, I was just saying what I think when asked the question in the thread header.

 

Sorry, like.

 

Apologies if that is genuinely the case, but it's the impression I get from you the majority of the time in here, whereas in Gen Chat you make fantastic posts like the one about Morocco earlier on.

 

 

Apology accepted. My posts on Bellamy here may sound a bit sarcastic, because they are, but I am trying to make a point too, and it's a point that I often try to make in a roundabout way -- that we spend far too much time living in the past and mooning around wishfully over long-departed players and managers. Bellamy is history. He should stay that way.

 

Morocco... well, I was in a position to be helpful, so I tried to be. Different kind of discussion.

 

Of course people look back in the past, it would be wrong not to embrace your history, but even more so at the moment due to the current situation we find ourselves in.

 

Why?

 

Embracing your history is different from wishing you had it back again, and solutions for the future are not found by trying to ressurrect the past.

[Tooj]

I remember meeting Bellamy on night out & he honestly thinks he is better player & goalscorer than Beardsley.

 

The rumpus started because I told hunchback he should learn off Peter Beardsley (who was coaching at Newcastle at the time) how to score 1 on 1's.

 

My uncle's mate was out with Mick Quinn that night when he flung him.

[cp40]

I remember meeting Bellamy on night out & he honestly thinks he is better player & goalscorer than Beardsley.

 

The rumpus started because I told hunchback he should learn off Peter Beardsley (who was coaching at Newcastle at the time) how to score 1 on 1's.

 

My uncle's mate was out with Mick Quinn that night when he flung him.

 

It amazes me the coverage, and bigging up some of the players get these days,...

eg, Wayne Rooney, does a couple of times a season , what Beardsley used to do every game......not fit to lace his boots imo.

[Guest SB]

Surely not, i've got nothing against Bellamy and think he's a really good player, but we've got Michel Owen and Oba Martins who are far better players, why sign another shot pacy striker?

 

Yes we've got Owen for a few months. He will go.

 

or few weeks. 

[Cronky]

Surely not, i've got nothing against Bellamy and think he's a really good player, but we've got Michel Owen and Oba Martins who are far better players, why sign another shot pacy striker?

 

Without getting into an argument about who is 'better', I do think Bellamy would offer us something different and something which we really need in order to pull defences around a bit. He's a creative player who operates well when he roams in that area between the striker and the midfield, and out on the wings. Martins and Owen are out and out strikers.

 

 

He'd also offer raw passion, something we are missing from our team as a whole

 

Yeah, Bellamy always goes out there thinking he's the best player on the pitch and determined to show it to everyone. We need a bit of that swagger, even if he's an irritating sod.

[thomas]

Problem is he was able to back up that swagger 6 years ago, is he now?  I say not. 

 

Maybe, MAYBE on a play to pay contract but I doubt he'd ever sign something like that. 

[Colos Short and Curlies]

Surely not, i've got nothing against Bellamy and think he's a really good player, but we've got Michel Owen and Oba Martins who are far better players, why sign another shot pacy striker?

 

Without getting into an argument about who is 'better', I do think Bellamy would offer us something different and something which we really need in order to pull defences around a bit. He's a creative player who operates well when he roams in that area between the striker and the midfield, and out on the wings. Martins and Owen are out and out strikers.

 

 

He'd also offer raw passion, something we are missing from our team as a whole

 

Yeah, Bellamy always goes out there thinking he's the best player on the pitch and determined to show it to everyone. We need a bit of that swagger, even if he's an irritating sod.

 

Someone mentioned above or in another thread that Bellas reckons he is a better player/finisher than Beardsley was.

 

I don't see what's wrong with that, rather someone with that attitude then Sholas (for example)

[NE5]

For what it's worth I do tend to think Ozzie was looking for bites from you with what he's been posting in here, to be honest, but then really what the fuck is new there?

 

It's unfortunately what he appears to do most of the time in the football forum.

 

To be honest, I was just saying what I think when asked the question in the thread header.

 

Sorry, like.

 

Apologies if that is genuinely the case, but it's the impression I get from you the majority of the time in here, whereas in Gen Chat you make fantastic posts like the one about Morocco earlier on.

 

 

Apology accepted. My posts on Bellamy here may sound a bit sarcastic, because they are, but I am trying to make a point too, and it's a point that I often try to make in a roundabout way -- that we spend far too much time living in the past and mooning around wishfully over long-departed players and managers. Bellamy is history. He should stay that way.

 

 

The idea is to learn from history.

 

Were you against Peter Beardsley coming back, by the way ?

 

 

 

No, that worked out good, but there were different factors at play -- the existing relationship between him and Keegan and how that overlapping history translated into an extremely effective communication between bench and pitch regarding a particular style of play, which was to some extent influenced by both players' experience at Liverpool.

 

Even if Bellamy a) wasn't so plagued by injury that he's been sleeping in a high-altitude tent, b) wasn't currently in very poor goal-scoring form and b) didn't already have a soured and divisive relationship to the club, I'd also doubt whether Joe "Crazy Gang" Kinnear was the right manager to get the best out of him.

 

it might not have worked out. And Bellamy might work out. You can't tell. This isn't about hindsight, its about making a decision. What do you think ? A 29 year old footballer isn't old.

 

The fact is, we need strengthening, and we have to get the best players possible. If a younger player isn't available who is better and we could get him, why would you say no ?

 

 

 

I think it's clear I think he's not a player we need at the moment. There are four specific reasons why in the post you quote. A fifth would be that his position is not one of those that needs strengthening as a priority right now.

 

Why would he come here at the moment anyway?

 

As he's a player who would go straight into the team, I couldn't disagree more. If there are 2 positions we need to strengthen, its in central midfield and up front, with pace in both areas and the desire to make things happen and be a good outlet.

 

Simple fact is Ozzie - you just don't want him back because of his personality, its nothing to do with what he does on the pitch.

 

 

[NE5]

For what it's worth I do tend to think Ozzie was looking for bites from you with what he's been posting in here, to be honest, but then really what the fuck is new there?

 

It's unfortunately what he appears to do most of the time in the football forum.

 

To be honest, I was just saying what I think when asked the question in the thread header.

 

Sorry, like.

 

Apologies if that is genuinely the case, but it's the impression I get from you the majority of the time in here, whereas in Gen Chat you make fantastic posts like the one about Morocco earlier on.

 

 

Apology accepted. My posts on Bellamy here may sound a bit sarcastic, because they are, but I am trying to make a point too, and it's a point that I often try to make in a roundabout way -- that we spend far too much time living in the past and mooning around wishfully over long-departed players and managers. Bellamy is history. He should stay that way.

 

Morocco... well, I was in a position to be helpful, so I tried to be. Different kind of discussion.

 

That's fair enough as well, I don't see how anybody could honestly dispute that as any sort of ridiculous opinion or perspective, although I would argue that it's sort of inbuilt into us as Newcastle supporters and it's inbuilt into the club in the way that players/managers always seem to come back, by hook or by crook.

 

Obviously simply because it happens doesn't mean it's right or that it will "work" for us, but I genuinely believe it's part of the romance of being a NUFC fan and I'm not sure I would want to swap it for a less emotional, more robotic approach, despite it often being the cause of most of our woes.

 

I admire the fact that you can distance yourself enough emotionally from the club to have that sort of opinion, like, as I'm not sure I'm quite mature enough/experienced enough to do it myself.

 

Upthread somewhere I think I used a "girlfriend" analogy. In normal life we all have to learn how to let things go, say "Well it was good while it lasted" and move on. Remaining stuck on a lost love simply isn't healthy. The attitude you describe may well be hard-wired into the romance of being a Toon fan, but if so I'd say it was one of the club's problems. Most of the other fans I speak to -- family and old friends, rather than people on here -- have similar attitudes to my own, though.

 

It's different for me, to be honest, and I'd imagine it's different for NE5 as well based on his perspectives on things.

 

All the lads I talk to about the game reminisce about the "good times", like we've been doing in the thread of the same name on here and the likes of my Granddad and my Dad always hark back to the same sort of times and wish that the same people could be involved and the same effect could occur (Keegan, Shearer, etc.)

 

I tend to agree that it can be a major problem for the club but when harnessed correctly - as has been the case with Keegan in particular on two occasions now (no matter how brief the second was) - it can be the thing that pushes us on and makes us the best that we can be.

 

As with most things I don't think the issue resides at one end of the see-saw, it's more like somewhere in the middle.

 

This topic is a fascinating one, though, and one that you're never going to get everyone agreeing on as it goes far deeper into things such as sociology, psychology, history and emotions than most other topics do. It takes some brains to be able to debate it effectively, basically, and a hell of a lot of time as well. It's one of those things that you can only really philosophise over yourself or talk to with your closest mates (who can actually think along the same lines) about and it's something (like most things regarding NUFC) that we, as individuals, cannot really do anything about - and is probably why things get so heated when discussing it/writing about it, as it comes bundled with a lot of frustration.

 

The whole thing is a massive headfuck, basically, much like anything else that matters in life. I have to say I'm definitely a lot happier since I accepted the fact I cannot change anything regarding NUFC and I just tend to roll with the punches a bit now. Still get that aching in the gut though when things like Keegan-gate occur or when we throw away a 2-0 lead against one of the worst top-flight teams I've ever seen in the flesh (bear in mind I'm a young 'un.)

 

I can say that watching football in the 1970's was better than now, simply because of the terraces, paying at the gate, jumping on a bus or whatever and going to away games ie last minute decisions, the players were more like us than they are now, less money, european football was better ie the knock outs, all sorts of things.

 

But so far as NUFC are concerned, the good old days ie the best days are the Keegan managerial years, without a shadow of doubt whatsoever, and that is absolutely no contest at all.

 

 

[Lotus]

For what it's worth I do tend to think Ozzie was looking for bites from you with what he's been posting in here, to be honest, but then really what the f*** is new there?

 

It's unfortunately what he appears to do most of the time in the football forum.

 

To be honest, I was just saying what I think when asked the question in the thread header.

 

Sorry, like.

 

Apologies if that is genuinely the case, but it's the impression I get from you the majority of the time in here, whereas in Gen Chat you make fantastic posts like the one about Morocco earlier on.

 

 

Apology accepted. My posts on Bellamy here may sound a bit sarcastic, because they are, but I am trying to make a point too, and it's a point that I often try to make in a roundabout way -- that we spend far too much time living in the past and mooning around wishfully over long-departed players and managers. Bellamy is history. He should stay that way.

 

 

The idea is to learn from history.

 

Were you against Peter Beardsley coming back, by the way ?

 

 

 

No, that worked out good, but there were different factors at play -- the existing relationship between him and Keegan and how that overlapping history translated into an extremely effective communication between bench and pitch regarding a particular style of play, which was to some extent influenced by both players' experience at Liverpool.

 

Even if Bellamy a) wasn't so plagued by injury that he's been sleeping in a high-altitude tent, b) wasn't currently in very poor goal-scoring form and b) didn't already have a soured and divisive relationship to the club, I'd also doubt whether Joe "Crazy Gang" Kinnear was the right manager to get the best out of him.

 

it might not have worked out. And Bellamy might work out. You can't tell. This isn't about hindsight, its about making a decision. What do you think ? A 29 year old footballer isn't old.

 

The fact is, we need strengthening, and we have to get the best players possible. If a younger player isn't available who is better and we could get him, why would you say no ?

 

 

 

I think it's clear I think he's not a player we need at the moment. There are four specific reasons why in the post you quote. A fifth would be that his position is not one of those that needs strengthening as a priority right now.

 

Why would he come here at the moment anyway?

 

As he's a player who would go straight into the team, I couldn't disagree more. If there are 2 positions we need to strengthen, its in central midfield and up front, with pace in both areas and the desire to make things happen and be a good outlet.

 

Simple fact is Ozzie - you just don't want him back because of his personality, its nothing to do with what he does on the pitch.

 

 

 

Well, i f**king loved Bellars but i don't believe he's as good as he was and i also think we need a different type of striker to him, someone good in the air because JFK seems to like playing that way. And as we have Oba and Owen (still) i'd prioritise other positions. A CM who can attack  and one who can actually run around a tackle (if the same guy can do both a la Gerrard then great) and a target man.

[OzzieMandias]

For what it's worth I do tend to think Ozzie was looking for bites from you with what he's been posting in here, to be honest, but then really what the fuck is new there?

 

It's unfortunately what he appears to do most of the time in the football forum.

 

To be honest, I was just saying what I think when asked the question in the thread header.

 

Sorry, like.

 

Apologies if that is genuinely the case, but it's the impression I get from you the majority of the time in here, whereas in Gen Chat you make fantastic posts like the one about Morocco earlier on.

 

 

Apology accepted. My posts on Bellamy here may sound a bit sarcastic, because they are, but I am trying to make a point too, and it's a point that I often try to make in a roundabout way -- that we spend far too much time living in the past and mooning around wishfully over long-departed players and managers. Bellamy is history. He should stay that way.

 

 

The idea is to learn from history.

 

Were you against Peter Beardsley coming back, by the way ?

 

 

 

No, that worked out good, but there were different factors at play -- the existing relationship between him and Keegan and how that overlapping history translated into an extremely effective communication between bench and pitch regarding a particular style of play, which was to some extent influenced by both players' experience at Liverpool.

 

Even if Bellamy a) wasn't so plagued by injury that he's been sleeping in a high-altitude tent, b) wasn't currently in very poor goal-scoring form and b) didn't already have a soured and divisive relationship to the club, I'd also doubt whether Joe "Crazy Gang" Kinnear was the right manager to get the best out of him.

 

it might not have worked out. And Bellamy might work out. You can't tell. This isn't about hindsight, its about making a decision. What do you think ? A 29 year old footballer isn't old.

 

The fact is, we need strengthening, and we have to get the best players possible. If a younger player isn't available who is better and we could get him, why would you say no ?

 

 

 

I think it's clear I think he's not a player we need at the moment. There are four specific reasons why in the post you quote. A fifth would be that his position is not one of those that needs strengthening as a priority right now.

 

Why would he come here at the moment anyway?

 

As he's a player who would go straight into the team, I couldn't disagree more. If there are 2 positions we need to strengthen, its in central midfield and up front, with pace in both areas and the desire to make things happen and be a good outlet.

 

Simple fact is Ozzie - you just don't want him back because of his personality, its nothing to do with what he does on the pitch.

 

 

 

If you're so damn sure you already know what I think, why waste time asking me questions only to ignore the answers?

 

(And there were at least four other reasons you haven't addressed.)

[Baggio]

He isn't anywhere near the player he was when he was first here.

 

1 goal and 0 assists this season in the league and he's played more football than any of our forwards.  That's a terrible record.

 

If it was any other player then everyone would be going mad claiming we shouldn't be signing other teams cast offs.

 

Those stats are awful.

[NE5]

For what it's worth I do tend to think Ozzie was looking for bites from you with what he's been posting in here, to be honest, but then really what the f*** is new there?

 

It's unfortunately what he appears to do most of the time in the football forum.

 

To be honest, I was just saying what I think when asked the question in the thread header.

 

Sorry, like.

 

Apologies if that is genuinely the case, but it's the impression I get from you the majority of the time in here, whereas in Gen Chat you make fantastic posts like the one about Morocco earlier on.

 

 

Apology accepted. My posts on Bellamy here may sound a bit sarcastic, because they are, but I am trying to make a point too, and it's a point that I often try to make in a roundabout way -- that we spend far too much time living in the past and mooning around wishfully over long-departed players and managers. Bellamy is history. He should stay that way.

 

 

The idea is to learn from history.

 

Were you against Peter Beardsley coming back, by the way ?

 

 

 

I wasn't - but Beardsley was a far better player than Bellamy ever was, PLUS the fact that he could be relied upon to give no trouble to his club or manager and to look after himself. He did ALL of these things in the years after he returned to NUFC, and KK knew he would, so he was a great buy.

 

I wouldn't have the same confidence in Bellamy - esp in his dealings with other players and as a good influence within the club.

 

Well, nobody is saying that Bellamy is or was as good as Beardsley. The point is that he came back and did well. He also wasn't as good as when he left. Terry Hibbit also comes into this category, he wasn't as good when he came back either. He was older, same as Beardsley, same as Bellamy is.

 

With regard to both players ie Beardsley and Terry Hibbit, the club was improved by them. Its just opinion, but I think that Bellamy would be better for Newcastle than somewhere else like where he is now. You can never say never. Thats all that matters really, especially with a big relegation fight on our hands here.