themanupstairs Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Pardew: “The problem is that where we are now financially means that we can never really fulfill the expectations of the fans. They have memories of European football but the gap is getting bigger as the years go by." He's suggesting that European football is beyond us, but we were only 4 wins off Liverpool in 6th place last year. If we'd used our momentum to add to what we had then we could have gone upwards, just as we did after promotion then 3rd place under Keegan. As Pardew says the gap is getting ever wider between those with European enhanced incomes and the rest, but we have the stadium and the support to be up there again. We have to use momentum and build on it, not keep bringing ourselves to a grinding halt while praying that we don't go backwards. A winning team can sell players easily and at a premium - but don't sell them until the team has evolved enough to not need them. We could speculate to accumulate without mortgaging our future - by all means scout far and wide and buy bargains, but let them earn their way over time into a succesful team then sell off the slack. Evolution not constant painful revolution. Top top post One has to wonder why something so logical isn't the strategic basis for operation by a supposedly intelligent businessman such as Mike Ashley. I agree TBH, but I hope/think that we will be able to show some progress under the Ashley approach to transfers. I think it's true we're getting further away from the top 4 (although we've been miles away for years anyway) but I think the Europa League is definitely achievable in the medium term. Last season we finished closer to Europe than for ages, and that was following a relegation and with our best attacking player out for the season. I don't think we're as far away as some people might think. We weren't too far that is true, but I reckon it's down to the entire league panning out quite differently than usual, whereby the teams that finished 2nd and 3rd lost 9 games each (a lot more than normally would lose), and hence meaning that the smaller fish picked up quite a few points off them. If this continues to happen, finishing in a European spot is just as likely as relegation for a club of our stature and an average squad as ours. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Antec Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 We haven't got the money to challenge at the very top, we all know that so 7th is the absolute best we can hope for and that's what we should be aiming at. If we end up 8th, 9th, 10th etc then so be it. I think most fans accept this and don't want 15 and 20 million pound signings just to maybe finish one or two places higher. A bit of decent strength in depth would be fine, a reasonably priced striker, defender and maybe another midfielder would more than suffice Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
arnonel Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 I think we can do it going the Arsenal model - Its just not going to be overnight - its going to be 5+ seasons of hoping for top 10s until we unearth some young gems and give them a chance to breakthrough Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 The Arsenal 'model' relies solely on Arsene Wenger (with a previous nod to David Dein). We have nothing of the sort. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Venkman Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Everton are above us, have a lower turnover and spend nothing. If we can't even be expected to compete against a club like that then theres something wrong. I don't think anyone expects us to all of a sudden become top 6, but we should be able to be the best of the rest, and continue to build the club. That should be the aim. It won't happen every year, but it should be the aim. Obviously having a s*** manager doesn't help this. The club has already said it wants a top ten finish, i think everyone can agree, we'd all be happy with a top ten this year? If so, im not even sure what we are arguing about. Would you be saying the same if Tchoyi had headed his final chance over the bar? Very convenient result for the club that was. Regardless of what happened last season, a top ten finish would represent progress. Again, I think we'd all take that. It wouldn't have if we'd beaten West Brom. But we didnt? As I say, very convenient. I think if we don't finish in the top seven, then we've failed. :lol: # What?? Didnt you say we are going down if we dont sign a striker. So relegated if we dont sign a striker, top 7 of we do fkn hell. What are you on about? I never said I thought we'll finish 7th with a striker. Where we are in the league, the money at our disposal, anything less than 7th is failure imo. Jesus, its nee wonder people call us deluded. Anything less than 7th is failure. f*** me. A £35million windfall if invested properly could have us challenging for a top 6 place. Why is there such satisfaction with mediocrity on here? It's either that or it's simply the wanton need to look clever on the internet. bingo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
arnonel Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 The Arsenal model relies solely on Arsene Wenger (and formerly David Dein). We have neither. Would it help you if i said - "aspire" to replicate arsenal/ajax model? You get the drift - we want to grow through youth/long term Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueStar Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 The Arsenal 'model' relies solely on Arsene Wenger (with a previous nod to David Dein). We have nothing of the sort. It also relies on not selling your young talent as soon as they have a decent 3 months in the premier league. How come Arsenal still have Fabregas when for the past two years, at any time, they could have sold him for a fortune to Barca and replaced him with one of their promising youngsters? Can they not even follow their own model? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Venkman Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 The Arsenal model relies solely on Arsene Wenger (and formerly David Dein). We have neither. Would it help you if i said - "aspire" to replicate arsenal/ajax model? You get the drift - we want to grow through youth/long term grow what? a team? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Aside from Chelsea and Man City, like every club in England then. Revolutionary. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
arnonel Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Im not saying its right Im not saying its working My opinion is that its the aspiration of the owners to replicate a long term strategy. In the short term selling our "best" players to balance books. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Im not saying its right Im not saying its working My opinion is that its the aspiration of the owners to replicate a long term strategy. In the short term selling our "best" players to balance books. Fair comment. But what if rather than simply balancing the books, we post a significant profit? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Aside from Chelsea and Man City, like every club in England then. Revolutionary. Well we weren't doing it before Ashley, so it's pretty revolutionary for us. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bealios Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 As an aside and on the subject of aiming for Europe, as things stand at the moment would we even be allowed in under the football fair play rules? I know we're aiming towards a break even point in 2015, but if we qualify before then would we pass the financial tests, although I appreciate they don't apply yet. I think much of what Pardew says about being realistic about challenging for the top four is right, although the one thing that might change that in the medium term is these financial restrictions, if they are applied properly (I'm looking at you Man City and your £400m shirt sponsorship deal....). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Im not saying its right Im not saying its working My opinion is that its the aspiration of the owners to replicate a long term strategy. In the short term selling our "best" players to balance books. It's only become their strategy as it's the cheaper way of doing things. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Aside from Chelsea and Man City, like every club in England then. Revolutionary. Well we weren't doing it before Ashley, so it's pretty revolutionary for us. You must have missed the years Sir Bobby Robson was in charge. Unlucky. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueStar Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 The "Arsenal Model" of reliance on internal youth development requires a higher level of competence to implement than the 'normal' way of running a football club and we've got even less of that at this club than we've got money. I don't really consider it to be a tactic that plays to our strengths. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Wally_McFool Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 The "Arsenal model" also does not involve selling your best players willy nilly at the first opportunity. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Crooks Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Willy Nilly is nowhere near our best player man Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Aside from Chelsea and Man City, like every club in England then. Revolutionary. Well we weren't doing it before Ashley, so it's pretty revolutionary for us. You must have missed the years Sir Bobby Robson was in charge. Unlucky. Fair point, we did some mental spending on shit players under a variety of other managers though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Antec Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 As an aside and on the subject of aiming for Europe, as things stand at the moment would we even be allowed in under the football fair play rules? I know we're aiming towards a break even point in 2015, but if we qualify before then would we pass the financial tests, although I appreciate they don't apply yet. I think much of what Pardew says about being realistic about challenging for the top four is right, although the one thing that might change that in the medium term is these financial restrictions, if they are applied properly (I'm looking at you Man City and your £400m shirt sponsorship deal....). He is right, I've not come across one single person who thinks otherwise Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skirge Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 The smile at work http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/nechronical/feb2011/5/7/cheick-tiote-pictured-with-alan-pardew-307608639.jpg Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Crooks Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 The smile at work http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/nechronical/feb2011/5/7/cheick-tiote-pictured-with-alan-pardew-307608639.jpg Didn't think pardew was that tall? Or is it Tiote lifting his body weight using a mere handshake? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fenham Mag Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 The smile at work http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/nechronical/feb2011/5/7/cheick-tiote-pictured-with-alan-pardew-307608639.jpg Didn't think pardew was that tall? Or is it Tiote lifting his body weight using a mere handshake? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzzieMandias Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 I remember Arsenal selling their then best striker to Real Madrid for a vast sum not that long ago. And it's definitely part of Levy's plan for Tottenham to sell players if an offer comes in that is vastly more than the club's valuation. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERTOON Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 The smile at work http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/nechronical/feb2011/5/7/cheick-tiote-pictured-with-alan-pardew-307608639.jpg Didn't think pardew was that tall? Or is it Tiote lifting his body weight using a mere handshake? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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