AliGupter Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 The reason few regarded Federer as the best of all time was his distinct lack of quality opposition from 03 - 07. You can't apply the same theory to Messi. What a load of nonsense. Not really, reckon Rafa and Djokovic dream of playing Baghdatis and Phillipoussis in Grand Slam finals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AliGupter Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 Cruyff evolved football more than any other player, imo. i kn ow what you mean but i disagree, he was the epitome of a strand that had been going for a while with beckenbauer and bobby charlton, george best, players who were quite far ahead of their times and cruyff came after them really. Can't see how Cruyff relates to these players in style. But I agree that you can't peg total football just on him. But what that Dutch side did for football is one of the game's greatest revolutions, imho. in the style that they had a much newer idea of the game than what had been before. and were very, even as we would know it now "modern" footballers. Fair, but at the very least he was a pioneer of probably the most important style of football there has ever been (imagine if it had never existed?), the other players you mention were all ahead of their time, but I don't think they helped revolutionise football as Cruyff did. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 Cruyff evolved football more than any other player, imo. i kn ow what you mean but i disagree, he was the epitome of a strand that had been going for a while with beckenbauer and bobby charlton, george best, players who were quite far ahead of their times and cruyff came after them really. Can't see how Cruyff relates to these players in style. But I agree that you can't peg total football just on him. But what that Dutch side did for football is one of the game's greatest revolutions, imho. in the style that they had a much newer idea of the game than what had been before. and were very, even as we would know it now "modern" footballers. Fair, but at the very least he was a pioneer of probably the most important style of football there has ever been (imagine if it had never existed?), the other players you mention were all ahead of their time, but I don't think they helped revolutionise football as Cruyff did. without those players it's arguable that that system wouldn't have came about. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredbob Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 The reason few regarded Federer as the best of all time was his distinct lack of quality opposition from 03 - 07. You can't apply the same theory to Messi. What a load of nonsense. Not really, reckon Rafa and Djokovic dream of playing Baghdatis and Phillipoussis in Grand Slam finals. For the record the tennis analogy was only small part of a much larger point but for the sakes of argument, Im sure they'd be be having wet ones at the thought of playing Martin, Ivanisevic and Chang - just to cherry pick a few finalists to make a point. Assuming you take Sampras as the greatest ever. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AliGupter Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 The reason few regarded Federer as the best of all time was his distinct lack of quality opposition from 03 - 07. You can't apply the same theory to Messi. What a load of nonsense. Not really, reckon Rafa and Djokovic dream of playing Baghdatis and Phillipoussis in Grand Slam finals. For the record the tennis analogy was only small part of a much larger point but for the sakes of argument, Im sure they'd be be having wet ones at the thought of playing Martin, Ivanisevic and Chang - just to cherry pick a few finalists to make a point. Assuming you take Sampras as the greatest ever. No I don't take Sampras as the greatest ever. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredbob Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 The reason few regarded Federer as the best of all time was his distinct lack of quality opposition from 03 - 07. You can't apply the same theory to Messi. What a load of nonsense. Not really, reckon Rafa and Djokovic dream of playing Baghdatis and Phillipoussis in Grand Slam finals. For the record the tennis analogy was only small part of a much larger point but for the sakes of argument, Im sure they'd be be having wet ones at the thought of playing Martin, Ivanisevic and Chang - just to cherry pick a few finalists to make a point. Assuming you take Sampras as the greatest ever. No I don't take Sampras as the greatest ever. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MW Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 What was the record he broke by scoring 48 goals the other night? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fugazi Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 What was the record he broke by scoring 48 goals the other night? Most goals in a season by a Barca player, he previously held the record jointly with Ronaldo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punk77 Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 Imo Zidane was a better player. Messi is all about pace, low center of gravity and the ball being glued to his foot. That of course makes him hard to stop. But Zidane could pull of different kind of dribbles, which you never see Messi perform. One might say that Messi is more effective in his dribbling, but Zidane made everything so gracefully. The way he just waited out his opponent before he eased passed him. Brilliant. Also he could dribble, shoot, and usher the ball with both feet, while Messi depends more or less on his left. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Snrub Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 Zidane could pull off the spectacular, but he wasn't really good at shooting and goalscoring. He never managed to score more than 10 goals in a season in his career. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JH Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 For me, Messi ranks as no.2 in football's greatest. Just behind Djimi Traore. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fugazi Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 For me, Messi ranks as no.2 in football's greatest. Just behind Djimi Traore. Fuck off, man He's neewhere near Djimi's incredible level. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Flatline Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 Skillwise he probably already is the greatest player ever, it looks like a U18 player having fun with a U14 side most of the time, effortless performance. Regarding the World cup vs club fotball arguement, both sides are right, it just depends on the angle. Put another way, I dont think anyone disagrees that world cup fotball is hardly a step up anymore, hell most club teams would probably steamroll the equivalent national teams.. and why shouldnt they, they play together all year compared to a handful of national team gatherings which for many are more like a fratboy rendez-vous rather than serious practice. However, words like "Greatness" and "Legend" are inexplicably and inevitably linked with the World cup, there cant be any other way. Its you vs the world, your team vs everyone else, you are playing for your country and for the honor of the fatherland. What greater honor can there be, what greater occation on which to rise, what battle greater for a legend to lead. That is for me, so far, where Messi falls short. Not on the actual skills, the different categories covering the spesifics of fotball such as passing dribbling shooting etc - That X-factor and aura of leadership is for me what marks a true great and in turn what makes someone the greatest ever. Its not about whether you rate the world cup higher or lower than club fotball - or champions league. Its whether you rise to the occation. Like former Legends. Call it a box which needs to be checked if you will - and argue all you will about the validity and legitimacy of that box - but for the majority of people out there, it needs to be checked, end of. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Snrub Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 Skillwise he probably already is the greatest player ever That would be Ronaldinho. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
henke Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 If for aguments sake Messis career ended this weekend, then in ten or twenty years time i think he'd definately be talked about as being up there with the best ever. Depsite being only 23. (is he?) As far as i'm concerned Diego Maradona is the greatest footballer of all time, and the obvious standard by which to compare Messi to. Again, in my opinion of course, not there yet. But not far off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyPalAl Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 No 2. Just behind Beardsley. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Flatline Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 Skillwise he probably already is the greatest player ever That would be Ronaldinho. I agree provided we define the term skill, I was more leaning toward the efficiency of his skills in terms of converting them to assists and goals. But yes, in terms of skill as in something more related to flair, Ronaldinho was his peer in that respect. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzzieMandias Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 "Barça's Lionel Messi is a great but Ronaldo is lacking, says Johan Cruyff" http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2011/apr/15/johan-cruyff-lionel-messi-cristiano-ronaldo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 He's spot on, as per usual. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Segun Oluwaniyi Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 For me, Messi ranks as no.2 in football's greatest. Just behind Djimi Traore. f*** off, man He's neewhere near Djimi's incredible level. His back heeled pirouette finish against Burnley is the most preeminent piece of football that I have witnessed during my time on this Earth. I'm was too young and separated to truly remember the greats before 2000. In the new century, Messi is clearly the best player and there is very little in the way of real competition. Dominant, relentless, and graceful. You have to hope he doesn't experience injury, with what he has already accomplished at such a young age. The next 10-12 years could truly be special if there is no unfortunate circumstance, and the boy can keep his head. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzzieMandias Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 For me, Messi ranks as no.2 in football's greatest. Just behind Djimi Traore. f*** off, man He's neewhere near Djimi's incredible level. His back heeled pirouette finish against Burnley is the most preeminent piece of football that I have witnessed during my time on this Earth. I'm was too young and separated to truly remember the greats before 2000. In the new century, Messi is clearly the best player and there is very little in the way of real competition. Dominant, relentless, and graceful. You have to hope he doesn't experience injury, with what he has already accomplished at such a young age. The next 10-12 years could truly be special if there is no unfortunate circumstance, and the boy can keep his head. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Flash Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 "The Argentinian, 23, has scored 95 goals in his last 99 games" Sexual. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ketsbaia Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 If Messi wasn't around, we'd probably be saying all this about CRonaldo, whose goal scoring record is also extraordinary. Poor Crissy. Seems like the world can't handle two of them at once..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fugazi Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 If Messi wasn't around, we'd probably be saying all this about CRonaldo, whose goal scoring record is also extraordinary. Poor Crissy. Seems like the world can't handle two of them at once..... CRon is more of a cunt too, which goes against him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 Cristiano is the 2nd best forward in the world and probably the best player ever to grace the Premier League. He'll have to be content with those meagre accolades for now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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