Mike Ashley

[Colos Short and Curlies]

All of these people who reckon we'd have done a Portsmouth without Ashley are talking Shite. Does no one think that at some point we wouldn't have been sold to someone else?

 

 

 

Someone like Mansour perhaps (actually I 100% think we would now have Aguero playing upfront for us now if Ashley hadn't bought the club)

[maze]

Yet another stunning performance from one of Ashley's fantastic businesses 

[Thomson Mouse]

You've fallen hook, line and sinker for Lambiass' and Ashley's rethoric Thomson Mouse. The club debt has doubled since Ashley took over, whilst commercial and matchday revenue has dropped significantly. We're certainly not better off financially, the only saving grace is Ashley has the capital to shoulder the debt. Who knows what might have happened if Hall and Shepherd had not sold. Pouring money into the club when Souness was manager had obviously not worked iut in hindsight. I like to think Shepherd was aware of this, hence the appointment of a manager capable of working on a tight budget (Allardyce). If things hadn't worked out we might have been taken over by another owner capable and willing to grow the club. To say we would have gone under without a doubt is just make belief.

 

Right, let's get this bullshit back on track.

 

A few posts ago I posted this:

 

"Now some people with tiny minds will read that as me sticking up for Ashley."

 

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt mate as your heart seems in the right place.

 

What you and some other people seem unable to grasp is that just because you despise Shepherd and what he did, this doesn't mean you support Ashely and what he is doing. I despise them both and I have not 'fallen' for anything.

 

Please explain how the dept has doubled. I am aware the commercial revenue has dropped and that is a disgrace in itself, although it suggests more about Ashley's attitude towards the club.

 

Financially we are better off, that is a fact. We are in profit, under Shepherd we were making a loss. You mention it is a 'saving grace' that Ashley can shoulder the debt. Why is this a 'saving grace'? Is it, perhaps, that we were on the financial brink as a club? Barclays were straining at the leash to call in our hefty overdraft and most of our immediate future income had already been squandered on the ludicrous Owen transfer (who then Shepherd tried to give away to some scousers at a set of Jesmond traffic lights).

 

You then ask what might have happened if they had not sold their shares - fair comment, but were you aware that Shepherd had already blocked bids from several consortia and that others walked away due to the state of the finances? The only thing that Shepherd was aware of was that the club had very little money to spend when he appointed Allardyce. It was his last role of the dice.

 

I don't say we would have gone under 'without a doubt', but it was more probable than not. We had no serious source of income, were in debt and had no way of out of it. The model under Shepherd was unsustainable.

 

Now please understand this: I hate Ashley, I despise the bastard for what he is doing to my club. His way of managing the club is not the right one and I hope he disappears tomorrow.

 

What you need to understand is that just because I have pointed out how bad the opportunist headline grabbing sack of shit that Shepherd is, THIS DOES NOT MEAN I LIKE ASHLEY OR WHAT HE HAS DONE. I spent a reasonable part of my life trying to get Shepherd out along with some local journos and 'others'.

 

If you don't believe me try this place http://www.nufcmismanagement.info/index.html  It's just a shame that the excellent NUFC finances site isn't running still, that would have helped you with the Shepherd era.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Thomson Mouse]

All of these people who reckon we'd have done a Portsmouth without Ashley are talking s****. Does no one think that at some point we wouldn't have been sold to someone else?

 

 

 

Shhh stop talking common sense.

 

There is no common sense involved in that statement.

[Guest bimpy474]

All of these people who reckon we'd have done a Portsmouth without Ashley are talking s****. Does no one think that at some point we wouldn't have been sold to someone else?

 

 

 

Shhh stop talking common sense.

 

There is no common sense involved in that statement.

 

Unfortunately it's something that you cannot disprove. Hence it would and could have been quite possible, and fairly common sense to think it might.

[Wullie]

Of course the debt has doubled under Ashley.

 

Statements like "Barclays were straining at the leash to call in our hefty overdraft" don't help your argument either Thomson Mouse. Pure speculation.

[Thomson Mouse]

Of course the debt has doubled under Ashley.

 

Statements like "Barclays were straining at the leash to call in our hefty overdraft" don't help your argument either Thomson Mouse. Pure speculation.

 

What was the debt when Ashley took over?

 

That is not pure speculation. Barclays wanted to call the overdraft in, it was common knowledge.

[Thomson Mouse]

All of these people who reckon we'd have done a Portsmouth without Ashley are talking s****. Does no one think that at some point we wouldn't have been sold to someone else?

 

 

 

Shhh stop talking common sense.

 

There is no common sense involved in that statement.

 

Unfortunately it's something that you cannot disprove. Hence it would and could have been quite possible, and fairly common sense to think it might.

 

Not when you look at how many times Shepherd had blocked potential takeovers.

[Mick]

They are both shit, Shepherd was shit, Ashley is shit.

[Guest bimpy474]

All of these people who reckon we'd have done a Portsmouth without Ashley are talking s****. Does no one think that at some point we wouldn't have been sold to someone else?

 

 

 

Shhh stop talking common sense.

 

There is no common sense involved in that statement.

 

Unfortunately it's something that you cannot disprove. Hence it would and could have been quite possible, and fairly common sense to think it might.

 

Not when you look at how many times Shepherd had blocked potential takeovers.

 

Didn't block Ashley, so there's no way of knowing that he wouldn't have blocked someone else if Ashley's bid had fallen through.

 

We can do this all night, all ifs and buts that can't be totally proven either way.

[Wullie]

Of course the debt has doubled under Ashley.

 

Statements like "Barclays were straining at the leash to call in our hefty overdraft" don't help your argument either Thomson Mouse. Pure speculation.

 

What was the debt when Ashley took over?

 

That is not pure speculation. Barclays wanted to call the overdraft in, it was common knowledge.

 

Around £61m.

 

"Common knowledge"? You'll have to do better than that.

[Thomson Mouse]

Of course the debt has doubled under Ashley.

 

Statements like "Barclays were straining at the leash to call in our hefty overdraft" don't help your argument either Thomson Mouse. Pure speculation.

 

What was the debt when Ashley took over?

 

That is not pure speculation. Barclays wanted to call the overdraft in, it was common knowledge.

 

Around £61m.

 

"Common knowledge"? You'll have to do better than that.

 

http://www.sportspromedia.com/notes_and_insights/bank_orders_newcastle_united_to_cut_overdraft/

 

http://www.football.co.uk/newcastle_united/trio_s_exit_vital_to_seal_deal_rss183561.shtml

 

 

Quick google.

 

That was debts carried over from Shepherd which Ashley paid off by his now infamous 'loan'

 

[Guest antz1uk]

these were debts that had to be paid in the event of any new owner, not had shepherd remained in charge

[Thomson Mouse]

So Shepherd was responsible then?

[Guest antz1uk]

the loan/debt may have been serviceable had shepherd remained/ plc etc.. we will never know, what we do know is no one was asking for the loan/debt to be called in, that is you sensationalising, eggagerating the fact. it was only called in due to a change of ownership. as per terms and conditions, im not entering into this with you as a debate cos frankly you're posts have been shit, however i have merely stated facts, ehich we know are to be true

[Wullie]

Of course the debt has doubled under Ashley.

 

Statements like "Barclays were straining at the leash to call in our hefty overdraft" don't help your argument either Thomson Mouse. Pure speculation.

 

What was the debt when Ashley took over?

 

That is not pure speculation. Barclays wanted to call the overdraft in, it was common knowledge.

 

Around £61m.

 

"Common knowledge"? You'll have to do better than that.

 

http://www.sportspromedia.com/notes_and_insights/bank_orders_newcastle_united_to_cut_overdraft/

 

http://www.football.co.uk/newcastle_united/trio_s_exit_vital_to_seal_deal_rss183561.shtml

 

 

Quick google.

 

That was debts carried over from Shepherd which Ashley paid off by his now infamous 'loan'

 

 

Don't really know where to start with that tbh.

 

a) the article was published two years after Ashley bought the club.

b) it was published when we were in the Championship where obviously the club's ability to pay its debts had become compromised - by Mike Ashley's mismanagement. You can't blame Shepherd for that particular enormous change in circumstance.

c) the club accrued a lot of debt upon purchase because of the structure of the loan on the stadium. Again, that comes down to Ashley not doing due diligence and would not have been the case had Shepherd remained.

 

Nobody questions that the finances of the club were looking decidedly ropey at the time. Even Shepherd knew that, which is why he brought in Allardyce, in the hope that he could solidify us enough on a pittance for a couple of years. My objection is to the use of terms like "bankrupt", which is just nonsense. Even Leeds and Portsmouth have never gotten as far as declaring bankruptcy for God's sake, and their financial problems make ours at the time look like owing your mam a fiver.

[Thomson Mouse]

The overdraft was there before Ashley took the club over and the club was losing money.

 

The stadium loan was structured by Shepherd/Halls, not because Ashley did not do DD.

 

 

[Wullie]

The overdraft was there before Ashley took the club over and the club was losing money.

 

The stadium loan was structured by Shepherd/Halls, not because Ashley did not do DD.

 

 

 

The loan didn't have to be paid off immediately under Shepherd. Surely you know this?

[Unbelievable]

Hugely increased TV revenue since Ashley took over, in no way attributable to him directly, simply glosses over how grossly he's mismanaging us financially. Our debt has doubled inside 7 years, non-TV related revenue income has almost halved at a time where nearly every other Premiership club has seen significant growth, and ultimately we're posting profits because we are a selling club who don't reinvest even the money generated in the playing or coaching side of the football club. I cannot believe people are falling for this insane notion that we were heading for financial ruin until Mike saved the day. The Hall/Shepherd ownership pisses all over this one on any level, including financial, even if it was going stale towards the end.

[Thomson Mouse]

Hugely increased TV revenue since Ashley took over, in no way attributable to him directly, simply glosses over how grossly he's mismanaging us financially. Our debt has doubled inside 7 years, non-TV related revenue income has almost halved at a time where nearly every other Premiership club has seen significant growth, and ultimately we're posting profits because we are a selling club who don't reinvest even the money generated in the playing or coaching side of the football club. I cannot believe people are falling for this insane notion that we were heading for financial ruin until Mike saved the day. The Hall/Shepherd ownership pisses all over this one on any level, including financial, even if it was going stale towards the end.

 

Agree with everything apart 'Mike saved the day' and the club was going down a very poor financial path.

 

Genuinely would like to see how the debt has doubled though. No bullshit or anything.

[Kaizero]

Hugely increased TV revenue since Ashley took over, in no way attributable to him directly, simply glosses over how grossly he's mismanaging us financially. Our debt has doubled inside 7 years, non-TV related revenue income has almost halved at a time where nearly every other Premiership club has seen significant growth, and ultimately we're posting profits because we are a selling club who don't reinvest even the money generated in the playing or coaching side of the football club. I cannot believe people are falling for this insane notion that we were heading for financial ruin until Mike saved the day. The Hall/Shepherd ownership pisses all over this one on any level, including financial, even if it was going stale towards the end.

 

 

Think the financial situation under Ashley has been a lie repeated so much it's taken as truth. Looking at the numbers we're doing okay, but we should be doing fucking great.

[Thomson Mouse]

I agree entirely. People just can't seem to separate Shepherd = bad, Ashely = good, from Shepherd = arsehole, Ashley = arsehole.

[Thomson Mouse]

The overdraft was there before Ashley took the club over and the club was losing money.

 

The stadium loan was structured by Shepherd/Halls, not because Ashley did not do DD.

 

 

 

The loan didn't have to be paid off immediately under Shepherd. Surely you know this?

 

It didn't. The club were going to struggle to meet the repayments though due to profit/loss under Shepherd. Surely you knew this?

[Thomson Mouse]

nah mate. nah. ashley is a 10 on the shiteometer and FFS was a 7.5, don't know how you're rating him a 7.6 and here's 20 pages of historical opinion why because it really really matters to me that you don't consider him as bad as you do

they're both 10 on the shiteometer for me just for different reasons.

 

Yep, spot on.

 

I just don't like seeing the Shepherd love-in that has been happening over the last few pages.

 

The blokes a moron.

 

Can't put it any clearer than jdckelly

[Wullie]

The overdraft was there before Ashley took the club over and the club was losing money.

 

The stadium loan was structured by Shepherd/Halls, not because Ashley did not do DD.

 

 

 

The loan didn't have to be paid off immediately under Shepherd. Surely you know this?

 

It didn't. The club were going to struggle to meet the repayments though due to profit/loss under Shepherd. Surely you knew this?

 

How do you get from that to bankruptcy?