Hanshithispantz Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 He really isn't. If anything Cisse drops back into midfield. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawK Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 Perhaps we just disagree, but from my point of view of the matches I see, it's Cisse and Sissoko up front pressing, with our wide players forming a line with our central midfield. When we get the ball, we break in this shape. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Phil K Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 That's what I don't understand. We expect more from Shola than he can give and we abuse him when he doesn't live up to it. Yet, Cisse under performs when we know he can play so much better but it is ignored and at worst, blamed on other less talented players. Its a point Ive made a couple of times myself. Not only Cisse - happened many times in the past many on here mock and sneer at Shola, but defend others not performing I can't understand it either. What is even more baffling is how those ranting at Shola rant all the louder when this is pointed out, as if you're "not supposed to mention this, just take it for granted that it's right" To be fair on Cisse, I just don't think the lucks with him this season though. No lack of effort, certainly Poor players get criticised for being poor, some fans are even intelligent enough to assess performance relative to the player. No. Certain players get scapegoated, a good example was when we beat QPR 1-0 and Shola produced, none of the others did. Within hours, he was getting mocked again while those who DIDN'T produce didn't get a bit of criticism. Most fans will just jump on the bandwagon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiresias Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 I understand what you're getting at Hawk, certainly Sissoko is a forward with Cisse and it's less to do with shape on team sheet, but we've gone from having a light midfield to one where the forwards drop into it to give us numbers in the middle. Also in Gouffran and Jonas we have wide players who cut in narrow so it resembles a 4-2-3-1 more than 4-4-2. We have fluidity in the middle again compared to when we played proper 4-4-2 where we were stuck in our half with the forwards completely seperated from the rest of the players. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 Shola doesn't deserve personal abuse, but he gets stick (or Pardew does for playing him) because he should be no where near the team. It's more "why the fuck is he still playing for us, he's shit", which to be honest is a harsh but accurate statement. Fans clearly believe that Cisse is actually more than good enough to be our main centre forward and therefore have much more time for him being in the side. Surely you can see the difference here? EDIT: No doubt certain players are used as scapegoats when we lose like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawK Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 Perhaps Tiesias, to me it appeared we got the best out of Cisse last season when we had a clear 3 up front rather than what appears to be 2 now. Ba and HBA running all over the place made so much space for Cisse to do what he does best. I think Cisse's suffering from Sissoko pushing too far up the pitch off the ball rather than our wide players. Sissoko doesn't create the space like the other 2 did as that's not his job from what I can see. That's not to say we're not getting him chances now, but they seem to be in different areas and where he's leading the line. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 Perhaps Tiesias, to me it appeared we got the best out of Cisse last season when we had a clear 3 up front rather than what appears to be 2 now. Ba and HBA running all over the place made so much space for Cisse to do what he does best. I think Cisse's suffering from Sissoko pushing too far up the pitch off the ball rather than our wide players. Sissoko doesn't create the space like the other 2 did as that's not his job from what I can see. That's not to say we're not getting him chances now, but they seem to be in different areas and where he's leading the line. Gouffran is doing the same job Ba did last season ( in regards to 4-3-3), some could argue more effectively because he's more suited to the role and has much more pace. Ben Arfa isn't there at the moment so its hard to compare but once he does i think you will see something similar to last season. Not to mention we have two attacking fullbacks now and both are beginning to show what they can offer as an attacking outlet to improve the team. ( ok Santon needs to improve defensively but offensively he's becoming effective) We have a lot of offensive ability when everyone is fit, the problem is that if Cisse or Ben Arfa get injured we don't have the necessary quality to replace them i hope that is something that can be improved in the summer. I don't think the system or style of play is a problem anymore though more so a lack of depth and talent in some positions. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shays Given Tim Flowers Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 That's what I don't understand. We expect more from Shola than he can give and we abuse him when he doesn't live up to it. Yet, Cisse under performs when we know he can play so much better but it is ignored and at worst, blamed on other less talented players. Its a point Ive made a couple of times myself. Not only Cisse - happened many times in the past many on here mock and sneer at Shola, but defend others not performing I can't understand it either. What is even more baffling is how those ranting at Shola rant all the louder when this is pointed out, as if you're "not supposed to mention this, just take it for granted that it's right" To be fair on Cisse, I just don't think the lucks with him this season though. No lack of effort, certainly Poor players get criticised for being poor, some fans are even intelligent enough to assess performance relative to the player. No. Certain players get scapegoated, a good example was when we beat QPR 1-0 and Shola produced, none of the others did. Within hours, he was getting mocked again while those who DIDN'T produce didn't get a bit of criticism. Most fans will just jump on the bandwagon By some fans sure. Doesn't contradict what I said at all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Pinkman Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 No way near an ITK but been informed by a fairly reliable source that Cisse is going to see the Newcastle doctor today regarding a virus and there is a chance he may not travel to Russia.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawK Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 Perhaps Tiesias, to me it appeared we got the best out of Cisse last season when we had a clear 3 up front rather than what appears to be 2 now. Ba and HBA running all over the place made so much space for Cisse to do what he does best. I think Cisse's suffering from Sissoko pushing too far up the pitch off the ball rather than our wide players. Sissoko doesn't create the space like the other 2 did as that's not his job from what I can see. That's not to say we're not getting him chances now, but they seem to be in different areas and where he's leading the line. Gouffran is doing the same job Ba did last season ( in regards to 4-3-3), some could argue more effectively because he's more suited to the role and has much more pace. Ben Arfa isn't there at the moment so its hard to compare but once he does i think you will see something similar to last season. Not to mention we have two attacking fullbacks now and both are beginning to show what they can offer as an attacking outlet to improve the team. ( ok Santon needs to improve defensively but offensively he's becoming effective) We have a lot of offensive ability when everyone is fit, the problem is that if Cisse or Ben Arfa get injured we don't have the necessary quality to replace them i hope that is something that can be improved in the summer. I don't think the system or style of play is a problem anymore though more so a lack of depth and talent in some positions. Yeah I agree, when we have HBA+Gouffran/Marveaux available I'm hoping we go back to doing what we used to do very well at the back end of last season. In the interim(lol) period we just seem to revert to something that really doesn't suit our attacking players and is very reminiscent of the hit+hope tactics we had for the first few games when we had Cisse+Ba together. Bit off the topic, but if Haidara gets the nod again tonight, then what's to stop Pardew considering Santon as an attacking midfielder on the right hand side for when HBA is out? I'd like to see him started further up the pitch now we seem to have some genuine quality in both full back positions for the first time since Pearce/Barton. Bale came from being a fullback remember Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 No way near an ITK but been informed by a fairly reliable source that Cisse is going to see the Newcastle doctor today regarding a virus and there is a chance he may not travel to Russia.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledGeordie Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 No way near an ITK but been informed by a fairly reliable source that Cisse is going to see the Newcastle doctor today regarding a virus and there is a chance he may not travel to Russia.. Just said on total sport he's doubtful Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 Bit off the topic, but if Haidara gets the nod again tonight, then what's to stop Pardew considering Santon as an attacking midfielder on the right hand side for when HBA is out? I'd like to see him started further up the pitch now we seem to have some genuine quality in both full back positions for the first time since Pearce/Barton. Bale came from being a fullback remember I have spoken about Santon as an attacking option before and my stance is this.... A lot of of his strengths is moving into open space which comes from not being picked up from deeper positions and if he played further forward a lot of those strengths would be taken away. Also as of right now his decision making in the final third is not really good enough for an attacker and i don't think he is physically or mentally there yet to be successful in such a role. I agree with picking Haidara btw but i would be tempted to use Santon on the right side instead of Simpson, for one we are on a plastic pitch so it will be important to keep the ball. Also while it will be important to be strong defensively, it will also be important to push Anzhi back when possible and i don't think Simpson is capable of that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeletor Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 No way near an ITK but been informed by a fairly reliable source that Cisse is going to see the Newcastle doctor today regarding a virus and there is a chance he may not travel to Russia.. http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h322/wwegirl16/NOOOOOOO.gif Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 No way near an ITK but been informed by a fairly reliable source that Cisse is going to see the Newcastle doctor today regarding a virus and there is a chance he may not travel to Russia.. Just said on total sport he's doubtful less reason not to play Gouffran this time round then. Well somebody was going to Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 No way near an ITK but been informed by a fairly reliable source that Cisse is going to see the Newcastle doctor today regarding a virus and there is a chance he may not travel to Russia.. Just said on total sport he's doubtful Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledGeordie Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 No way near an ITK but been informed by a fairly reliable source that Cisse is going to see the Newcastle doctor today regarding a virus and there is a chance he may not travel to Russia.. Just said on total sport he's doubtful Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 No way near an ITK but been informed by a fairly reliable source that Cisse is going to see the Newcastle doctor today regarding a virus and there is a chance he may not travel to Russia.. Gouffran up top then. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 If true, ideally we'd go: Obertan - Gouffran - Jonas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Venkman Posted March 6, 2013 Share Posted March 6, 2013 I find it odd that his track record of scoring goals for years doesn't really count any more, and that we're now unsure what constitutes the "real" Cisse. Very odd. Well, it's bullshit isn't it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted March 6, 2013 Share Posted March 6, 2013 I find it odd that his track record of scoring goals for years doesn't really count any more, and that we're now unsure what constitutes the "real" Cisse. Very odd. Well, it's bullshit isn't it. Yes it is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted March 6, 2013 Share Posted March 6, 2013 At the top level, he's scored into the teens/20's in 2 seasons. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted March 6, 2013 Share Posted March 6, 2013 He's basically a 1 in 2 player throughout his career, including international level. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Venkman Posted March 6, 2013 Share Posted March 6, 2013 At the top level, he's scored into the teens/20's in 2 seasons. ahh right yeah, he's not actually that good is he? thanks for clearing that up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Venkman Posted March 6, 2013 Share Posted March 6, 2013 He's basically a 1 in 2 player throughout his career, including international level. but this season is him showing his true level Ian. It's a lot like the Pardew argument this one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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