Hoof ball

[Mick]

no, QPR at home, Villa at home, wasn't hoof ball, we went long and short, it was disjoonted,misfiring or whatever, it wasn't hoof ball.

 

What do you class as hoof ball?

[madras]

no, QPR at home, Villa at home, wasn't hoof ball, we went long and short, it was disjoonted,misfiring or whatever, it wasn't hoof ball.

 

What do you class as hoof ball?

seems bloody obvious mate, getting it long whever you have the chance, we didn't do that in those games.

[The Prophet]

I've been going along these lines for a while, when we're under pressure or begin to panic we do resort to long ball a bit too much but on the whole we do mix it up, it isn't always good to watch but it isn't always long ball.

 

I think most would agree our best performance of the season was our comprehensive demolition of the Mancs, it was a high intensity, top quality performance but we were still very direct. I'm pretty sure Pardew's intentions are something within that scope, not totally reliant on pass and move nor on the long ball but quite simply to pressurise the opponent’s eighteen yard area as soon as we're in possession. I'm not certain whether that is his end game or if he is making do with what he has, but the similarities with his West Ham side certainly suggest it could well be the latter.

 

Taking this into account I do believe we will play our fair share of direct long balls during a football match, most sides do. However this doesn't excuse some of the football we've played at times this season. This has largely come when we've been under pressure and blame has to be attributed to Pardew. Plan B and sometimes even Plan A (see the post-Chelsea blip as an example) has consisted of us trying to contain the opposition. There's always a certain element of this in Pardew's game plan, it's been part of our success this season but on occasion it has become a double edged sword. We're so desperate to protect what we have the wingers come either too deep or too narrow, Cabaye our playmaker sits in his own half while at times Ba also drops far too deep, this leaves the keeper and the centre backs with no option but to lump it forward and hope a ridiculously isolated Ba/Cisse/Shola makes something of it. This obsession to contain also explains and extends to leaving our talented playmaker warming the bench in order to field someone who will protect the vulnerable Danny Simpson.

 

Pardew and a couple of our plays do need to learn possession is the greatest weapon a side can use to contain the opposition, not sitting deep, nor the easy long ball, both of which instantly hands the initiative back to the opposing team. As this suggest I haven't been totally elated by all of our football this season but I do believe criticism has been too sharp. We are a work in progress, we still carry deadwood (Williamson, Simpson, Perch, Taylor, Obertan) in and around the starting eleven and as a consequence we'll still be very hit and miss this season. I’m almost certain a bit more quality in defence and an additional year of experience for Pardew will see confidence grow and we'll improve again as a consistent footballing outfit next season.

[thomas]

hoofball fucking owns

[Flip]

no, QPR at home, Villa at home, wasn't hoof ball, we went long and short, it was disjoonted,misfiring or whatever, it wasn't hoof ball.

 

What do you class as hoof ball?

seems bloody obvious mate, getting it long whever you have the chance, we didn't do that in those games.

 

Disagree, we had no fucking plan, and the only thing we did was hoof the ball when 1-0 up against Villa and letting them get back into the game. QPR was an embarassment, to be so outplayed in the first 20mins was a joke.

[Mick]

seems bloody obvious mate, getting it long whever you have the chance, we didn't do that in those games.

 

I've just watched the first 5 minutes of the Villa game and we did it 6 times.

[madras]

seems bloody obvious mate, getting it long whever you have the chance, we didn't do that in those games.

 

I've just watched the first 5 minutes of the Villa game and we did it 6 times.

watch the rest

[Mick]

watch the rest

 

It's late and I don't fancy watching it tonight as I've just finished watching our mackem game from last season.

[madras]

watch the rest

 

It's late and I don't fancy watching it tonight as I've just finished watching our mackem game from last season.

got to admit i done that earlier on today. just the higlights mind, not the full game.

[Mick]

got to admit i done that earlier on today. just the higlights mind, not the full game.

 

I watched the full game.  I'm at 10 minutes in the Villa game and the ball has been launched 15 times, ironically on 10 minutes Williamson hoofs it after Krul threw the ball out to him. 

[madras]

got to admit i done that earlier on today. just the higlights mind, not the full game.

 

I watched the full game.  I'm at 10 minutes in the Villa game and the ball has been launched 15 times, ironically on 10 minutes Williamson hoofs it after Krul threw the ball out to him. 

stick with it, we do do the the old stgyle, "get them turned" but we honestly dont hoof it as is mad out of it (except last week)

[Mick]

stick with it, we do do the the old stgyle, "get them turned" but we honestly dont hoof it as is mad out of it (except last week)

 

The defence and Krul were the worst for launching the ball from what I've seen, Santon tried to play the ball every time he had it.

[madras]

stick with it, we do do the the old stgyle, "get them turned" but we honestly dont hoof it as is mad out of it (except last week)

 

The defence and Krul were the worst for launching the ball from what I've seen, Santon tried to play the ball every time he had it.

i've pointed out krul a few times enough already, what about when we win the ball at the back, lookm at that seriously we seldom lump it.

[Mick]

i've pointed out krul a few times enough already, what about when we win the ball at the back, lookm at that seriously we seldom lump it.

 

Far too often the ball goes back to Krul from a defender and he is the one who goes long the most and the one time he didn't the next person to play it did.

[madras]

i've pointed out krul a few times enough already, what about when we win the ball at the back, lookm at that seriously we seldom lump it.

 

Far too often the ball goes back to Krul from a defender and he is the one who goes long the most and the one time he didn't the next person to play it did.

far too ofetn for you ? i remember us doing that first 20 or so, them taking over. the second half wasnt exactly carpet football but it wasn't wimbledon yet  we had the better of it.

 

 

it's something to look at, when krul hets it it goes long but when we win the ball we are very good at bringing it out.

[Sifu]

Whilst it's become apparent that Pardew does like a direct approach from time to time (probably a bit too much these days it has to be said), I honestly don't think this is a tactic he really wants to utilise to a full extent (as in, I don't think that this is his sole gameplan).

 

Now, I am aware that there has been many cases this season where we have resorted to the whole "pass-back-to-Krul-for-him-to-launch-it" trick (and yes, it is very annoying) but there has also been some cases where we have mixed it around effectively (Man U at St. James' being the main example). We have seen glimpses of a "pass-and-play" tactic this season too, now what I'm thinking is that why would Pardew deploy such a tactic in games if his alleged gameplan/entire mentality was just hoofball? I've seen some posts in the past in various threads saying that Pardew was just like Allardyce which is a complete load of bollocks.

 

In the end, I'm pretty confident that Pardew can learn from his mistakes. His unemployment period (post-Southampton) did allow him to reassess his approach imo - considering he went to Germany for a bit and try and learn from the Bundesliga indicates to me that he is a man who is still "learning" as a manager.

[Shak]

We don't play a complete long ball style, I've seen people compare it to Allardyce football which I think is going way too far. I think the problem however is that we seem to be using more and more long ball as the season goes on. Pardew was full of talk at the start of the year about creating a pass and move style of football, but if anything we've gotten less fluid as the year has gone on. We seem to be regressing as a footballing side, which understandably has people frustrated.

 

I think that Williamson and Simpson are big problems, they're both hopeless with the ball at their feet. Would Pardew instruct Krul to play it short more if we had a back four like

 

Santon  Colo  Saylor  Enrique

 

for instance? I'm inclined to think he would, and I reckon he deserves time to show it next year with (hopefully) some better options than Williamson and Simpson in the team.

 

I'm not excusing him for our poor football of late though. There are still plenty of good players in the team, we should be able to play much better stuff than we did last week. Cabaye is being horribly utilised, and the wide men aren't taking up good positions at all. Quite often there isn't much else we can do other than hoof it long, simply because our movement off the ball is so poor. That's on Pardew.

[Spudil]

We play hoof ball man. A lot of it too. Obviously it works better with Best or Shola in the side, I could have told you that hoofing the ball to Ba and Cisse is stupid before we singed them, still waiting for Pardew to figure it out. Christ this man likes his hoofball you cant ignore it, he played Tevez left wing/not at all for West ham to keep his cloggers up front ffs!

 

http://www.espn.co.uk/football/sport/video_audio/61504.html?genre=6%3Bsport%3D3 12.45

[Spudil]

We don't play a complete long ball style, I've seen people compare it to Allardyce football which I think is going way too far. I think the problem however is that we seem to be using more and more long ball as the season goes on. Pardew was full of talk at the start of the year about creating a pass and move style of football, but if anything we've gotten less fluid as the year has gone on. We seem to be regressing as a footballing side, which understandably has people frustrated.

 

I think that Williamson and Simpson are big problems, they're both hopeless with the ball at their feet. Would Pardew instruct Krul to play it short more if we had a back four like

 

Santon  Colo  Saylor  Enrique

 

for instance? I'm inclined to think he would, and I reckon he deserves time to show it next year with (hopefully) some better options than Williamson and Simpson in the team.

 

I'm not excusing him for our poor football of late though. There are still plenty of good players in the team, we should be able to play much better stuff than we did last week. Cabaye is being horribly utilised, and the wide men aren't taking up good positions at all. Quite often there isn't much else we can do other than hoof it long, simply because our movement off the ball is so poor. That's on Pardew.

 

So would I man, but I just don't believe it and his history suggests otherwise. I'd be delighted to be proved wrong.

[Shak]

Aye, I'll have to wait and see.

 

I do think the amount of long ball increased significantly after Steven Taylor went down, which is part of the reason for my optimism in this regard.

 

But yeah, I'm not massively confident, just think he deserves a chance before we throw him under the bus for his lack of style.

[littlelunchbox]

Just wanted to play the role (which I like to think is my role in this place) of the boy who points out that the king is in the altogether, someone say something and for some reason everyone goes along with it....here goes (working backwards)

 

Wolves... far too much long ball

Spurs... not long ball, not anything really

Villa...no long ball, mish mash of play, some short some long.

Blackburn...didn't see it but under the kosh and hit on the break so possibly.

Brighton...no long ball really,may have been better doing that.

Fulham...dominted first half with tidy football, ba/cisse could have seen us out of sight, second half defensive collapse, not long ball.

QPR... best wide left, if naything overplayed stuff, not long ball.

Blackburn....a few changes but not long ball

Man utd... 2 goals came from long balls, overall the play wasn't, in fact looking back i'm amazed at how much we played the ball from the back after winning it off them (we do seem to have a problem starting off short from krul, though not necerssarily because of krul)

Liverpool....long ball.

 

do i need to go back further to dispel the myth ?

 

nice typical troll post from madras,  like it

[littlelunchbox]

Agree with Madras 100%, there is always some 'buzz word' when it comes to us tbh. This is why some players will leave us and miraculously come good (Parker, Milner etc..) despite being 'f***ing awful' when they are here.

 

Players/Managers/Playing styles will pick up these 'buzz words' and be branded as such until they leave. Even when they leave some will never accept they might actually be decent.

 

It's the same with foreign players who have some sort of romanticism about them despite not getting much of a chance which is the clubs/managers fault (Viana, Luque, Xisco etc..).

 

Oh and while I am on this box, keepers not being able to kick has been a bug bear for as long as I can remember, I can't actually remember a keeper who has been good in distributing the ball

 

I think you'll find most newcastle fans think Milner is still very average and happy we sold him still and Parker is vastly overrated by the media.

 

really? i remember many were gutted especially me when parker got sold,  he was our best player under souness but then again thats not saying too much judging by how shit the rest were playing under the twat.

 

under Rodent, parker was used as an attacking midfielder in a 4-4-2 while emre next to him was playing more like a holding midfielder, thats right, thats how incompetent Roeder was, he got that completely the other way round.

 

under fat sam, he simply gave up on the lad and said oh parker can't handle the pressure in front of this big crowd.

[alpal78]

no, QPR at home, Villa at home, wasn't hoof ball, we went long and short, it was disjoonted,misfiring or whatever, it wasn't hoof ball.

 

 

What do you class as hoof ball?

seems bloody obvious mate, getting it long whever you have the chance, we didn't do that in those games.

 

Think you have a problem of definition then. Hoofball doesn't mean that we always go long whenever we have the chance. Obviously in all games, there will be times that we pass the ball on the ground sideways or even backwards. When Colocini passes the ball to Tiote/Cabaye in midfield, it does not mean that we are not playing hoofball. What matters is how we get the ball to Ba and Cisse or whoever our strikers are.

 

Do we get the ball down and play pass and move to get the ball to them the way the likes of Man Utd, City, Arsenal, Spurs play or do we just launched one after perhaps trying a few times to pass the ball to Tiote/Cabaye and being unable to make anymore forward progress? That's the criteria to distinguish whether we are playing hoofball or passing football.

 

Even then in a game, there might be a few times when we actually get the ball to the strikers by passing on the ground but if those are the exceptions compared to the number of times that we launch the ball to them hoping that they can control the ball and do something out of it, then yes we are playing hoofball.

[Guest Dontooner]

no, QPR at home, Villa at home, wasn't hoof ball, we went long and short, it was disjoonted,misfiring or whatever, it wasn't hoof ball.

 

 

What do you class as hoof ball?

seems bloody obvious mate, getting it long whever you have the chance, we didn't do that in those games.

 

Think you have a problem of definition then. Hoofball doesn't mean that we always go long whenever we have the chance. Obviously in all games, there will be times that we pass the ball on the ground sideways or even backwards. When Colocini passes the ball to Tiote/Cabaye in midfield, it does not mean that we are not playing hoofball. What matters is how we get the ball to Ba and Cisse or whoever our strikers are.

 

Do we get the ball down and play pass and move to get the ball to them the way the likes of Man Utd, City, Arsenal, Spurs play or do we just launched one after perhaps trying a few times to pass the ball to Tiote/Cabaye and being unable to make anymore forward progress? That's the criteria to distinguish whether we are playing hoofball or passing football.

 

Even then in a game, there might be a few times when we actually get the ball to the strikers by passing on the ground but if those are the exceptions compared to the number of times that we launch the ball to them hoping that they can control the ball and do something out of it, then yes we are playing hoofball.

Finally, someone got it right Literately.

[Tiresias]

It seems a cascade of problems for me, I think recently our midfield (and Tiote didn't step up vs Wolves) hasn't closed down further up the pitch, and this means if we do get the ball back it's deep, and then there's a rush to get it back up the pitch, but we don't seem to excell at managing to pass it out to the wings to speed it up the pitch, instead we hoof.

 

Against Man U we did some hoofing which paniced their defence which couldn't handle Ba's movement. We also pressed like mad, it was this pressing that led to the free kick where cabaye scored. We were getting the ball back all over the pitch, not just in our defence, and I am disappointed by how static our midfield is. Against wolves they ran down the pitch at us and noone took responsibility to stopping it, in fact that Robben first goal against England gave me flashbacks. Don't just back off, someone stop the move, get the ball back up the pitch. If we get the ball in those areas we're not going to need to hoof it.