The College Dropout Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 I could go on all day about that side's simplistic greatness. Including having strikers that can win a header/hold up the ball. But moreover - that side was organised and worked very hard to a man. Real spirit. That's gone. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Taylor will make mistakes but he's physically decent and won't bend over for the opposition like we saw last night. Yeah he was brilliant in his last performance. I cannot wait until the guy returns so he run around consistently hurting the team, puffing his chest out, playing to the supporters, and suffering another "unfortunate injury". Who would you play at CB? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Both have played well in our shirt in the past - Taylor more often in the top flight for obvious reasons - but ultimately neither are good enough. Taylor's much better on the ball and offers some semblance of a threat at set pieces, Williamson is relatively dependable at the basics, decent at winning defensive headers and is more acutely aware of his limitations. Doesn't really matter tbh, we'll just be cycling through them all during the season because we're crap. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Segun Oluwaniyi Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 I could go on all day about that side's simplistic greatness. Including having strikers that can win a header/hold up the ball. But moreover - that side was organised and worked very hard to a man. Real spirit. That's gone. We had a very different aide with an entirely different style of play that managed to win something 8 out of 11, six matches in a row, and beat Chelsea (away) and Liverpool in that same season. Stop referencing things from this time like they actually have any correlation to now. The vast majority of those players are still here as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Segun Oluwaniyi Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Taylor will make mistakes but he's physically decent and won't bend over for the opposition like we saw last night. Yeah he was brilliant in his last performance. I cannot wait until the guy returns so he run around consistently hurting the team, puffing his chest out, playing to the supporters, and suffering another "unfortunate injury". Who would you play at CB? I think you are overestimating the deficiencies of the two players on one ridiculously poor performance. These two are still our best option. I wish we had a quality player to challenge them but there isn't one. As I said, Taylor was terrible in our first match and has been terrible many times before at a fairly consistent rate. I would change things if there are more performances of this nature or to accommodate Yanga-Mbiwa moving to right back if Debuchy returns to form, but I would rather not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 I think putting Mapou to RB in the short-term is the right thing to do. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davey_C_73 Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Just an observation......but I noticed that not a single player in our team ever passes the ball to Williamson, I think he received ONE pass in the second half yesterday. Our players prefer to pass back to Krul or hoof it up field, rather than pass to Williamson in space. I was at the Benfica game at St James last season when I noticed this for the first time - they purposely try to avoid passing to him! It makes you wonder what the other players think of him, they obviously don't rate him! To be fair he didn't do too bad when he came on yesterday, but it's obviously a waste of a position in the team if he can't contribute when we are in possession. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 I think putting Mapou to RB in the short-term is the right thing to do. Agreed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 I could go on all day about that side's simplistic greatness. Including having strikers that can win a header/hold up the ball. But moreover - that side was organised and worked very hard to a man. Real spirit. That's gone. We had a very different aide with an entirely different style of play that managed to win something 8 out of 11, six matches in a row, and beat Chelsea (away) and Liverpool in that same season. Stop referencing things from this time like they actually have any correlation to now. The vast majority of those players are still here as well. I hope this reply makes sense to someone. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 You could even make out a case for playing Mapou at left back. Why he hasn't attempted 3 at the back with a sweeper and wing backs I don't know. Santon and Debuchy seem ideal wing back types. Still I guess that involves the manager doing a bit of coaching . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiLvOR Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 I think putting Mapou to RB in the short-term is the right thing to do. Agreed. Whenever he plays fullback he looks far more comfortable to me, he's also decent at skinning people as we've seen* so it's worth a go. *Can't remember the game exactly, but he was left back and he managed to blitz down the wing a few times and offer some actual width. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 It would be overreacting to change the back four IMO. It's more than good enough for a top half, or even top 8/10, team. The problem is that the rest of the team is prone to looking a mess and not providing any protection at times. Personally I would stick with exactly the 4-3-3 that we've been using, we have played our best stuff using it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiLvOR Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 I think Debuchy needs a bit of a kick up the arse though, in a similar way to Simpson, he knows he's got no competition so doesn't have to worry too much. Agree though we need to play the 4-3-3, Ben Arfa back on the right where he's far more effective. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 The lack of protection wasn't the cause for 3 of our 4 defenders to have absolute shockers on Monday they all had bad gaes. Individually and as the unit our defenders/defence has been a mess for over a year now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 It would be overreacting to change the back four IMO. It's more than good enough for a top half, or even top 8/10, team. The problem is that the rest of the team is prone to looking a mess and not providing any protection at times. Personally I would stick with exactly the 4-3-3 that we've been using, we have played our best stuff using it. Nah. Poor marking and neglectful defending is what cost us Monday and poor marking against Hull too. Even the Benteke goal was poor marking. There is no discipline in the starting back 4 at all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrettNUFC Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 Yeah but the gap between Tiote/Anita and the CB pairing was criminal at times on Monday, Barkley had all the space he wanted between the two, it was so easy for Everton, ended up 2 on 2 time and time again, no protection from the midfield, well certainly not enough anyways. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallowgate Toon Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 It's more than just individual mistakes, pretty much every time we've conceded this season, there have been errors by about 4 players. Even with Taylor back in, we can't let our centre backs become so exposed again, we don't have anyone good enough to play like that. Pardew needs to get back to basics with this defence and get them solid. Neville had it spot on, we should be looking to build ourselves into matches, start off as a compact unit and then grow into the game. I think that's how it needs to be for the next couple of months, then we can look at being more expansive from the off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotus Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 I don't like all this 'MYM is a coward' crap. He's made some bad decisions no doubt but they were highlighting Vidic the other week as he ran away from the player with the ball who was closing in on goal. Wouldn't call Vidic a coward, was just a bad decision. MYM made a couple of them as well. Hopefully he'll improve. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 Mapou did it 3 times though... not saying he is a coward.... but he does look like a coward sometimes Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TheGreatBeardo Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 You could even make out a case for playing Mapou at left back. Why he hasn't attempted 3 at the back with a sweeper and wing backs I don't know. Santon and Debuchy seem ideal wing back types. Still I guess that involves the manager doing a bit of coaching . That is the ideal formation for what we have. But it requires a very decent coach to implement as a lot of tactical nous and discipline is needed. Mbiwa/Taylor ball winners, Colo sweeping up. Lush If Saton and Debuchy are going to play as wingbacks they would need to be able to hit a decent cross, and I haven't seen much sign of that. Santon likes to come inside all the time on to his right foot, which is fine, but he would need to be more inclined to get to the byline and cross it as a wingback, because in that system it would be down to him to provide the width. Debuchy seems better suited to the job, but he doesn't seem to be the best crosser of a ball either. As for the 3 at the back, Colo is more than capable, he might even prefer it, and Mapou is probably also pretty familiar with it, but I doubt that Williamson or Taylor would have a clue what was going on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 You could even make out a case for playing Mapou at left back. Why he hasn't attempted 3 at the back with a sweeper and wing backs I don't know. Santon and Debuchy seem ideal wing back types. Still I guess that involves the manager doing a bit of coaching . That is the ideal formation for what we have. But it requires a very decent coach to implement as a lot of tactical nous and discipline is needed. Mbiwa/Taylor ball winners, Colo sweeping up. Lush Exactly how I see it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 Debuchy and Santon getting more attacking responsibility doesn't exactly fill me with optimism. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Away Toon Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 The 352 or 532 as it often becomes if you end up defending too deep, looks good on paper, but unless you have a fantastic coach and the right players to do it, tends not to work. Martinez did it at Wigan but I don't think he has tried it at Everton yet, Rodgers has done it a couple of times at Liverpool this season but mainly because of injuries. MYM and Colo could certainly play in it, but we don't have a third defender who could comfortably unless Debuchy could. Because Santon cuts in all the time I don't see how he could be effective as a left wingback as someone pointed out already. I'm pretty sure it's all a mute point with Pardew in place anyhow, its far too exotic, foreign and complicated for him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilko Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 Like fuck would I trust Pardew to implement a successful 3-5-2 style formation. I still have nightmares about Shearer doing it away at Stoke, deploying David Edgar as a sort of half-sweeper for christs sake. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 With Coloccini riding a bike on the sidelines. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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