The Managerial Merry Go Round™ - Ivan Juric to Southampton

[Stal]

8 hours ago, Ben said:

Has a caretaker manager that gets the full time gig after a few good results ever worked out ? 

 

What about that Sbrakia guy at the mackems? Didn't he do well-ish?

 

Roeder did canny for both us and West Ham, although he wasn't well at the end of his reign there iirc.

[Dokko]

9 minutes ago, gdm said:

Is he? 2 wins in 18 games? Imagine when we had a similar run under Bruce and we were told he was doing ok? 

 

4 wins in 18. Win the game in hand and they are 5pts clear midway through the season. What do Leeds expect after selling their 2 best players (who went to 2 of the biggest clubs in the world) and bringing in lots of young foreign lads who need to adapt to the league. He's still carving out his way as well. Huge transformation job from their last manager. He's done OK. 

 

Only real issue I have with him is he looks like Jeremy Kyle. 

 

 

 

Edited January 17, 2023 by Dokko

[Cf]

1 minute ago, Dokko said:

 

4 wins in 18. Win the game in hand and they are 5pts clear midway through the season. What do Leeds expect after selling their 2 best players (who went to 2 of the biggest clubs in the world) and bringing in lots of young foreign lads who need to adapt to the league. He's still carving out his way as well. Huge transformation job from their last manager. He's done OK. 

 

 

 

In terms of expected points (yeah I know, but I find it's a useful data point) Leeds are currently on the bad side of variance a little bit at the mo too. I'd be inclined to give a little bit more leeway when that's the case.

[joeyt]

8 hours ago, Ben said:

Has a caretaker manager that gets the full time gig after a few good results ever worked out ? 

 

Chris Hughton?

[Dokko]

Just now, Cf said:

 

In terms of expected points (yeah I know, but I find it's a useful data point) Leeds are currently on the bad side of variance a little bit at the mo too. I'd be inclined to give a little bit more leeway when that's the case.

 

Yup. It's OK. Which is all I said. They've brought a new manager to the league after such a character before him. He's just started his rebuild job and was never going to challenge the top end of the table. They've given him a lot of his players, it seemed crazy to turf him out now. This is how teams sink. Going from one manager to another supporting their way with players but not giving them the time to see it out. Nest guy comes in and he needs another 5 players and the squad is a frankenstien mess always playing catch up. 

 

Give him the rest of the season, seems sensible. I don't think they are playing badly either. They should probably have a few more points on the board and if so their position would look a lot better. 

 

 

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Tomato Deuce said:

Managers should be subject to the transfer window, too.

 

I've thought this a while like. Sacking a manager should still be fine but should only be able to replace them with someone internally until the next window, or a manager who wasn't in a job at the end of the last 'manager window'.

[loki679]

The only way transfer windows are even vaguely enforceable is because the players have to be registered as players for the club.  Is it the same situation for managers?

[gdm]

1 hour ago, Dokko said:

 

4 wins in 18. Win the game in hand and they are 5pts clear midway through the season. What do Leeds expect after selling their 2 best players (who went to 2 of the biggest clubs in the world) and bringing in lots of young foreign lads who need to adapt to the league. He's still carving out his way as well. Huge transformation job from their last manager. He's done OK. 

 

Only real issue I have with him is he looks like Jeremy Kyle. 

 

 

 

 

It’s 2 wins in the last 17 including cup games. Point is pretty much everyone on here detested people looking in on the outside and suggesting Steve Bruce did a good job. Many Leeds fans aren’t happy with the job he’s doing 

[Dokko]

Just now, gdm said:

It’s 2 wins in the last 17 including cup games. Point is pretty much everyone on here detested people looking in on the outside and suggesting Steve Bruce did a good job. Many Leeds fans aren’t happy with the job he’s doing 

 

No one gets sacked for losing cup games unless it's a club expected to win silverware. So it's 4 in 18 as it will be league position & points which will determine his fate.

 

Steve Bruce and his time here is not a yardstick on any manager or how a club operates. It's an anomaly. We were dead and buried, showing no ambition at any level and we were watching the death of a club. Only the Everton situation compares, even then there is still some hope as lampard is a decent bloke and the owners do find money for signings. We had neither. We had someone who totally took the piss out of the fans and dared pretend to be one when it suited him.

 

Fair play if you want to compare Leeds' situation right now to Bruce's time here. I can't get on board with that. Leeds' fans, especially since their return and 1 good season seem to think they should be up there again battling manu etc... The reality is, they are where they belong, making up the numbers and trying to build something sustainable. JM has a chance to do that, giving a bit of time and a couple of signings per window. 

 

 

[Dokko]

Mind I do get your general point about doubting other fans opinions on managers, players and owners. I just don't but it on this one. 

[gdm]

I’m not comparing Bruce’s time to Marsch’s I’m saying I’ll let the Leeds fan decide if he’s doing ok. A good mate of mine is a Leeds fan and I listen to their main podcast when they lose (mainly to wind him up by laughing at it) and they weren’t impressed with him only keeping them up by skin of their teeth and they aren’t happy with results and what they are watching week in week out and we were told the season Bruce took over and finished midtable that he was doing a great job, better than Rafa etc etc but watching it week in week out the signs were there that it was a car crash

 

 

Edited January 17, 2023 by gdm

[Jagten]

2 hours ago, gdm said:

Is he? 2 wins in 18 games? Imagine when we had a similar run under Bruce and we were told he was doing ok? 

Underlying numbers are actually OK (e.g. biggest underperformance here https://understat.com/league/EPL, but can't comment on their model). Thought Leeds fans were split on him, unlike our boy Brucey? 

[Collage]

3 hours ago, Dokko said:

 

Crazy. He's doing OK. 

Jesse ”go out there and be the best version of yourself” Marsch? Many Leeds fans seem to hate him and it’s perfectly understandable. Imagine going from Bielsa to that.

 

 

Edited January 17, 2023 by Collage

[gdm]

4 minutes ago, Jagten said:

Underlying numbers are actually OK (e.g. biggest underperformance here https://understat.com/league/EPL, but can't comment on their model). Thought Leeds fans were split on him, unlike our boy Brucey? 

They wanted him out then he won two games now they want him out again judging only by what I see and hear obviously 

[The College Dropout]

There’s weird anti-Americanism with Marsch imo. 

[STM]

Marsch seems to be one of those coaches who relies entirely on talking a good game and motivating his players.

 

I'm not sure there's much more to him than that.

 

I'm about 80% certain it will end in Leeds getting relegated or Leeds sacking him before they go down. Not necessarily this year mind.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

There’s weird anti-Americanism with Marsch imo. 

 

If a PFM had 8 wins in 30 games into a new job, he'd get a bit stick? 

[The College Dropout]

51 minutes ago, Optimistic Nut said:

 

If a PFM had 8 wins in 30 games into a new job, he'd get a bit stick? 

I don't think the results have been good enough either. But some of the flack is unwarranted.

 

I think their performances have been better than the results this season. They are competitive. They don't look far from a midtable team.

[cubaricho]

3 hours ago, The Bonk said:

Marsch talks a big game and I don’t mind him, but Leeds have underperformed during his tenure. 

 

I think the results have seemed like under performing, but the squad has been playing out of their skin.

 

TCD is right. It's completely an anti-American thing. Gets that Ted Lasso label bullshit.

[Kid Icarus]

I'm sure you think you're being level-headed there, but it's only because you can't see the chips on both your shoulders.

 

They've won 2 in 16, anyone would get the spotlight on them for that. Their overall record is almost identical to Leicester's. Rodgers, an FA Cup winner and Premier League runner up has had much more jip than Marsch.

 

 

Edited January 17, 2023 by Kid Icarus

[FinnMag]

Conte`s latest  rant  

 

Quote

 

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/64308907

 

"In England I think there's a bad habit that it's only the coach [who] talks and explains," said Conte.

"I've never seen the medical department coming here to explain. I've never seen the club or the sporting director coming here to explain the strategy or vision of the club

 

.

 

 

 

[The College Dropout]

15 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said:

I'm sure you think you're being level-headed there, but it's only because you can't see the chips on both your shoulders.

 

They've won 2 in 16, anyone would get the spotlight on them for that. Their overall record is almost identical to Leicester's. Rodgers, an FA Cup winner and Premier League runner up has had much more jip than Marsch.

 

 

 

I have no affinity to Marsch or the USA. I've said it, they've underperformed points wise. 17 points from 18. How many points should Leeds get after 38 games? IMO 40-46. That's an underperformance for sure but not massively. When i've watched them, they've been competitive and a bit unlucky. The players look motivated to me. They don't look far from becoming a decent team. I don't think they're on for relegation and Marsch *might* be onto whatever it is they brought him in to do.

 

Yes a team that has won trophies in the last decade should have higher expectations than Leeds United. That much would seem obvious.

 

Conte's right too. In England upper management and other people hide behind the manager. No accountability. We had years of minimal soundbites from what's his name at Forest

 

[Deuce]

Leeds haven’t been great under Marsch this season, but I agree with Dokko and TCD. They’ve spent a good bit of money getting him the players to fit what he’s trying to build…let him try to build it. They’re scoring at a decent clip, just shipping a few too many also. Maybe he’ll come good, maybe not. Lot of season left, but they haven’t looked like one of the 3 (or even 5) worst teams so far.

[midds]

At no point this season have I ever thought 'Leeds are going down'. Granted that's not to say they should be higher but it's not bad enough to justify sacking him imo. Obviously Leeds fans know and watch their team a lot more than I do and if they're united in wanting him out then it'll probably happen, I just see the point in getting a new guy in, backing him financially, letting him start to build a squad then binning him before it's had a genuine chance to take hold and grow. It just seems a very skittish and panicky move from a petrified boardroom. 

[woody]

2 hours ago, midds said:

At no point this season have I ever thought 'Leeds are going down'. Granted that's not to say they should be higher but it's not bad enough to justify sacking him imo. Obviously Leeds fans know and watch their team a lot more than I do and if they're united in wanting him out then it'll probably happen, I just see the point in getting a new guy in, backing him financially, letting him start to build a squad then binning him before it's had a genuine chance to take hold and grow. It just seems a very skittish and panicky move from a petrified boardroom. 

I think it might also be due to their boardroom composition. Was reading that the San Francisco 49ers investment group have an option to buy and have dithered on it while Leeds are bleeding cash and fear going down.