Hatem Ben Arfa (still a free agent)

[r0cafella]

Before the abuse comes I'm not a Pardew fan, far from it, but have any of you actually wondered if maybe Marveaux and Ben Arfa just have an incredibly poor attitude and so haven't earned a first team place based on reputation and ability alone?

 

There was a time when Pardew visibly cherished Ben Arfa, there must have been a reason that went pear shaped? I know it's easier to blame Pardew for being a c*** and a poor tactician, but maybe Marv and Benny are just too laid back and not showing enough effort.

 

Like I said, Pardew is a c***, I'm not doubting that, but these guys need to take some of the blame. Marv seems injury prone and downright lazy on the pitch, Ben Arfa is in poor shape physically. It's an idealistic point of view to expect the other 9 or 10 players to carry the flair players, however much we want to see them on the pitch.

 

On a lesser scale talent wise but a grander scale c*** wise, look at Nile Ranger, he was a cult hero here at first, we wanted him to get game time but he barely did. As time went on it became apparent that he was just a bell end with a horrible attitude.

 

You need to maintain a happy squad, not just one or two happy flair players. I'm not condoning anything Pardew does but we don't know the full story.

They maybe however unlike ranger they have actually produced goals and assists when on the pitch which alone should warrant them a chance

[Darth Crooks]

Completely negated by pandering to players who went on strike like Ba and Cabaye; their poor attitudes didnt seem to matter yet these two do?

[SEMTEX]

nile ranger was a shit bell end with a horrible attitude

let's say ben arfa is a bell end with a horrible attitude

 

if we were in a situation where our stunning team spirit made us a better team when he wasn't a part of it, that'd be fine, but we're not. he's our best player, and we're fucking awful, and we look significantly better when he plays.

 

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Completely negated by pandering to players who went on strike like Ba and Cabaye; their poor attitudes didnt seem to matter yet these two do?

Fair point, but maybe these two knuckled down in training. They certainly delivered on the pitch too and who can actually blame them for wanting out? They probably signed on the premise of playing attacking football and challenging at least on some fronts.

[junkhead]

Please name ONE Newcastle player that has improved under the guidance of Alan Pardew. Then try to defend his man management.

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nile ranger was a shit bell end with a horrible attitude

let's say ben arfa is a bell end with a horrible attitude

 

if we were in a situation where our stunning team spirit made us a better team when he wasn't a part of it, that'd be fine, but we're not. he's our best player, and we're fucking awful, and we look significantly better when he plays.

Again, behind the scenes Ben Arfa could have a dreadful attitude to training etc. He clearly doesn't look after himself as a professional football player does, and what example does that give to the players being left out to accommodate him?

 

Of course he's our most talented player, by an embarrassingly long way, but talent alone shouldn't get him in the team.

[SEMTEX]

When you're as shit as we are, talent alone is just fine.

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Please name ONE Newcastle player that has improved under the guidance of Alan Pardew. Then try to defend his man management.

If you'd read my post properly you'd have seen I haven't defended his anything.

[loki679]

Please name ONE Newcastle player that has improved under the guidance of Alan Pardew. Then try to defend his man management.

 

James Perch.  Um, Blob Jelliot likes him.

[Unbelievable]

Please name ONE Newcastle player that has improved under the guidance of Alan Pardew. Then try to defend his man management.

 

I'm not inclined in any way to do the latter, but several of our cheap squad players have improved in Pardew's time; the likes of Perch and Williamson. That probably tells you everthing you need to know about Pardew's level as a manager.

[Tiotes Witch Doctor]

"Imagine a player coming into training putting in half arsed effort, looking fat, short of breath and generally unfit and getting a game ahead of you? What sort of message does that send out to other seniors and especially younger squad members?

 

That would show the club as having no discipline, the manager as letting players walk over him and the give the impression to the rest of the first team squad that hard work & development is not important.

 

100% correct decision not to play him until he sorts his act out. He's a tremendous player and one of my favourites, but it's not worth compromising the club for one player who seemingly, can't be arsed."

 

 

"Starting any player in a game who potentially can't last 90 minutes due to fitness is a liability.

 

That coupled with the fact that senior players feel it is unfair that someone who doesn't work, train and eat to the same level of them should receive the same benefits, makes it a no brainer to leave him on the bench until he takes his head out his arse and applies himself in a manner which warrants his wages and teammates

commitment."

 

Hmmmm

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When you're as shit as we are, talent alone is just fine.

 

As fans, of course we want to see the likes of Ben Arfa, aside from Pedro I can't think of a more naturally gifted player we've had. Certainly in my lifetime.

 

I'm not condoning leaving him out, nor do I want him to be a 'defensive winger', I just think maybe there are certain things we don't know behind the scenes that's all.

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"Imagine a player coming into training putting in half arsed effort, looking fat, short of breath and generally unfit and getting a game ahead of you? What sort of message does that send out to other seniors and especially younger squad members?

 

That would show the club as having no discipline, the manager as letting players walk over him and the give the impression to the rest of the first team squad that hard work & development is not important.

 

100% correct decision not to play him until he sorts his act out. He's a tremendous player and one of my favourites, but it's not worth compromising the club for one player who seemingly, can't be arsed."

 

 

"Starting any player in a game who potentially can't last 90 minutes due to fitness is a liability.

 

That coupled with the fact that senior players feel it is unfair that someone who doesn't work, train and eat to the same level of them should receive the same benefits, makes it a no brainer to leave him on the bench until he takes his head out his arse and applies himself in a manner which warrants his wages and teammates

commitment."

 

Hmmmm

 

Where's this quote from?

[Darth Crooks]

Strikes me as in the same way Souness was an egotist; someone who spends a large degree of time establishing who's boss and after that point has very limited ideas. Ben Arfa has aspects of his personality that are less than desirable to be sure, but Pardew spites his own face just to look in charge. I find it highly unlikely that his attitude is so bad that he can't find a way back; that just strkies me as stubborness to admit he needs someone like him.

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Strikes me as in the same way Souness was an egotist; someone who spends a large degree of time establishing who's boss and after that point has very limited ideas. Ben Arfa has aspects of his personality that are less than desirable to be sure, but Pardew spites his own face just to look in charge. I find it highly unlikely that his attitude is so bad that he can't find a way back; that just strkies me as stubborness to admit he needs someone like him.

 

I'm inclined to agree with this. Pardew does seem the type to hold a grudge, being that he is, as I said earlier and have said numerous times in the past, a cunt.

 

However, back to the Ben Arfa issue - regardless of Pardew's cuntness and stubborness, Ben Arfa must have done something wrong in the first place to be left out at any point, thus being the one to blame in the first instance.

 

Imagine Steven Taylor showing up looking overweight and not seeming to give a shit but still getting games, we'd be calling for him to be dropped straight away (well, in actual fact, he could be the fittest mother fucker in the universe but I'd still have him nowhere near the first team but I'm trying to make a point...). Ben Arfa is supremely talented so we see his situation as harder to accept than if he was a Gosling, Taylor, Perch, Williamson character.

[Guest Haris Vuckic]

I don't think Ben Arfa's weight is as significant as it's made out to be. Even a fat Ben Arfa with a subway in his hand could put a lot of Premier League defenders on their arses.

 

I'm thinking Ben Arfa chinned him - as was rumoured

[Shays Given Tim Flowers]

nile ranger was a s*** bell end with a horrible attitude

let's say ben arfa is a bell end with a horrible attitude

 

if we were in a situation where our stunning team spirit made us a better team when he wasn't a part of it, that'd be fine, but we're not. he's our best player, and we're f***ing awful, and we look significantly better when he plays.

Again, behind the scenes Ben Arfa could have a dreadful attitude to training etc. He clearly doesn't look after himself as a professional football player does, and what example does that give to the players being left out to accommodate him?

 

Of course he's our most talented player, by an embarrassingly long way, but talent alone shouldn't get him in the team.

 

The fact is both Marveaux and Ben Arfa are capable of offering something to the team. For them to be marginalised in this way has to come back to the manager.

 

A manager's primary concern must be getting the greatest number of points from the games available. It is hard to justify his actions in the light of this.

[TRon]

Please name ONE Newcastle player that has improved under the guidance of Alan Pardew. Then try to defend his man management.

 

I'm not inclined in any way to do the latter, but several of our cheap squad players have improved in Pardew's time; the likes of Perch and Williamson. That probably tells you everthing you need to know about Pardew's level as a manager.

 

That's a myth, neither of those players improved, they were ok players at that level at the time as well. I remember when everyone was slagging Perch I maintained that he had some good attributes and just because he became flavour of the month a while later doesn't mean Pardew had suddenly produced it.

 

as for what ads says, I accept that Marveaux and Ben Arfa might not be ideal squad members, but then Pardew has produced terrible performances with players he favours. S what's the point in sidelining those two when they could provide something the water carriers can't?

 

 

[ads]

nile ranger was a s*** bell end with a horrible attitude

let's say ben arfa is a bell end with a horrible attitude

 

if we were in a situation where our stunning team spirit made us a better team when he wasn't a part of it, that'd be fine, but we're not. he's our best player, and we're f***ing awful, and we look significantly better when he plays.

Again, behind the scenes Ben Arfa could have a dreadful attitude to training etc. He clearly doesn't look after himself as a professional football player does, and what example does that give to the players being left out to accommodate him?

 

Of course he's our most talented player, by an embarrassingly long way, but talent alone shouldn't get him in the team.

 

The fact is both Marveaux and Ben Arfa are capable of offering something to the team. For them to be marginalised in this way has to come back to the manager.

 

A manager's primary concern must be getting the greatest number of points from the games available. It is hard to justify his actions in the light of this.

 

Again, I'm not trying to justify Pardew's actions in any shape or form. I just wanted, for my own fucking sanity, to look at it a different way.

 

None of us are football managers, it surely isn't as easy as picking your best XI on paper. 

[Shays Given Tim Flowers]

I don't know. Kinda seems like it is.

[Hanshithispantz]

Before the abuse comes I'm not a Pardew fan, far from it, but have any of you actually wondered if maybe Marveaux and Ben Arfa just have an incredibly poor attitude and so haven't earned a first team place based on reputation and ability alone?

Yep thought about it, and then considered the contrary evidence that shows Pardew to be a complete and utter mug and have come to the conclusion that it's his fault. He's a shit manager and a vindictive arsehole and he's managed them both horrifically.

 

I've gave my reasons before for why he's mismanaged them both, as have others.

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Before the abuse comes I'm not a Pardew fan, far from it, but have any of you actually wondered if maybe Marveaux and Ben Arfa just have an incredibly poor attitude and so haven't earned a first team place based on reputation and ability alone?

Yep thought about it, and then considered the contrary evidence that shows Pardew to be a complete and utter mug and have come to the conclusion that it's his fault. He's a shit manager and a vindictive arsehole and he's managed them both horrifically.

 

I've gave my reasons before for why he's mismanaged them both, as have others.

 

My point is, or at least should have been, that maybe it's just a combination of the two at a really unfortunate time?

 

Pardew being a stubborn cunt and Ben Arfa and Marv not applying themselves correctly. Under a different manager there'd be a different outcome, and maybe if they applied themselves properly for the club and the shirt from day 1 and every day since then, a different outcome again?

[aussiemag]

70% Pardews fault, 30% HBA. He has to take some blame for his poor attitude.

[KaKa]

This guy is available for £3m. I think he could make another manager look really smart.

 

Harry Redknapp will be all over this soon enough I imagine.

[KaKa]

Just seen him linked with West Ham 

 

I would be enraged if he went there and made Fat Sam look good.

 

Argh!