Dave Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 Forum narrative = 18 pages of discussion about the merits of such an approach. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 As this has replaced the Ashley thread it seems most appropriate to post this here. This is just my take on things and the way in which we as fans need to stick together with a fundamental point that everyone acknowledges, but falls by the wayside when we're all once again bumping the Rafa, Joselu, Dummett etc threads - All of this, every single bit of this, is Mike Ashley's fault. That's so obvious a statement that it should be seen as patronising, but time and time again people will talk about the tactics, the signings, the team selection, the players, and now Rafa, all being partially blamed under the proviso of 'yes it's Ashley's fault but Rafa, the players etc should be doing more.' - to me that's total bollocks, you either accept that the squad is nowhere near good enough - which is down to Ashley - or you think the players are good enough and the blame lies with Rafa. I can't see how you can possibly have it both ways. His hands are tied, but he’s doing the same with the players in many ways so what you are saying be may spot on in parts but it’s utter defeatism to lay all this on Ashley. You are in charge of your own destiny etc. Sitting back Surrendering possession No urgency Poor use of subs Lack of movement and passing Aimless long balls AT HOME TO BRIGHTON! All down to Ashley... Shut up your an idiot, losing at home only 1-0 to City was a masterclass. Follow the forum narrative or STFU Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 As this has replaced the Ashley thread it seems most appropriate to post this here. This is just my take on things and the way in which we as fans need to stick together with a fundamental point that everyone acknowledges, but falls by the wayside when we're all once again bumping the Rafa, Joselu, Dummett etc threads - All of this, every single bit of this, is Mike Ashley's fault. That's so obvious a statement that it should be seen as patronising, but time and time again people will talk about the tactics, the signings, the team selection, the players, and now Rafa, all being partially blamed under the proviso of 'yes it's Ashley's fault but Rafa, the players etc should be doing more.' - to me that's total bollocks, you either accept that the squad is nowhere near good enough - which is down to Ashley - or you think the players are good enough and the blame lies with Rafa. I can't see how you can possibly have it both ways. His hands are tied, but he’s doing the same with the players in many ways so what you are saying be may spot on in parts but it’s utter defeatism to lay all this on Ashley. You are in charge of your own destiny etc. Sitting back Surrendering possession No urgency Poor use of subs Lack of movement and passing Aimless long balls AT HOME TO BRIGHTON! All down to Ashley... I would argue that those highlighted above are more down to the players than Rafa, though. Subs, and tactics (sit deep, slow down tempo) yes, but surely he doesn't tell them to keep giving possession away, or misplace passes, or just keep hoofing it? Our game plan is to let the opposition have the ball and to stay in the game in the hope of nicking it late on. Our whole tactics and game plan just doesn’t help our team when it comes to possession. Our possession stats this season have been terrible, I doubt we’ve had higher possession than any of our opponents. It stifles players, forces them into back tracking almost in the way when a fast winger is running at you, better to drop back rather than get tighter... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomas Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 *makes criticism of rafa* *receives the slightest of pushback* Oh wow I guess I can't criticize him. HEY EVERYBODY! LOOKS LIKE YOU CAN'T SAY ANYTHING BAD ABOUT RAFA ANYMORE!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomas Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 p.s. this fucking takeover has to fucking happen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twinport53 Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 As this has replaced the Ashley thread it seems most appropriate to post this here. This is just my take on things and the way in which we as fans need to stick together with a fundamental point that everyone acknowledges, but falls by the wayside when we're all once again bumping the Rafa, Joselu, Dummett etc threads - All of this, every single bit of this, is Mike Ashley's fault. That's so obvious a statement that it should be seen as patronising, but time and time again people will talk about the tactics, the signings, the team selection, the players, and now Rafa, all being partially blamed under the proviso of 'yes it's Ashley's fault but Rafa, the players etc should be doing more.' - to me that's total bollocks, you either accept that the squad is nowhere near good enough - which is down to Ashley - or you think the players are good enough and the blame lies with Rafa. I can't see how you can possibly have it both ways. His hands are tied, but he’s doing the same with the players in many ways so what you are saying be may spot on in parts but it’s utter defeatism to lay all this on Ashley. You are in charge of your own destiny etc. Sitting back Surrendering possession No urgency Poor use of subs Lack of movement and passing Aimless long balls AT HOME TO BRIGHTON! All down to Ashley... Shut up your an idiot, losing at home only 1-0 to City was a masterclass. Follow the forum narrative or STFU Would you rather we threw caution to the wind, got spanked 6-1 off City and 0-1 off Brighton. Atleast we had a go with our championship squad though Because attacking merit moves you up the table. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
xLiaaamx Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 Its not about being expansive. They wanted a 0-0 today, they were happy with it. We needed to win and needed to press them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 As this has replaced the Ashley thread it seems most appropriate to post this here. This is just my take on things and the way in which we as fans need to stick together with a fundamental point that everyone acknowledges, but falls by the wayside when we're all once again bumping the Rafa, Joselu, Dummett etc threads - All of this, every single bit of this, is Mike Ashley's fault. That's so obvious a statement that it should be seen as patronising, but time and time again people will talk about the tactics, the signings, the team selection, the players, and now Rafa, all being partially blamed under the proviso of 'yes it's Ashley's fault but Rafa, the players etc should be doing more.' - to me that's total bollocks, you either accept that the squad is nowhere near good enough - which is down to Ashley - or you think the players are good enough and the blame lies with Rafa. I can't see how you can possibly have it both ways. His hands are tied, but he’s doing the same with the players in many ways so what you are saying be may spot on it parts but it’s utter defeatism to lay all this on Ashley. You are in charge of your own destiny etc. Sitting back Surrendering possession No urgency Poor use of subs Lack of movement and passing Aimless long balls All down to Ashley... I'll give you the subs, the rest is because the players aren't good enough and we have to (in Rafa's opinion) play in a certain way to give ourselves a chance. This is a Championship squad, playing more expansive football by default with these players is complete suicide as far as I'm concerned. And again, having to play that way is down to Ashley, so although you were being facetious with that point, I actually agree that it is his fault. We play in a certain way, the manager’s way, and it’s sending us down. How about a bit of ball retention, some urgency, some fluency and some threat? At home at least, and against Brighton. But no... I understand full well this team isn’t good enough, but it’s better than this or could be, at least when it comes to stringing some passes together, pushing out, threatening up front and playing with urgency. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
xLiaaamx Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 Also, do we fuck need to respect Brighton that much. Its because of this respect that they are better than us. Why they should have won the title last year. They wanted to win games while we sat off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twinport53 Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 Its not about being expansive. They wanted a 0-0 today, they were happy with it. We needed to win and needed to press them. We are a compact counter attacking team though. We could rarely break a resolute championship team down, let alone PL teams who sit back. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
geordie_b Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 Forum narrative = 18 pages of discussion about the merits of such an approach. It wasn't a discussion the other night, negative/alternative opinions weren't allowed or were ridiculed. I'm just trying to promote some balance here. He his working with his hands tied (like last year) but (like last year) he isn't making things easy for himself. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 Forum narrative = 18 pages of discussion about the merits of such an approach. It wasn't a discussion the other night, negative/alternative opinions weren't allowed or were ridiculed. I'm just trying to promote some balance here. He his working with his hands tied (like last year) but (like last year) he isn't making things easy for himself. 18 pages weren't allowed? How's that work? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 As this has replaced the Ashley thread it seems most appropriate to post this here. This is just my take on things and the way in which we as fans need to stick together with a fundamental point that everyone acknowledges, but falls by the wayside when we're all once again bumping the Rafa, Joselu, Dummett etc threads - All of this, every single bit of this, is Mike Ashley's fault. That's so obvious a statement that it should be seen as patronising, but time and time again people will talk about the tactics, the signings, the team selection, the players, and now Rafa, all being partially blamed under the proviso of 'yes it's Ashley's fault but Rafa, the players etc should be doing more.' - to me that's total bollocks, you either accept that the squad is nowhere near good enough - which is down to Ashley - or you think the players are good enough and the blame lies with Rafa. I can't see how you can possibly have it both ways. His hands are tied, but he’s doing the same with the players in many ways so what you are saying be may spot on it parts but it’s utter defeatism to lay all this on Ashley. You are in charge of your own destiny etc. Sitting back Surrendering possession No urgency Poor use of subs Lack of movement and passing Aimless long balls All down to Ashley... I'll give you the subs, the rest is because the players aren't good enough and we have to (in Rafa's opinion) play in a certain way to give ourselves a chance. This is a Championship squad, playing more expansive football by default with these players is complete suicide as far as I'm concerned. And again, having to play that way is down to Ashley, so although you were being facetious with that point, I actually agree that it is his fault. We play in a certain way, the manager’s way, and it’s sending us down. How about a bit of ball retention, some urgency, some fluency and some threat? At home at least, and against Brighton. But no... I understand full well this team isn’t good enough, but it’s better than this or could be, at least when it comes to stringing some passes together, pushing out, threatening up front and playing with urgency. Based on what? I see our players attempting all of those things and being unable to because, again and imo, they're simply not good enough. I also disagree that it's 'Rafa's way' like, he's a pragmatist and will do what's suited to each game. Generally, again because the players aren't good enough, that means having to play in a more conservative, organised way. I think people are completely kidding themselves if they think these players are capable of more. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 Its not about being expansive. They wanted a 0-0 today, they were happy with it. We needed to win and needed to press them. Yep. A mostly negative approach is fine with me in general this year because we just need to scrape enough points to stay up and we don't have great players. We need to be solid and keep picking up the odd win, and stabilise the club after coming up. At home against Brighton isn't the right time for this approach though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 Forum narrative = 18 pages of discussion about the merits of such an approach. It wasn't a discussion the other night, negative/alternative opinions weren't allowed or were ridiculed. I'm just trying to promote some balance here. He his working with his hands tied (like last year) but (like last year) he isn't making things easy for himself. I think you've mistaken people just fundamentally disagreeing with you and things being 'not allowed' Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobody Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 As this has replaced the Ashley thread it seems most appropriate to post this here. This is just my take on things and the way in which we as fans need to stick together with a fundamental point that everyone acknowledges, but falls by the wayside when we're all once again bumping the Rafa, Joselu, Dummett etc threads - All of this, every single bit of this, is Mike Ashley's fault. That's so obvious a statement that it should be seen as patronising, but time and time again people will talk about the tactics, the signings, the team selection, the players, and now Rafa, all being partially blamed under the proviso of 'yes it's Ashley's fault but Rafa, the players etc should be doing more.' - to me that's total bollocks, you either accept that the squad is nowhere near good enough - which is down to Ashley - or you think the players are good enough and the blame lies with Rafa. I can't see how you can possibly have it both ways. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 Might need to look at a new manager if the takeover happens following relegation. Can't see Rafa hanging around for another campaign in the championship no matter who the owner. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robster Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 At home against Brighton isn't the right time for this approach though. Out of context, I agree. However, the long run of defeats is still very much in the recent past so I wouldn't be surprised if Rafa wants to try and build up an unbeaten run to try and get some confidence back in the squad. I wouldn't be surprised if today was about not losing first, winning second. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ketsbaia Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 At home against Brighton isn't the right time for this approach though. Out of context, I agree. However, the long run of defeats is still very much in the recent past so I wouldn't be surprised if Rafa wants to try and build up an unbeaten run to try and get some confidence back in the squad. I wouldn't be surprised if today was about not losing first, winning second. Well it won't last long, we're away to City soon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 p.s. this fucking takeover has to fucking happen. there’s gonna be a forum murder if not Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearergol Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 p.s. this fucking takeover has to fucking happen. there’s gonna be a forum murder if not Plenty of people on here will be happy enough to say ‘I told you so’ though, that’s the main thing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinny Green Balls Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 Forum narrative = 18 pages of discussion about the merits of such an approach. It wasn't a discussion the other night, negative/alternative opinions weren't allowed or were ridiculed. I'm just trying to promote some balance here. He his working with his hands tied (like last year) but (like last year) he isn't making things easy for himself. Weren't allowed fucking drama queens of the highest order. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shays Given Tim Flowers Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 I think people confuse being posting a critical, reasoned analysis that doesn't fit in with the prevailing view and shrieking like a petulant little twat. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazza ladra Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 Did I miss something? Were people banned, Red & White Kop-style, for crticizing Benitez? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinny Green Balls Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 45 people were banned, and fucking Dave, the tyrant he is shipped them off to an internment camp. I personally support his purge, because I feel threatened by the folks who tell it how it is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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