PIF and RB Sports & Media

[El Prontonise]

1 minute ago, McCormick said:

Neom project cancelled now. Another case of PIF overpromising and underdelivering.

 

Haven't they started some of the work?  So is it fully cancelled or just scaled back significantly.

[JT24]

Maybe they can concentrate some of the funds on a new training ground before the end of the decade. 

[et tu brute]

33 minutes ago, McCormick said:

Neom project cancelled now. Another case of PIF overpromising and underdelivering.

Did you get that off the same PIF person who categorically stated they wouldn't buy us?

[McCormick]

48 minutes ago, El Prontonise said:

 

Haven't they started some of the work?  So is it fully cancelled or just scaled back significantly.

Yup, spent tonnes already. It’ll be scaled back to the point that you can’t call it the same project.

 

 

Edited March 18 by McCormick

[McCormick]

14 minutes ago, et tu brute said:

Did you get that off the same PIF person who categorically stated they wouldn't buy us?

  long memories on here. Nah the company I own is actually working on these projects alongside PIF so not some ITK exclusive; it’s probably already in the papers.

[McCormick]

https://www.news.com.au/world/middle-east/financial-quicksand-saudi-arabias-14-trillion-megacity-neom-in-trouble/news-story/5537fba4a3503c330462fe79719edeb3?amp

[ponsaelius]

Neom and in particular The Line being a total fugazi was clear from those very first renders. Science fiction nonsense.

[El Prontonise]

Yeah it was just utter ridiculous.  I applaud how ridiculous it was.

 

Basically 100+ megaprojects rolled into one.

[PauloGeordio]

2 minutes ago, ponsaelius said:

Neom and in particular The Line being a total fugazi was clear from those very first renders. Science fiction nonsense.

Absolutely. Was never going to become a reality! When the big boss says make it happen, lots of folk will tell him it can be done, until it gets to the point it’s actually now obvious that it can’t!. 

[Erikse]

Sportswashing ofcourse gets thrown around again (coincidentally mostly by Liverpool followers), but is it just my Newcastle glasses when I'm not really seeing it?

 

Quote

 

Sportswashing is a term used to describe the practice of nations, individuals, groups, corporations, or the government using sports to improve reputations tarnished by wrongdoing. A form of propaganda, sportswashing can be accomplished through hosting sporting events, purchasing or sponsoring sporting teams, or participating in a sport.

At the international level, it is believed that sportswashing has been used to direct attention away from poor human rights records and corruption scandals. At the individual and corporate levels, it is believed that sportswashing has been used to cover up vices, crimes, and scandals. Sportswashing is an example of reputation laundering.

 

 

So apart from the green away kits and Saudi games at St James, in what way is us winning a cup or so directing attention away from Saudi human rights? Did anyone other than certain Newcastle fans feel positive emotions towards Saudi Arabia because Saudi owned Newcastle won a cup? As long as we are not waving a bunch of Saudi flags at our stadium etc (I don't think we do?), I'm not really seeing how our success affects their international reputation atm, other than for some Newcastle supporters. The Saudis are staying quietly in the background atm, moreso than I thought they would initially. I get the impression that they aren't even that much involved in many decisions, unlike the PSG owners.

 

Sometimes I get the feeling that the real point was that it was kind of a show off for their own population, and maybe they even want to distract their own population from certain things. But I don't currently see how it works internationally. No clue if that's my Newcastle glasses over here.

 

 

Edited Thursday at 16:14 by Erikse

[Kanj]

On 18/03/2025 at 10:11, McCormick said:

https://www.news.com.au/world/middle-east/financial-quicksand-saudi-arabias-14-trillion-megacity-neom-in-trouble/news-story/5537fba4a3503c330462fe79719edeb3?amp

What’s really sad is how simple it could be to build really great commercial real estate and residential that would have all the intended benefits they tried on LINE or NEOM at 1-2% of that total development and it would actually get done. 

[Keegans Export]

13 minutes ago, Erikse said:

Sportswashing ofcourse gets thrown around again (coincidentally mostly by Liverpool followers), but is it just my Newcastle glasses, or am I not really seeing it?

 

 

So apart from the green away kits and Saudi games at St James, in what way is us winning a cup or so directing attention away from Saudi human rights? Did anyone other than certain Newcastle fans feel positive emotions towards Saudi Arabia because Saudi owned Newcastle won a cup? As long as we are not waving a bunch of Saudi flags at our stadium etc (I don't think we do?), I'm not really seeing how our success affects their international reputation atm, other than for some Newcastle supporters. The Saudis are staying quietly in the background atm, moreso than I thought they would initially. I get the impression that they aren't even that much involved in many decisions, unlike the PSG owners.

 

Sometimes I get the feeling that the real point was that it was kind of a show off for their own population, and maybe they even want to distract their own population from certain things. But I don't currently see how it works internationally. No clue if that's my Newcastle glasses over here.

They are considerably more invested in keeping their own population on side.

 

Internationally Saudi is too influential for governments to really care what they're up to. Countries need vast quantities of oil, we and the US make huge sums flogging them weapons, plus it is strategically very important to have a strong, well-funded "ally" in the Middle East. 

 

There'll be an element of trying to make the plebs like us think differently about KSA to increase its appeal as a tourist destination but I don't think buying a football club is going to achieve that. Their human rights issues (which are numerous) are just too high a hurdle as it stands in my opinion and that isn't going to change regardless of how many trophies we win. 

[The Prophet]

28 minutes ago, Erikse said:

Sportswashing ofcourse gets thrown around again (coincidentally mostly by Liverpool followers), but is it just my Newcastle glasses, or am I not really seeing it?

 

 

So apart from the green away kits and Saudi games at St James, in what way is us winning a cup or so directing attention away from Saudi human rights? Did anyone other than certain Newcastle fans feel positive emotions towards Saudi Arabia because Saudi owned Newcastle won a cup? As long as we are not waving a bunch of Saudi flags at our stadium etc (I don't think we do?), I'm not really seeing how our success affects their international reputation atm, other than for some Newcastle supporters. The Saudis are staying quietly in the background atm, moreso than I thought they would initially. I get the impression that they aren't even that much involved in many decisions, unlike the PSG owners.

 

Sometimes I get the feeling that the real point was that it was kind of a show off for their own population, and maybe they even want to distract their own population from certain things. But I don't currently see how it works internationally. No clue if that's my Newcastle glasses over here.

 

 

 

 

It's about normalising the KSA presence in football. It's why I don't think they've particularly rocked the boat with PSR, APT, etc.

[TheHoob]

People have had the wrong idea about what sportswashing is and how it relates to Newcastle right from the off. As if they are spunking billions of pounds so some misguided lads from Byker say a few nice things about them. 

[Geordie Ahmed]

7 hours ago, Erikse said:

Sportswashing ofcourse gets thrown around again (coincidentally mostly by Liverpool followers), but is it just my Newcastle glasses when I'm not really seeing it?

 

 

So apart from the green away kits and Saudi games at St James, in what way is us winning a cup or so directing attention away from Saudi human rights? Did anyone other than certain Newcastle fans feel positive emotions towards Saudi Arabia because Saudi owned Newcastle won a cup? As long as we are not waving a bunch of Saudi flags at our stadium etc (I don't think we do?), I'm not really seeing how our success affects their international reputation atm, other than for some Newcastle supporters. The Saudis are staying quietly in the background atm, moreso than I thought they would initially. I get the impression that they aren't even that much involved in many decisions, unlike the PSG owners.

 

Sometimes I get the feeling that the real point was that it was kind of a show off for their own population, and maybe they even want to distract their own population from certain things. But I don't currently see how it works internationally. No clue if that's my Newcastle glasses over here.

 

 

 

 

I agree

 

If anything I see more light being shone upon Saudi Arabia, certainly more than ever before, so if the idea is to hide their crimes then buying us wasn't the way to go about it

 

But maybe the Newcastle glasses I'm wearing means I'm missing something 

[Tiresias]

They just want their brand, and their associated brands everywhere, and they want people to think of investment, high tech, cool sports when people think of saudi arabia. Its part of just investing everywhere and having name about and anyone engaged enough to realise what it is isnt really the target market and it's not to make geordies specifically love them. 

 

I've made my thoughts clear before. I don't really have a problem with it being mentioned, I think the influx of super money into football is doing a lot of damage to it, competitively and morally. I think having human rights abuses part of the conversation somewhat slightly and inadequately does make the nation slightly less likely to commit them but very marginally. 

 

1. I think super defensiveness and or pretending that Saudi Arabia are doing this purely out of the goodness of their hearts isn't tremendously helpful. Their ownership of us does not mean we have to become PR for them

2. It is not the sole responsibility of Newcastle Fans to be the moral police of their owners, many seem outraged that we havent risen up or boycotted as if that's realistic. The Saudis didn't buy a homeless shelter in a league of food banks. The league in in hoc to lots of immoral cunts and just because Newcastle's is maybe the worst doesnt mean we have to be only ones singled out. I think it's also given an excuse for a lot of fans to feel superior in some way as if they always take moral stands...

3. Newcastle fans will absorb every bit of media about the club and therefore become super sensitive to repetition when 'average' fans may only come accross it less often and may feel more proportional. Just to keep that in mind.

4. Newcastle fans did not choose their ownership. Goddamn the league for creating the situation where the only hope for a team is being owned by a meglomaniac of some sort

5. I expect and will never hold anything against Newcastle fans whom have been shit upon from a great height for years (and I know fans of league 2 clubs in danger of bankrupcy, i'm not saying we had it the worst or anything) from wanting to not engage at all with the ethical dilemmas of the ownership. Everyone has enough shit to deal with in their lives than have the bandwidth to not enjoy this club

6. The region gets neglected and treated like a distant cousin for decades and then everyone is shocked when people are happy with investment when it comes?

7. I am sure some can withdraw from all the immorality of this late stage capitalist hellscape and not ever do anything 'immoral' but they are a) boring and b) see above, who has the fucking energy?

8. It's ok to feel conflicted about things. The perfect fairy tale doesnt exist, but this squad is great and lets celebrate them. 

 

If that all sounds to some like a load of apologism for something wrong? Maybe. I think it is wrong for Saudi Arabia to own us, I just didn't have a vote on it. And nobody ever wins anything and makes everyone happy. I for one have cringed quite a lot at other fans in comment sections lining up to congratulate us, like goddamn it why are we expected to be over the moon for other clubs? Some I am fond of, and generally will root for underdogs if no skin in the game, but dont think it's worth getting upset when some journo takes a mild pop. Especially when journos are literally financially dependent on 'engagement' which normally means wind ups. This isnt an inditement of journos, they are literally incentivised to say something provocative, so everyone is shocked? 

 

I also don't think it's unreasonable to be like that dude celebrating with the trophy is in a senior position in a tyrannical regime! I remain uncomfortable with that tbh. 

 

Piece over. 

 

 

Edited Thursday at 19:41 by Tiresias

[Stifler]

Looks like the Falcons are going bust.

I wonder if PIF will actually go in for them as they were rumoured to be early last year, or if they will be interested in Kingston Park for the women’s team/academy if they do fold.

[Keegans Export]

7 minutes ago, Stifler said:

Looks like the Falcons are going bust.

I wonder if PIF will actually go in for them as they were rumoured to be early last year, or if they will be interested in Kingston Park for the women’s team/academy if they do fold.

They've basically been going bust for years, relying on handouts/loans. 

 

They just don't make anywhere near enough money to be competitive, the only thing that's keeping them in the Premiership is the lack of viable teams in the Championship. 

[The Prophet]

After this week's joy and happiness for the players and staff, I just had a read of this. Very fair and well balanced piece.

[TRon]

5 minutes ago, The Prophet said:

After this week's joy and happiness for the players and staff, I just had a read of this. Very fair and well balanced piece.

 

 

Can't tell if you are being sarcastic there.

[The Prophet]

23 minutes ago, TRon said:

 

 

Can't tell if you are being sarcastic there.

 

No sarcasm, I think he's done a very good job of discussing the elephant in the room, without taking anything away from the players, staff or fans. It's a balance many such as Miguel Delaney fail to manage.

 

 

Edited Sunday at 17:01 by The Prophet

[Nucasol]

Just now, The Prophet said:

 

No sarcasm, I think he's done a very good job of discussing the elephant in the room, without taking anything away from the players, staff or fans. It's balance many such as Miguel Delaney fail to manage.

Agreed. Was expecting the usual Delaney-esque read but thought it was about as balanced as you can get.

[Unbelievable]

It's a decent article, but I fundamentally disagree with the notion that an ownership as integral to our (relative) success should not have been allowed to share in the on field celebrations. I doubt the author would have batted an eyelid if it was still Mandy lifting the trophy and making that "first of many" statement.

 

In my view it is possible to support NUFC and appreciate how the ownership are developing the club since the takeover whilst at the same time to disagree fundamentally with Saudi internal politics. I have no choice or say in either matter anyway

[Kaizero]

19 minutes ago, Unbelievable said:

It's a decent article, but I fundamentally disagree with the notion that an ownership as integral to our (relative) success should not have been allowed to share in the on field celebrations. I doubt the author would have batted an eyelid if it was still Mandy lifting the trophy and making that "first of many" statement.

 

In my view it is possible to support NUFC and appreciate how the ownership are developing the club since the takeover whilst at the same time to disagree fundamentally with Saudi internal politics. I have no choice or say in either matter anyway

 

Agree with this. I'd only have been inclined to agree with the journalist's views on owners joining celebrations if Bin-Salman himself came onto the pitch. For all intents and purposes, no matter how different reality might be, Al-Rumayyan is "only" an employee at a state owned investment fund – not a brutal dictator ordering the murder of a journalist. 

[The Prophet]

45 minutes ago, Unbelievable said:

It's a decent article, but I fundamentally disagree with the notion that an ownership as integral to our (relative) success should not have been allowed to share in the on field celebrations. I doubt the author would have batted an eyelid if it was still Mandy lifting the trophy and making that "first of many" statement.

 

In my view it is possible to support NUFC and appreciate how the ownership are developing the club since the takeover whilst at the same time to disagree fundamentally with Saudi internal politics. I have no choice or say in either matter anyway

 

Fair enough.

 

It is rather unusual and seemed rather deliberate though.

 

I felt quite uncomfortable with it, granted I'll need to get used to the hot soapy sportswash, particularly if we become more successful.

 

I don't think there's a right or wrong answer here by the way, no one should tell you how to feel. But I think the author did a good job of raising his subjective discomfort, along with my own, whilst still giving us our flowers.