PIF, PCP, and RB Sports & Media

[Orphanage]

The only power fans have ever had is the power to walk away . 

[Kid Icarus]

4 hours ago, Orphanage said:

Check how he ad homs the bloke as an extremist left wing socialist marxist ( as if that was a bad thing ! ) 

Aye Eddie bet he never murdered anyone though unlike Salman and his goons .

The replies on his vid just goes to show why Ashley had it so easy for so long . Utter morons

 

I thought that was really telling. "He's basically one step away from being a Marxist!" he says, not knowing that all being a Marxist really means is studying (and probably largely agreeing with) Marx's critique of capitalism.

 

Marxism isn't a step beyond being 'extreme left' or even a set in stone political ideology on the political spectrum. There's no single Marxist Theory, two or more people can hold any economically anti-capitalist positions based on Marx's critique, but have wildly different and incompatible political stances, ideas on what post-capitalism looks like, and how it would happen, and still all be Marxists.

 

All of the definitions for Marxism, Socialism, Communism etc all have fairly straightforward, separate definitions but are hidden behind years of propaganda and deliberately extreme mischaracterisation. The confusion is understandable, but it's also useful as a giveaway for knowing when someone doesn't really know what they're talking about when they use them interchangeably like he did. 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2023 by Kid Icarus

[RUHRLYASLEEVESUP]

8 hours ago, TheBrownBottle said:

It’s a fucking dictatorship with an appalling human rights record.  Who gives a shit if someone who makes money there has a different opinion?  Fucking hell man. 

Me, always nice to have some balancing views from someone who actually knows what is going on in Saudi, not what they read on here or twitter.

[midds]

The good news is that we get to do it all over again on Tuesday night when they play S Korea. Yay

[jack j]

This time next week it will all be forgot about, And Pearson will be back to videoing utter shite and getting away with it cos people either feel sorry for him or think he's harmless

These youtubers need got to fuck

Seen man u fans on Wembley way giving their versions of Pearson loadsa abuse. Our lot lapped it up

[Superior Acuña]

I fucking hate seeing our fans being proper fucking thick dickheads like that. My blood pressure. With regards to the ownership of the club itself, I feel like I can largely turn my brain off to it enough to enjoy the football, given how pervasively rotten football is. But it's another thing when I see the people that I'll be celebrating with, joining in Trafalagar Sq etc are actively being shills and going after decent (if strategically poor) people protesting like that.

 

(And that idiot calling people 'Marxist' , would love to hear him describe what he thinks that means)

edit: See KI's gotten to this already^

 

 

Edited September 10, 2023 by Superior Acuña

[Groundhog63]

I'm a loony lefty, remainer, snowflake, woke Marxist and it's not my fault England's drowning in its own shit, it's your fault. You flag shagging patriots. 

 

Bora Da

[Superior Acuña]

Jesus Christ man reading through the comments on the Tyneside Life video. "Well done on calling out this person" and words to that affect repeated over and over. Like this is 'speaking truth to power' or some shit

 

Oh no. I made a short comment saying it was embarrassing and I instantly got 

"I’m interested to hear how your views may differ from mine?"  

[Guybrush]

I'm not watching those videos because I can't for the life of me understand why anyone would, but I've proper gone down the rabbit hole of how to respond to "I'm just asking questions" and the bad faith tactics behind using this approach. 

 

For all the articles Google has brought up, I haven't yet found a strategy that deals with the 'just asking questions' person except ignoring them . Would be nice to have a clearer way to shut that bad faith level of 'inquiry' down.

 

Also, I learned a new adjacent term to the 'questions' one above "sealioning", which is apparently taken it's origins from this comic:

 

 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2023 by Guybrush

[Orphanage]

Apparently sportswashing is now a ' woke ' trope . Way to avoid being challenged Eddie 

[Hovagod]

Just now, Orphanage said:

Apparently sportswashing is now a ' woke ' trope . Way to avoid being challenged Eddie 

?

[St. Maximin]

20 hours ago, Wolfcastle said:

I wouldn't be too concerned if I were him, its just yet another business the Saudi's have invested in.

You can attach 'sportswashing' to differentiate it from anything else and that's a load of bollocks in itself. Could just as easily come up with 'business-washing' and or 'airline washing' and leave sport off the hook like those industries are now.

As is the notion that 'sportswashing' is to hide their human rights records when owning football clubs and hosting world cups is one of the worst things you could do if that's the case (most people in the west knew nothing about Qatar until they got/hosted the world cup) so you have to doubt that's the case at all.

 

Think the most genuine concern should come from people who love the club and dont want it associated with Saudi. The other way I don't think really works. You shouldn't feel any differently about KSA now than you did before they owned a football club.

 

Just my two penneth obviously.

 

 

 

Agree that’s who the most genuine concern should be when it comes to ‘sportswashing’. The human rights issues are what KSA does to people and not how they’re trying to improve their reputation, not that that’s what it’s solely about anyway. It would be weird and inconsistent if this takeover was blocked on sportswashing grounds as the likes of AI wanted, as it’s not a legal issue, but can still understandably make people feel uncomfortable - someone who cheers the team on and the success their money might bring would typically feel more uneasy than others who gain no benefit from it. 

 

Regarding the success of sportswashing, I think it’s a bit different to whitewashing as it isn’t really covering up the acts, but giving more positive coverage in addition. There aren’t other similar words currently as you say, but isn’t trying to improve a reputation typical for all sorts of entities (including businesses, organisations etc) that have and can do harmful things? In fact some could say we did it over here in 2005 by winning the Olympics not long after invading Middle Eastern countries. 
 

Ultimately though I’m not sure it’s about being seen as more likeable, but more about relevant and intertwined with our culture and politics for economic benefit primarily. I don’t think all their investment in football has really made them seem more likeable or improved a reputation. It’s no doubt helped western tourism and bizarrely gained a small number of apologists within our fanbase, but for all the attention they’ve gained for sport, they’ve also gained it for human rights issues. And the Saudi league by and large seems to be another reason to be annoyed at the country right now. Appreciate maybe that will change in time though. 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2023 by St. Maximin

[Scoot]

33 minutes ago, Orphanage said:

Apparently sportswashing is now a ' woke ' trope . Way to avoid being challenged Eddie 

 

[Kid Icarus]

The comments section in that video is deeply ironic with tons of projection like.

 

People throwing their hands up saying how he refuses to define sportswashing, while embodying it.

 

Others saying to keep politics out of football, while defending our state ownership.

 

Others saying the protest will change nothing, while saying our Saudi ownership can be a positive vehicle for change.

 

People calling Eddy a balanced, impartial, fair 'journalist' when he described the protestor's rhetoric as "bile" and "inappropriate"

 

Others calling the protestors brainwashed.

 

and then Eddy himself bemoaning how while the protestor has the right to do so, should be challenged and can't handle being questioned...ignoring that the protestor themselves are challenging the club, and then Eddy himself blocks or threatens to block people who even mildly challenge him.

 

But yeah, sportswashing doesn't really exist.

 

It's funny, because I've always thought of "...washing" like whitewashing - a PR cover for things, but the comments section has made realise that brainwashing applies just as much.

 

 

Edited September 10, 2023 by Kid Icarus

[RS]

The problem I have is people using Newcastle United as their only focus for protest, when often their real agenda is a sly dig at the fans (see rtg). The government should be the primary focus. 

[Yorkie]

The funniest of the rinse-and-repeat comments are the ones which say "thanks for being fair/balanced."

[El Prontonise]

32 minutes ago, RS said:

The problem I have is people using Newcastle United as their only focus for protest, when often their real agenda is a sly dig at the fans (see rtg). The government should be the primary focus. 

 

You use the best vehicle to get your message out, sadly that's us.

 

This is why Just Stop Oil etc target sporting events primarily.

[Orphanage]

1 hour ago, Hovagod said:

?

This is what Eddie says . Hes using that to dismiss the protesters point of view

[El Prontonise]

Regarding the sportswashing element that stuff will just come and go and it's not really the real aim of KSA.

 

The real aim is to integrate with our economic, political and social systems so that they buy leverage for when they need it and they will need it for when their enemies start to embolden when the Americans firmly drop out of controlling the world which is arriving shortly.

[TheHoob]

12 minutes ago, Orphanage said:

This is what Eddie says . Hes using that to dismiss the protesters point of view

When has he said this? 

[El Prontonise]

I think the Eddie's here are getting mixed up.

[TheHoob]

Ah  my bad. 

 

I have no idea who that is and I think I plan on keeping it that way. 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2023 by TheHoob

[Dr Jinx]

I don’t think anyone who posts on here is sympathetic to what Saudi do. We know the score like.

 

The question of sportswashing is a murkier topic. I certainly don’t see a vanity project with our club in the same way as the boxing has been or say wrestling events. That shit is fairly blatant. Yet they seem to get way more of a pass than our club has gotten.

 

For as much as people are correct when it comes to Saudi, there’s an equal share of double standards and hypocrisy. Where are these people when Iraq was being invaded, or scientists being murdered.. or how about a cover up of why dozens of people burned alive in a tower block. You’d swear every other country apart from Saudi is squeaky clean.

[Kanji]

Not shocked at all about how stupid those people are in those videos and magnified by idiots thinking their YouTube Channel entitles them to being some sort of voice. 

[gdm]

5 minutes ago, Dr Jinx said:

The question of sportswashing is a murkier topic. I certainly don’t see a vanity project with our club in the same way as the boxing has been or say wrestling events. That shit is fairly blatant. Yet they seem to get way more of a pass than our club has gotten.

Dunno about that like. From the team playing a friendly mid season in Saudi Arabia to Saudi National team playing at st James park with The team playing in what would have been a decent mock up of a Saudi kit and the documentary in between. It doesn’t get any more blatent than that 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2023 by gdm