Heron Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 17 minutes ago, SUPERTOON said: Not one person is saying Shelvey is world class, but it’s pretty straightforward that we took a huge risk in selling him without a replacement considering the need for a CM before he left. It’s a risk that has already back fired in my opinion. Would you rather have Anthony Gordon or Shelvey and Wood at this stage? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groundhog63 Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 16 minutes ago, SUPERTOON said: Not one person is saying Shelvey is world class, but it’s pretty straightforward that we took a huge risk in selling him without a replacement considering the need for a CM before he left. It’s a risk that has already back fired in my opinion. We've drawn 5 of the last 6. Shelvey's been injured so wouldn't have saved us anyway. Plus he's not good enough. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERTOON Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 2 minutes ago, Heron said: Would you rather have Anthony Gordon or Shelvey and Wood at this stage? Why is Shelvey included in that ? Signing Gordon has nothing to do with us selling Shelvey. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cronky Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 I think we miss Bruno. A lot of our play goes through him. It felt like an unfamiliar line-up yesterday and we weren't at our fluent best. But Bournemouth played well on the break, and we shouldn't assume that just because of their league position they were there for the taking. I can't see that Shelvey or Wood would have made a lot of difference. Both players wanted to go, and Eddie would have had to consider whether it was wise to insist on them staying. Apart from any effect on their performance, it's valuable for the club to get a reputation for treating players well. This squad has over-achieved massively in reaching 4th place. If we maintain it, that should be a bonus rather than an expectation. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERTOON Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 1 minute ago, Groundhog63 said: We've drawn 5 of the last 6. Shelvey's been injured so wouldn't have saved us anyway. Plus he's not good enough. I’m not talking about the last few games, but he would have played a role in the rest of the season and given us an option to rest the 4 who have pretty much played every single minute so far this season. I’m by no means a massive Shelvey fan, but our squad is currently weaker without him, that is undeniable imo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heron Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 (edited) 12 minutes ago, SUPERTOON said: Why is Shelvey included in that ? Signing Gordon has nothing to do with us selling Shelvey. How isn't he? Squad places need to be made available and we need to abide by FFP. We've removed probably one of the highest earners for least quality players and have also cashed in on someone who wasn't good enough but did us an immediate job to save us from relegation. I think people are re-imagining Shelvey personally. Good servant for the club across the years but wasn't fit half the time, lacked athleticism and sometimes simply had a lazy attitude. Why would Wood be included and not Shelvey, to your point? We've brought in a more creative option to unlock teams, someone whom we can rely upon for our high press and stay fit. We've had a suspension for Bruno (shit happens) and players are running tired at present but I also believe Howe isn't willing to jeopardise our cup match for a win away at Bournemouth. He's protecting players in what will be huge for them, as well as us. We could go all Chelsea and buy every fucker but in all honesty, I don't see how that'd work. It won't work for Chelsea (this season, and perhaps even next) either. Slow and steady wins the race. Anthony Gordon coming in has improved our first team propositions and ultimately our squad, and is transformative in that we're clearly confident in our ability to control games and hold teams and now are progressing into attacking and going after 3 points. It'll all happen in time, I just feel people aren't giving it that. Edited February 12, 2023 by Heron Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heron Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 19 minutes ago, SUPERTOON said: I’m not talking about the last few games, but he would have played a role in the rest of the season and given us an option to rest the 4 who have pretty much played every single minute so far this season. I’m by no means a massive Shelvey fan, but our squad is currently weaker without him, that is undeniable imo. I don't believe it is. It gives a different option/more depth in replacement for a different option/more depth in another, and now we're looking towards getting wins not avoiding defeats Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERTOON Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 10 minutes ago, Heron said: How isn't he? Squad places need to be made available and we need to abide by FFP. We've removed probably one of the highest earners for least quality players and have also cashed in on someone who wasn't good enough but did us an immediate job to save us from relegation. I think people are re-imagining Shelvey personally. Good servant for the club across the years but wasn't fit half the time, lacked athleticism and sometimes simply had a lazy attitude. Why would Wood be included and not Shelvey, to your point? We've brought in a more creative option to unlock teams, someone whom we can rely upon for our high press and stay fit. We've had a suspension for Bruno (shit happens) and players are running tired at present but I also believe Howe isn't willing to jeopardise our cup match for a win away at Bournemouth. He's protecting players in what will be huge for them, as well as us. We could go all Chelsea and buy every fucker but in all honesty, I don't see how that'd work. It won't work for Chelsea (this season, and perhaps even next) either. Slow and steady wins the race. Anthony Gordon coming in has improved our first team propositions and ultimately our squad, and is transformative in that we're clearly confident in our ability to control games and hold teams and now are progressing into attacking and going after 3 points. It'll all happen in time, I just feel people aren't giving it that. We didn’t need to sell Shelvey to sign Gordon, why would we ? We signed Gordon and Shelvey was going to stay (Howe had said this a couple of times). Again im not reimagining Shelvey, I was never his biggest fan, but our squad is weaker with him gone and not replaced. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 The only way FFP is impacted is if we buy poorly, which is down to bad scouting. I don't think Howe can take any blame really, what he's done with the squad is absolutely insane and he's obviously good at recognising players who he can work with, but he needs a lot more help. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeyt Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 (edited) 8 hours ago, timeEd32 said: I’ve still yet to see an answer to the question of who could we have signed that could have guaranteed a top 4 position? And I assume this is ignored because the answer is no one. . An extra midfielder gives us options in the run in and possibly the cup. You can't tell me there's no one out there better than an unfit Jonjo Shelvey? Edited February 12, 2023 by joeyt Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geogaddi Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 People criticising Shelvey being sold , have a look back on the thread when it was announced he was leaving , the vast majority were over the moon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smal Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 7 minutes ago, Geogaddi said: People criticising Shelvey being sold , have a look back on the thread when it was announced he was leaving , the vast majority were over the moon. I think most people who were happy also assumed we must be signing a replacement because it would be suicidal to go into the second half of the season with 4 midfielders to fill 3 positions. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
greydos Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 2 hours ago, Conjo said: Only 4 clubs spent more than us in January, including the one we drew against yesterday. The transfer window may not have been impressive, but the comments about seeming entitled is when you (or others - I haven't paid attention to whom, just seen a lot of those type of comments) start blaming the performance yesterday on the lack of investment in the January window. If you think our current midfielders looked leggy, why the fuuuuuck would you want Shelvey as an alternative in the middle anyway? I think this Shelvey talk is missing the point a little. No-one’s saying he’s a world-beater, but: 1) if Shelvey gets minutes, it means Longstaff/Joe/Jo are fresher and so can perform better when they’re on the pitch, 2) teams sitting back against us would play to Shelvey’s strengths, as he’d get more time on the ball to ping into midfield and so Joelinton/Longstaff could concentrate more on getting forward and not leaving Isak & Maxi isolated, 3) yesterday Shelvey put a ball in for Forest on a six-pence that should’ve resulted in a goal. It was similar to Longstaff’s cross for Wilson that Isak finished against Fulham. We could definitely use a deeper-pinged cross as a variety to our attacking crosses, as we most often tend to get to byeline and Trippier floats it or Almiron on his baby-right foot slides a slow pass across the ground and falls over. I’m certain we’d be stronger with Shelvey and Eddie seems to hold the same view Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeyt Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 2 hours ago, Cronky said: I think we miss Bruno. You reckon? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 Keeping Shelvey improves our options in midfield massively like, I cannot see how anyone could believe it was a good idea to give him away. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERTOON Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 22 minutes ago, Geogaddi said: People criticising Shelvey being sold , have a look back on the thread when it was announced he was leaving , the vast majority were over the moon. Because we thought he would be replaced Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 https://www.forestforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/jonjo-shelvey.51034/page-20 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PauloGeordio Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 6 minutes ago, Hanshithispantz said: https://www.forestforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/jonjo-shelvey.51034/page-20 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeyt Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 20 minutes ago, Smal said: I think most people who were happy also assumed we must be signing a replacement because it would be suicidal to go into the second half of the season with 4 midfielders to fill 3 positions. And we usually play all 4 anyway with one being at left mid Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miggys First Goal Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 Can we bring him back? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 4 minutes ago, joeyt said: And we usually play all 4 anyway with one being at left mid That was partly due to Maxi being injured and a main reason behind buying Gordon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stottie Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 9 hours ago, The Prophet said: Said the same after West Ham last week, but I'd be amazed if the player we brought in on loan would have might the slightest bit of difference today. The players we wanted as difference makers weren't available in January, we need to get over it. All transfer talk from fans involves speculation, but it cuts both ways. About players who are avaiable and not available. Ultimately all players are available if you pay enough and push hard enough. For the level of player we want, high-level desirable players, pushing hard enough may include paying them more than another club they have their heart set on. However, unless its Arsenal or Man City, where competition will be fierce, such players are now just as likely to get Champions League here as at any other English club. We are a much more attractive proposition now we are sitting near the top of the table. Unless Tielemans has a deal set up already with Arsenal, PSG or someone, presumably he was "available". The selling club would have no option but to sell. Leicester are not in a position where they can forego the equivalent of 1 million quid plus per game (in lost transfer fee plus wages) for him. Even if our January budget and FFP meant it was only one of a forward (Gordon) and a midfielder, there is still scope for us fans to debate which of those choices should have been made. This is a football talking points forum and it is a valid football talking point. The fact that we did sign one expensive player tells us there was money there to be used. Had we paid a higher fee for Gordon, but in installments, there may have been enough money for two players. Despite us giving Everton cash, they promptly went and didn't use it, suggesting they didn't actually need cash in after all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smal Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 18 minutes ago, joeyt said: And we usually play all 4 anyway with one being at left mid yeah, it’s mad. We had basically no midfield yesterday because neither Longstaff or Joelinton can positionally play as a single pivot, so both played much deeper than they usually do to compensate. Keep Shelvey or replace him with another specialist 6 who can slot straight in for Bruno and our midfield structure looks way better. Willock’s injured now. It was an absolutely mental decision that will cost us a lot of points. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingArthur Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 31 minutes ago, Hanshithispantz said: Keeping Shelvey improves our options in midfield massively like, I cannot see how anyone could believe it was a good idea to give him away. In theory yes. But A) will he be fit B) if he plays and gets automatically new contract for like 80k/wk, that hinders our transfer dealings a bit next summer... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty66 Posted February 12, 2023 Share Posted February 12, 2023 We couldn't have kept Shelvey as he wanted to leave. Howe told him he can't go but Shelvey said he wanted a new challenge so Howe had no choice. Yes we should have got a replacement but there's obviously valid reasons for why we didn't get it done. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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