mrmojorisin75 Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Forget Bryan like, other clubs interested we're not getting him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinoasprilla Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Would take Bryan definitely do not want Ings for £20 million. I know transfer market is crazy but that for someone who has played a handful of games in 2 years is madness Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Luque Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 £26 000 000 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaizero Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Ings was 1 in 3.2 at Burnley, and has been 1 in 6.25 at Liverpool. Just no. Please no. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wormy Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 One positive of our joke of a transfer policy is that we'd never be at risk of throwing away so much money on such a God awful transfer, I guess. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 One positive of our joke of a transfer policy is that we'd never be at risk of throwing away so much money on such a God awful transfer, I guess. A lot of the players we do buy, however, end up costing us in ‘throwing away’ wages anyway as they often end up simply not good enough and hard to shift on. Colback for example. Given how the owner likes to include wages in any transfer budget, that has fucked us over as much as anything. One thing we have with Rafa is when he signs a player more often than not they become a useful player or perform well for us and often become much improved because of his coaching. Even the duds he seems to be able to see through them quickly and tries to get rid quickly as well. If only the club backed his knowledge, contacts and judgement more. If Rafa for example thought Danny Ings would do a great job for us for a years or two, even if he cost 20m, it’s about backing your manager. After all, it’s him who is responsible for making everything work out on the pitch. Clubs these days don’t look at the cost of a player, they look at how a player can improve them even if it’s short term. Even though I’m critical of Joselu and think he is shit, he has done more for the team and his manager last season than many a player has for us in the past who cost much more. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wormy Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Won't argue with any of that. Definitely not defending our transfer policy. But I'll admit I like knowing we're not going to waste £26m on Danny Ings. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 If Maguire is rated at £80m, than Lascelles is worth equal to that. I rate Lascelles as arguably the best English CB and certainly one of the best in the PL when it comes to general CB type defending, but although he is a better defender than Maguire, he is nowhere near as good a footballer as he is. That’s why Lascelles didn’t go to the WC and wouldn’t be a good fit for say a Man Utd who won’t be defending as much as we do and therefore need what Lascelles is so good at. Lascelles wouldn’t improve Man Utd, Maguire would. I think someone like Lascelles would maybe regress away from Rafa or at a club that he would be expected to do a lot more with and on the ball. He is no donkey don’t get me wrong, but unless partnered with someone who is comfortable and even elegant on the ball as he is with Lejeune, he would cut an average looking figure at the back IMO. For me he is priceless to us because of what he gives us as a Captain, as Rafa’s eyes and ears on the pitch and because he gets the club and fans and city and is still young, but 35m would be silly money for him. He’s basically a CB version of Nolan for us for me. I can see us accepting a crazy last minute bid mind in the region of 25m or so by someone which is what he’s worth all things considered. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Looking at these it's pathetic really He's a recap of our top transfers 1. Michael Owen (£17m, 2005) 2. Alan Shearer (£15m, 1996) 3. Georginio Wijnaldum (£14.5m, 2014) 4. Aleksandar Mitrovic (£14m, 2014) 5. Florian Thauvin (£13m, 2014) 6= Jacob Murphy (£12m, 2017) 6= Jonjo Shelvey (£12m, 2015) 6= Andros Townsend (£12m, 2015) 6= Matt Ritchie (£12m, 2016) 10. Fabricio Coloccini (£10.3m, 2008) 11= Obafemi Martins (£10m, 2006) 11= Dwight Gayle (£10m, 2016) Only signed ten players over £10m in our history. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Won't argue with any of that. Definitely not defending our transfer policy. But I'll admit I like knowing we're not going to waste £26m on Danny Ings. Because of us being NUFC and how finances, spread sheets, accounts, wages and whatever have become something for us fans to be bothered with these days, I’d be aghast at spending that kind of money on Ings and a lot of other players. But this is the way football works now. Championship players going for record fees, players who hardly ever play going for daft fees. Young players with barely a few appearances going for daft fees too. I’d hate to think how much Loftud-Cheek would cost for example or Jessy Lingard. 20m these days gets you the equiverlent of Daniel Cordone level flops more than successes. A fit Ings even at that money would in effect be considered money well spent. It’s time we got with the times and trust our manager who can turn a 20m player into a 40m one or more or a 20m injury prone journeyman into a key player for us, on or off the bench. That’s why I would happily see us pay 30m for Kennedy or the same for someone like Loftus-Cheek or Abraham. The money involved these days means it’s pointless even considering it when evaluating a player, you just have to look at them purely what they can give you on the pitch where 10 league goals is huge and a few assists just as huge for starting strikers or just being commanding and good at kicking in goal is huge. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Looking at these it's pathetic really He's a recap of our top transfers 1. Michael Owen (£17m, 2005) 2. Alan Shearer (£15m, 1996) 3. Georginio Wijnaldum (£14.5m, 2014) 4. Aleksandar Mitrovic (£14m, 2014) 5. Florian Thauvin (£13m, 2014) 6= Jacob Murphy (£12m, 2017) 6= Jonjo Shelvey (£12m, 2015) 6= Andros Townsend (£12m, 2015) 6= Matt Ritchie (£12m, 2016) 10. Fabricio Coloccini (£10.3m, 2008) 11= Obafemi Martins (£10m, 2006) 11= Dwight Gayle (£10m, 2016) Only signed ten players over £10m in our history. Shearer man at 15m, buy of all-time for us. He probably cost us 50m in fees, wages, insurance, medical bills etc. In the decade he was here. Or a Kyle Walker. I think you could treble that in terms of what kind of money having Shearer helped make the club over those years. Ashley would never sign a Shearer today and I don’t mean that calibre of player because no such player would look twice at us even if we could afford it, I mean someone who would repay back whatever he cost to sign + wages 10 times over, a player who would be here for a decade and score lots of goals or create lots of goals. We have the equiverlent of Shearer as manager and he is being told, not asked, to fucking look at the back of his own couch for change. I’m not bothered about breaking our record per se because it means nowt, it’s just a stat, but I’m bothered that in an age where the average player costs more than our transfer record, our owner isn’t willing to sanction such a deal. In doing so we basically cannot compete and not with anyone, but everyone. Even with some Champinship clubs or newly promoted teams. It’s ridiculous and doesn’t make sense even for Ashley. That list of players he has spent more than 10m have been a success or we have made good profit on. I am now of the opinion that I’d argue it as fact in a court of law that Ashley is deliberately sabotaging managers, the team and most of all the fans. He only reacts following a relegation (Our spend second relegation) or if it looks like we are in danger of going down (Jan spree on Sisoko er al) or following fan unrest (McClaren). It is no coincidence that since this ifrafagoeswego thing started, we seem a tad more pro-active in the transfer market. As ever with him though even when we do spend, it’s not enough and never will be. We either paper over cracks or take a sideways step. Upto now I think anyone happy with our business needs a slap around the face. I’m only happy when Rafa is and at the moment he is simply replacing bodies and adding to the team with an anything is better than nothing policywhich the owner has always operated, again even when spending. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STM Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Howay HTT, comparing Shearers fees to Kyle Walker is daft. Us buying Shearer, is the equivalent to a modern day Neymar transaction. Daft money, beyond the norm but it was worth it for us. RE now, we don't waste money on transfer fees but we do waste loads in wages. Think of Saivet, De Jong etc Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Would Bryan get in the team? I’ve genuinely no idea about him aside from he scored that belter past Man Utd. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeyt Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Not sure if he'd get in straight away but he'd certainly provide excellent competition for Dummett and wouldn't be purely a backup like Manquilo is Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallace Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Rafa is the first manager Ashley has had that has improved players. All of those 5th/6th options, were wasted money under previous managers mostly ending up loaned out with us paying part of their wages until they have seen out their contract. If they had bought a couple of 1st choice players instead, they could probably have sold them on for a profit and they would probably have been more cost-effective in the long run. Would Lascelles have developed into the player he is currently under any other manager - he was pretty much ignored by the previous managers. If the club end up selling him for a big fee then that will be purely down to Rafa. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinoasprilla Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Depends on Dummets form and fitness but with Games and Haidara gone we are short at full back. Would hate to see Clark or Manquillo there for a long period Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlies Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Probably a load out then. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Won't argue with any of that. Definitely not defending our transfer policy. But I'll admit I like knowing we're not going to waste £26m on Danny Ings. Because of us being NUFC and how finances, spread sheets, accounts, wages and whatever have become something for us fans to be bothered with these days, I’d be aghast at spending that kind of money on Ings and a lot of other players. But this is the way football works now. Championship players going for record fees, players who hardly ever play going for daft fees. Young players with barely a few appearances going for daft fees too. I’d hate to think how much Loftud-Cheek would cost for example or Jessy Lingard. 20m these days gets you the equiverlent of Daniel Cordone level flops more than successes. A fit Ings even at that money would in effect be considered money well spent. It’s time we got with the times and trust our manager who can turn a 20m player into a 40m one or more or a 20m injury prone journeyman into a key player for us, on or off the bench. That’s why I would happily see us pay 30m for Kennedy or the same for someone like Loftus-Cheek or Abraham. The money involved these days means it’s pointless even considering it when evaluating a player, you just have to look at them purely what they can give you on the pitch where 10 league goals is huge and a few assists just as huge for starting strikers or just being commanding and good at kicking in goal is huge. I'm not even sure Ings would fit into the manager's set up, do you know that he is actually one of the strikers Rafa's has targeted? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Howay HTT, comparing Shearers fees to Kyle Walker is daft. Us buying Shearer, is the equivalent to a modern day Neymar transaction. Daft money, beyond the norm but it was worth it for us. RE now, we don't waste money on transfer fees but we do waste loads in wages. Think of Saivet, De Jong etc I agree, I threw in Walker just to comprehend what money gets you now to myself more than anything. Regardless we all know that money these days buys you fuck all compared to the past so us being in a time warp where spending over 10m is for purples only or whatever is bonkers. We do spend loads on wages, and while it’s not exactly commensurate with other clubs (our highest paid player I believe earns 50k a week not including bonuses or whatever), we do pay what I’d say is above the average to a certain standard of player which is more tied to the length of their contract than salary size. And that’s because more often than not that is how we get the player to the club in the first place with a juicy lengthy incentive based contract as we shop around the free, contract clause, agent-owned and loan markets. We get the worst of both worlds, bang average players hard to shift because of the length of their contract and players who become quite happy to collect their wages. In the vicious circle that is Ashley’s ownership of us, managers just end up needing said players eventually gone regardless to free up money and wages for someone else. Someone else just a different name or number, it’s the same rotation of players in and players out all the same. We might replace a French player with a Dutch player or sell a Mitrovic to buy a Rondón. e can get on loan or get because of club-agent relationship. All that does is give players a shirt for a team photo. Rafa should be spending whatever money he has on whoever he wants, be it 20m on one player on 100k a week or 20m on 4 players at 25k a week or being happy with only one player in a certain role to choose from if that player was worth two players. As it is he has to sell in order to buy which creates a 1 in 1 out, only money coming in is made available policy and limits him to certain markets like loans, frees, contract clause players, in last year contract players or from way outside any top league be it the Championship or the Czech league. I wouldn’t even fancy our chances between ourselves and Cardiff if we were after the same player, even if it was a loan deal or a player with a release clause. Our current policy which used to work for us at times with your Ben Arfas, Demba Bas, Cabayes etc or with Colback coming on a free from our derby rivals just to highlight how we used the freebie market and could snatch a player even from our main rivals, just doesn’t cut it anymore in today’s climate. Not when Swansea can give Abraham more money, Chelsea a bigger loan fee or when even Ajax of the Dutch league can spend more on a player than we can or can pay a bigger salary. I say can, we could too, but we won’t. It’s basically bargain bin shopping we do and even then Rafa is looking at things priced at 20p and not any of the 50p items. If it’s shit it doesn’t matter how cheap it is it’s not going to be anything different. Joselu my case in point. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hhtoon Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Rafa is the first manager Ashley has had that has improved players. All of those 5th/6th options, were wasted money under previous managers mostly ending up loaned out with us paying part of their wages until they have seen out their contract. If they had bought a couple of 1st choice players instead, they could probably have sold them on for a profit and they would probably have been more cost-effective in the long run. Would Lascelles have developed into the player he is currently under any other manager - he was pretty much ignored by the previous managers. If the club end up selling him for a big fee then that will be purely down to Rafa. Rafa wanted to keep Thauvin didn't he? Wonder how he'd have turned out with the right manager Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LionOfGosforth Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Probably a loan out then. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sempuki Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 I make it we have made approximately £25m profit on transfers with Mitro going... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bowlingcrofty Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 I make it we have made approximately £25m profit on transfers with Mitro going... Out: Mitro £22m Mbemba £6m Merino: £10m Sels: £4m Haidara, Gamez and the young'uns: Nowt Total £42m In: Schar: £3.5m Muto: £9m Ki and Kenedy: Bugger all, maybe a loan fee of a couple of mill Total £15m-ish is how I see it... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 They'll claim Ki and Kenedy cost us £20m in agents fees. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
healthyaddiction Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 I make it we have made approximately £25m profit on transfers with Mitro going... Out: Mitro £22m Mbemba £6m Merino: £10m Sels: £4m Haidara, Gamez and the young'uns: Nowt Total £42m In: Schar: £3.5m Muto: £9m Ki and Kenedy: Bugger all, maybe a loan fee of a couple of mill Total £15m-ish is how I see it... Dubravka? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts