How would you rank the current PL Managers?

[Fantail Breeze]

4 minutes ago, Kaizero said:

It's a comment on how people are discounting what OGS did in Norwaty, taking a team that's never won the league in their history to becoming the powerhouse in the country for a decade. It's like if Dundee had dethroned Celtic. Finished top of their league in the EL ahead of Celtic, Fenerbache and Ajax. If you praise Potter as being a good manager for his Swedish record, you should do the same for OGS. That's the argument. You can't praise one manager for his feats in a "shit tier" league and trash the other when that person's feats objectively are better. 
 

Not saying OGS should have been given the Man Utd gig at all based on his record. Just that people praising Potter are victims of a stupid double standard.

 

Potter has managed three teams and has improved them all during his time with them.

 

OGS has managed three teams and ruined two of them. Molde is the exception with OGS, not the norm.

 

 

Edited November 7, 2021 by Fantail Breeze

[Kaizero]

Just now, Fantail Breeze said:

 

Potter has managed three teams and has improved them all during his time with them.

 

OGS has managed three teams and ruined two of them.

His record at Man Utd is the third best in their history. I'm not even defending OGS, I fully believe Man Utd could get a better manager. I'm just pointing out the shithousery of the arguments given when there's decent actual arguments against him being in the job. 

[Gaztoon]

I think arsenal under arteta as finally clicked.

[St. Maximin]

I’m not sure what Rafa has done recently to say he’s above the likes of Moyes, Rodgers, Howe etc. He’s up there in people’s top 5 because of his historical achievements imo. But then again it’s just so hard to compare different managers and clubs. Agree it’s a pretty phenomenal standard of managers - teams also. 

[Fantail Breeze]

Just now, Kaizero said:

His record at Man Utd is the third best in their history. I'm not even defending OGS, I fully believe Man Utd could get a better manager. I'm just pointing out the shithousery of the arguments given when there's decent actual arguments against him being in the job. 

 

Zero trophies and some of the worst performances ever seen?

 

This win % thing is a horrific measure of success when Man Utd’s consistent success only really started under Sir Alex. 
 

So Ole is essentially being applauded for having a better win percentage (but less trophies) than LVG and David Moyes (who only got eight months).

 

But a lower one (and again, less trophies) than Mourinho who is constantly called a failure.

[Kaizero]

4 minutes ago, Fantail Breeze said:

 

Zero trophies and some of the worst performances ever seen?

 

This win % thing is a horrific measure of success when Man Utd’s consistent success only really started under Sir Alex. 
 

So Ole is essentially being applauded for having a better win percentage (but less trophies) than LVG and David Moyes (who only got eight months).

 

But a lower one (and again, less trophies) than Mourinho who is constantly called a failure.

He's not being applauded, he's rightly being criticized for not getting the best out a team full of great players. 
 

What I was raising a point of discussion around was not that, it's that Potter is being praised for something OGS did better, which in turn is being used as a stick to beat him with. Those two viewpoints doesn't add up if held at the same time.

 

You can't praise Potter for his "amazing job in Sweden" and bash OGS for his "time dominating in a tinpot league" at the same time. 
 

 

 

Edited November 7, 2021 by Kaizero

[Fantail Breeze]

Just now, Kaizero said:

He's not being applauded, he's rightly being criticized for not getting the best out a team full of great players. 
 

What I was raising a point of discussion around was not that, it's that Potter is being praised for something OGS did better, which in turn is being used as a stick to beat him with. Those two viewpoints doesn't add up if held at the same time.

 

You literally said “His record at Man Utd is the third best in their history”. What does that have to do with Potter’s achievements? It was your way of trying to defend Ole’s pathetic Man Utd record.

 

Potter is a better manager because like I said, he’s been at three teams and improved them all. His record in Sweden was good, as was Ole’s in Norway. Nobody has really disputed that.

 

But their overall managerial careers go to show that Potter is lightyears ahead of Ole.

 

I’m intrigued how/why you rate Ole above Brendan Rodgers though, if you could explain that one.

[gazza ladra]

4 minutes ago, Fantail Breeze said:

I’m intrigued how/why you rate Ole above Brendan Rodgers though, if you could explain that one.

Indeed, I'd like to hear that one. 

 

[Kaizero]

5 minutes ago, Fantail Breeze said:

 

You literally said “His record at Man Utd is the third best in their history”. What does that have to do with Potter’s achievements? It was your way of trying to defend Ole’s pathetic Man Utd record.

 

Potter is a better manager because like I said, he’s been at three teams and improved them all. His record in Sweden was good, as was Ole’s in Norway. Nobody has really disputed that.

 

But their overall managerial careers go to show that Potter is lightyears ahead of Ole.

 

I’m intrigued how/why you rate Ole above Brendan Rodgers though, if you could explain that one.

Potter has a win percentage lower than Steve Bruce in the PL, though.

 

Rodgers is purely personal as I have a great dislike of him for no particular reasonand just feel he's a fraud. Fully accept that's extremely subjective but I don't feel comortable ranking him too high on my list

[Fantail Breeze]

Just now, Kaizero said:

Potter has a win percentage lower than Steve Bruce in the PL, though.

 

Rodgers is purely personal as I have a great dislike of him for no particular reasonand just feel he's a fraud. Fully accept that's extremely subjective but I don't feel comortable ranking him too high on my list

 

Brighton are 7th in the Premier League. His win % accounts for keeping that team in the league (where others have failed) and progressing year on year.

 

Don’t disagree too much about your thoughts on Rodgers, or his positioning in your list, my point is that OGS is very badly misplaced in your list.

[Kaizero]

11 minutes ago, ManDoon said:

Ole managed a 4th tier club in Norway  did he?  They finished second in 09. How is that the same lol. The. The guy after Ole won a double. (Their first ever) The Errling Moe won a league with them. 
 

How is that comparable to taking a team from the 4th tier of Swedish football to beating arsenal in the Europa league? Anyway I’m not going to pollute this thread because it’s pretty obvs that OGS is an objectively gash manager, so I’m out. 

It's easy (relative to say in England, not that anyone can do it, my example below is an experienced Manager) to pull a team from the lower reaches of Scando football, some money and you're golden. Kjetil Rekdal just grabbed Ham-Kam from the third tier and brought them up to the Norwegian top divison in no time, not saying he should get a chance in the PL.

 

OGS changed the structure of the club and brought a form of professionalism not seen in the Norwegian league since the days of Nils Arne Eggen (things get stale when the same team wins every year). He turned a shitty club historically into a well oiled machine. He shouldn't have gotten the Man Utd job on the back of it, though. That's purely nepotism. I just don't like the more personal attacks that involves trashing my nation's league (that's mainly where my anger comes from I reckon  Especially considering how riled up I get when Potter gets praise) when there's fairly objective faults with his style for, and his time with, Man Utd.
 

On the subject of managers in the shit Scando leagues though, Kjetil Knutsen however has taken an absolute shitfest and made then one of the most entertaining sides I've ever watched, full of like 80% local players from a catchment area of 100k-ish. Beat Roma 6-1 and drew 2-2 away, sold the players responsible for over 2/3rds of their goals scored/created between seasons, replaced them with failed no-marks from clubs divisions below or with local youngsters, kept on scoring. Remove the best player and put in another and nothing happens because the system is so ingrained. I'm fully in love with what Knutsen is doing and really want any team anywhere in a bigger league to take a chance so I can see if he can do it elsewhere. 

 

 

Edited November 7, 2021 by Kaizero

[gazza ladra]

Is there an up-to-date points per expenditure analysis out there?  Saw one a few seasons back that made a strong argument for Klopp and Pochettino, I think. Got to think that OGS is going to come out bottom or near bottom of any list based on those numbers.

[Ameritoon]

Without knowing much about Frank or Lage, who both seem to be doing decent jobs this year. Add in whoever Villa get, definitely a good crop of managers.

 

1) Klopp

2) Pep

3) Conte

4) Rafa

5) Tuchel

6) Rodgers

7) Bielsa

8) Moyes

9) Potter

10) Howe

11) Viera

12) Hasenhuttel

13) Dyche

14) Ranieri

15) OGS

16) Frank

17) Arteta

18) Lage

 

 

Edited November 7, 2021 by Ameritoon

[Dr Jinx]

A manager is only as good as the players he has and the players will only be as good as how they are managed.

 

It’s hard to be objective with a list like that without counting current squads.

 

On trophies won, it’s clear Pep is by far the best of the current crop.

 

Rafa has had about as much success as Klopp so far in his career, so who do you count in that sense?

 

Would someone like Graham Potter or Eddie Howe be successful if they had squads similar to what Man City or Liverpool have right now?

[Manxst]

49 minutes ago, Kaizero said:

His record at Man Utd is the third best in their history. I'm not even defending OGS, I fully believe Man Utd could get a better manager. I'm just pointing out the shithousery of the arguments given when there's decent actual arguments against him being in the job. 

Statistics are pointless- Solskjaer is now also responsible for 21% of all United's home defeats in the Premier League era (29 years is it?) despite also being the third best in their history. 
 

 

 

 

Edited November 7, 2021 by Manxst

[Sima]

7 minutes ago, Ameritoon said:

Without knowing much about Frank or Lage, who both seem to be doing decent jobs this year. Add in whoever Villa get, definitely a good crop of managers.

 

1) Klopp

2) Pep

3) Conte

4) Rafa

5) Tuchel

6) Rodgers

7) Bielsa

8) Moyes

9) Potter

10) Howe

11) Viera

12) Hasenhuttel

13) Dyche

14) Ranieri

15) OGS

16) Frank

17) Arteta

18) Lage

 

 

 

Rafa above Tuchel is madness.

[Ketsbaia]

Solskjaer last, easily.

 

Ranieri, Lage, Frank just above.

 

Guardiola and Tuchel the top two.

[Ameritoon]

3 minutes ago, Sima said:

Rafa above Tuchel is madness.

 

Think he needs one more season of sustained success to jump up. His first 12-18 bigger months at clubs usually go very well before the wheels come off. Seems like he's turned that corner but we'll see.

[Barnes23]

Guardiola, Tuchel, Klopp, Conte in some order followed by Rafa and Bielsa is the obvious top six, imo. The rest is much more up for debate. 

[Sean]

Where do people feel Emery would have sat in this list?

[gazza ladra]

49 minutes ago, Sean said:

Where do people feel Emery would have sat in this list?

Bottom half of the top ten? 

[Froggy]

1) Klopp

2) Conte

3) Pep

4) Tuchel

5) Rodgers

6) Benitez

7) Bielsa

8) Howe

9) OGS

10) Moyes

11) Hasenhuttl

12) Potter

13) Dyche

14) Ranieri

15) Arteta

16) Frank

17) Vieira

18) Lage

 

 

Edited November 8, 2021 by Froggy

[gazza ladra]

Ranieri = opinions differ.

[buzza]

Some real high quality mjanagers in the Prem, great to see but make our task at hand even more difficult.

 

I think Solskaer lets down the top half of the table as he seems really limited tactically.

It has taken Arteta two years to get Arsenal playing decent football with more or less the same players, and Moyes has only just redeemed himself after a couple of up and down years at W Ham.

 

I am praying for a miracle with eddie, but it is going to be a long slog this year with no promise of a happy ending (Prem or Champ?)...

[Joey47]

3 hours ago, Froggy said:

1) Klopp

2) Conte

3) Pep

4) Tuchel

5) Rodgers

6) Benitez

7) Bielsa

8) Howe

9) OGS

10) Moyes

11) Hasenhuttl

12) Potter

13) Dyche

14) Ranieri

15) Arteta

16) Frank

17) Vieira

18) Lage

 

 

 

 

OGS 9th? 

 

Please explain? Genuinely curious.