Steve Bruce (now managing Blackpool)

[Groundhog63]

I'm no oil painting but, dear me, he's a right John Merrick. When did he drive full speed into a wall?

[Thiago]

I'd love a reporter to ask him what his expectations are. He's so quick to blame the club for demanding too much. 

[WarrenBartonCentrePartin]

Wonder how many pancakes he's wolfed down so far today?

[David Edgar]

43 minutes ago, Scoot said:

 

 

He legit started trotting out his old Newcastle excuses.  You can pinpoint the moment his brain caught up and had to change course 

[David Edgar]

"The top end of the..." MASSIVE PAUSE WHILST HIS BRAIN COMPUTES WHAT HE IS SAYING BUT IT IS TOO LATE "... Premier League..."

[Cookie1892]

did he say they had problems with the ball?

[Bishops Finger]

2 minutes ago, Cookie1892 said:

did he say they had problems with the ball?

Yeah, the players have forgot how to kick the fecker through lack of traning

[TRon]

4 minutes ago, Cookie1892 said:

did he say they had problems with the ball?

 

He's always had a great tactical awareness, no surprise to see him pinpointing the problems at West Brom.

[RodneyCisse]

Did Swansea complain about the ball too?

[Keggy_Keagal]

Does any player when the whistle goes to kick off think "hmm let me consider the expectations here " ? Surely it's just "i can get the ball , must win that tackle, he's gonna make a run , so and so is in space there, ouch that hurt , Christ he's big, GOAL !!, no don't give it to him he's shit, the fans are loud here" etc etc

[Nattfare]

 

[Cookie1892]

1 hour ago, Scoot said:

 

he always sounds so down and in the dumps as well, like he's really sad about whats just happened and he is going home to think it over and try and come up with some ideas.

 

When in reality he will shuffle off somewhere via a takeway and be watching netflix till 2am

[Abacus]

1 hour ago, RodneyCisse said:

Did Swansea complain about the ball too?

 

That ball is a nightmare, mind. It's all round so it could go anywhere.

 

How are you supposed to legislate for that?

[Wolfcastle]

2 hours ago, Cookie1892 said:

did he say they had problems with the ball?

 

Foreshadowing the inbound 28% possession.

[huss9]

villa, sunderland, nufc and now wba - all having unrealistic expectaions steve?

[Pandamninator]

Apart from Hull and maaaaaybe Birmingham is there any club with a fanbase that weren't happy to see him fuck off?

[elbee909]

Hiring Bruce and expecting competence - he's right to claim unrealistic expectations.

[St. Maximin]

11 hours ago, Paullow said:

 

Hull fans seemed to like him, and he did OK at Wigan, but yes, the vast majority didn't like him, and certainly the fans of the 3 most high profile jobs that he has had.

I think it was only really Villa when things really turned pear-shaped for him as a manager. He was clearly never a tactician, but whether it was due to luck or ‘good man management’, he did well in the Championship and had some reasonable top flight years too. His win record may be terrible, but you can’t leave the standard of the teams out of that. 
 

I think the game has progressed in recent years while he hasn’t, but I don’t want to be too kind to him - I also think he got to the point where he couldn’t be bothered to take the jobs more seriously and was just happy to pick up a nice salary followed by a nice payoff. No manager who is really dedicated to his job would give the players so many days off training and apparently have sessions where his coaching amounted to saying “let’s play”. 
 

 

[Paullow]

8 minutes ago, St. Maximin said:

I think it was only really Villa when things really turned pear-shaped for him as a manager. He was clearly never a tactician, but whether it was due to luck or ‘good man management’, he did well in the Championship and had some reasonable top flight years too. His win record may be terrible, but you can’t leave the standard of the teams out of that. 
 

I think the game has progressed in recent years while he hasn’t, but I don’t want to be too kind to him - I also think he got to the point where he couldn’t be bothered to take the jobs more seriously and was just happy to pick up a nice salary followed by a nice payoff. No manager who is really dedicated to his job would give the players so many days off training and apparently have sessions where his coaching amounted to saying “let’s play”. 
 

 

 

It didn't go great for him at Sunderland, and that, at the time, was a pretty big job (one of his 3 more higher profile roles along with us and Villa). We had just got back into the Premier League, and as a fan for like 27 years or so (as of now), I think that's the only period where I would consider they had a better squad / team than us - they had a fair bit of investment, had Bent, Gyan, Henderson, Mignolet, Welbeck, Sessegnon, Malbranque and a few other decent players, and in late January 2011 they were 6th in the league, and were only a point off 4th place after 24 games:

 

https://www.11v11.com/league-tables/premier-league/22-january-2011/

 

They then only gained 1 point from their next 9 matches, and going on an infamous / trademark Brucey run. They did win 3 of their final 5 matches, including their last match of the season which, along with us being pegged back from 3-0 to 3-3 at home to WBA, meant they leapfropped us (and a few others) and finished 10th (ya kna) - only their 3rd top 10 finish since the 1955/56 season (that's crazy - 3 top 10 finishes for them in 67 years, and obviously counting).

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010–11_Sunderland_A.F.C._season#Premier_League

 

The season after they only won 2 of their first 13 matches, 11 points, and he was sacked - so in 2011, his league record prior to his sacking was P27 W5 D6 L16 PTS 21 which was awful for the squad they had, and they were massively calling for his head.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011–12_Sunderland_A.F.C._season#Premier_League

[HaydnNUFC]

It stems back further but I think a huge watershed moment for English football was Guardiola being appointed by Man City in 2016. The season before he was there, Leicester won the league and all of the traditional 'top 6' bar Spurs were really shit. (I know Spurs capitulated after Leicester clinched it but 15/16 was good by their standards then) and the top 6 clubs never cantered to wins as much as they do now. Liverpool didn't win the league with 97 points ffs. 

 

There comes a minutiae of good with this though, as England have performed exceptionally well in the last 2 tournaments as opposed to what happened before and English clubs do quite well in the Champions League. 

 

How this comes back to Bruce though, I think Guardiola coming here really shown up how poor this league really was. The managers primarily. And its pushed Bruce's ilk, the has been, PFM, media friendly 'Brexit' manager so far down the pecking line that they don't get jobs in the PL anymore. If not for Ashley no PL club would've touched Bruce. Stints and relegations at WBA have finished off the chances of Allardyce and Pardew of managing in the division again. Mark Hughes since getting the bullet at Stoke and Southampton has only just gotten a job the other week, at League Two Bradford City. Pulis can't get a job for love nor money. Dyche is the only one left that you probably could count in this but I think that's an insult to him; despite that we're competing with Burnley to stay up and the football they play is horrid, he's done a superb job there with limited resources. Has been there for ~10 years and I actually like hearing him speak about football in general as well as the games. (Not including Hodgson here as Watford will probably go down and won't be there beyond this season imo)

 

The managers that are getting appointed now are the German/Austrian gegenpressing, intense football type; the Iberian tiki taka and tactical obssessives and the young(ish) progressive British coaches who are the antithesis of the manager of the 80s, 90s and pre-Guardiola era of the Premier League. Listen to how Potter, Howe, Rodgers and maybe Smith speak to the cameras compared to how Pardew, Allardyce, Holloway and Warnock spoke. These attitudes are reflected in their philosophies and work ethics. It remains to be seen whether Lampard and Gerrard will be the new era type of PFM or type of manager that is always talked up or defended in the media for jobs by their mates.

 

Bottom line is, football in this country has moved on miles in the space of less than a decade. And moved lightyears past Bruce, and his kind. He simply shouldn't be getting touched with a barge pole by any club worth their salt at a decent level.

 

 

Edited March 2, 2022 by HaydnNUFC

[Yorkie]

Great post. 

[Izakaya]

26 minutes ago, HaydnNUFC said:

It stems back further but I think a huge watershed moment for English football was Guardiola being appointed by Man City in 2016. The season before he was there, Leicester won the league and all of the traditional 'top 6' bar Spurs were really shit. (I know Spurs capitulated after Leicester clinched it but 15/16 was good by their standards then) and the top 6 clubs never cantered to wins as much as they do now. Liverpool didn't win the league with 97 points ffs. 

 

There comes a minutiae of good with this though, as England have performed exceptionally well in the last 2 tournaments as opposed to what happened before and English clubs do quite well in the Champions League. 

 

How this comes back to Bruce though, I think Guardiola coming here really shown up how poor this league really was. The managers primarily. And its pushed Bruce's ilk, the has been, PFM, media friendly 'Brexit' manager so far down the pecking line that they don't get jobs in the PL anymore. If not for Ashley no PL club would've touched Bruce. Stints and relegations at WBA have finished off the chances of Allardyce and Pardew of managing in the division again. Mark Hughes since getting the bullet at Stoke and Southampton has only just gotten a job the other week, at League Two Bradford City. Pulis can't get a job for love nor money. Dyche is the only one left that you probably could count in this but I think that's an insult to him; despite that we're competing with Burnley to stay up and the football they play is horrid, he's done a superb job there with limited resources. Has been there for ~10 years and I actually like hearing him speak about football in general as well as the games. (Not including Hodgson here as Watford will probably go down and won't be there beyond this season imo)

 

The managers that are getting appointed now are the German/Austrian gegenpressing, intense football type; the Iberian tiki taka and tactical obssessives and the young(ish) progressive British coaches who are the antithesis of the manager of the 80s, 90s and pre-Guardiola era of the Premier League. Listen to how Potter, Howe, Rodgers and maybe Smith speak to the cameras compared to how Pardew, Allardyce, Holloway and Warnock spoke. These attitudes are reflected in their philosophies and work ethics. It remains to be seen whether Lampard and Gerrard will be the new era type of PFM or type of manager that is always talked up or defended in the media for jobs by their mates.

 

Bottom line is, football in this country has moved on miles in the space of less than a decade. And moved lightyears past Bruce, and his kind. He simply shouldn't be getting touched with a barge pole by any club worth their salt at a decent level.

 

 

 

Great post 

[Emotic]

1 hour ago, HaydnNUFC said:

It stems back further but I think a huge watershed moment for English football was Guardiola being appointed by Man City in 2016. The season before he was there, Leicester won the league and all of the traditional 'top 6' bar Spurs were really shit. (I know Spurs capitulated after Leicester clinched it but 15/16 was good by their standards then) and the top 6 clubs never cantered to wins as much as they do now. Liverpool didn't win the league with 97 points ffs. 

 

There comes a minutiae of good with this though, as England have performed exceptionally well in the last 2 tournaments as opposed to what happened before and English clubs do quite well in the Champions League. 

 

How this comes back to Bruce though, I think Guardiola coming here really shown up how poor this league really was. The managers primarily. And its pushed Bruce's ilk, the has been, PFM, media friendly 'Brexit' manager so far down the pecking line that they don't get jobs in the PL anymore. If not for Ashley no PL club would've touched Bruce. Stints and relegations at WBA have finished off the chances of Allardyce and Pardew of managing in the division again. Mark Hughes since getting the bullet at Stoke and Southampton has only just gotten a job the other week, at League Two Bradford City. Pulis can't get a job for love nor money. Dyche is the only one left that you probably could count in this but I think that's an insult to him; despite that we're competing with Burnley to stay up and the football they play is horrid, he's done a superb job there with limited resources. Has been there for ~10 years and I actually like hearing him speak about football in general as well as the games. (Not including Hodgson here as Watford will probably go down and won't be there beyond this season imo)

 

The managers that are getting appointed now are the German/Austrian gegenpressing, intense football type; the Iberian tiki taka and tactical obssessives and the young(ish) progressive British coaches who are the antithesis of the manager of the 80s, 90s and pre-Guardiola era of the Premier League. Listen to how Potter, Howe, Rodgers and maybe Smith speak to the cameras compared to how Pardew, Allardyce, Holloway and Warnock spoke. These attitudes are reflected in their philosophies and work ethics. It remains to be seen whether Lampard and Gerrard will be the new era type of PFM or type of manager that is always talked up or defended in the media for jobs by their mates.

 

Bottom line is, football in this country has moved on miles in the space of less than a decade. And moved lightyears past Bruce, and his kind. He simply shouldn't be getting touched with a barge pole by any club worth their salt at a decent level.

 

 

 

Superb post, and it makes me all the more bemused and excited that we had transitioned from an 80s PFM dinosaur to a modern, progressive coach practically overnight and are reaping the dividends.

[Thiago]

1 hour ago, HaydnNUFC said:

It stems back further but I think a huge watershed moment for English football was Guardiola being appointed by Man City in 2016. The season before he was there, Leicester won the league and all of the traditional 'top 6' bar Spurs were really shit. (I know Spurs capitulated after Leicester clinched it but 15/16 was good by their standards then) and the top 6 clubs never cantered to wins as much as they do now. Liverpool didn't win the league with 97 points ffs. 

 

There comes a minutiae of good with this though, as England have performed exceptionally well in the last 2 tournaments as opposed to what happened before and English clubs do quite well in the Champions League. 

 

How this comes back to Bruce though, I think Guardiola coming here really shown up how poor this league really was. The managers primarily. And its pushed Bruce's ilk, the has been, PFM, media friendly 'Brexit' manager so far down the pecking line that they don't get jobs in the PL anymore. If not for Ashley no PL club would've touched Bruce. Stints and relegations at WBA have finished off the chances of Allardyce and Pardew of managing in the division again. Mark Hughes since getting the bullet at Stoke and Southampton has only just gotten a job the other week, at League Two Bradford City. Pulis can't get a job for love nor money. Dyche is the only one left that you probably could count in this but I think that's an insult to him; despite that we're competing with Burnley to stay up and the football they play is horrid, he's done a superb job there with limited resources. Has been there for ~10 years and I actually like hearing him speak about football in general as well as the games. (Not including Hodgson here as Watford will probably go down and won't be there beyond this season imo)

 

The managers that are getting appointed now are the German/Austrian gegenpressing, intense football type; the Iberian tiki taka and tactical obssessives and the young(ish) progressive British coaches who are the antithesis of the manager of the 80s, 90s and pre-Guardiola era of the Premier League. Listen to how Potter, Howe, Rodgers and maybe Smith speak to the cameras compared to how Pardew, Allardyce, Holloway and Warnock spoke. These attitudes are reflected in their philosophies and work ethics. It remains to be seen whether Lampard and Gerrard will be the new era type of PFM or type of manager that is always talked up or defended in the media for jobs by their mates.

 

Bottom line is, football in this country has moved on miles in the space of less than a decade. And moved lightyears past Bruce, and his kind. He simply shouldn't be getting touched with a barge pole by any club worth their salt at a decent level.

 

 

 

Very good post. 

 

Interestingly, running parallel to this I think the EFL is becoming something of a 'coaching incubator'.

 

You have the older PFM types you mention, the journeymen types, but also the likes of Russell Martin, Steve Cooper, Liam Manning, and Neil Critchley aligning more with that modern, hard-working, category you outline. It certainly did Howe no trouble that he had a foundation of almost 300 EFL games by the time he came to the Premier League. I do think the notion of coaches walking into positions and bluffing their way through it due to earned respect as a player is all but over. You need some strategy. 

[cubaricho]

 

2 hours ago, HaydnNUFC said:

It remains to be seen whether Lampard and Gerrard will be the new era type of PFM or type of manager that is always talked up or defended in the media for jobs by their mates.

Great post dude.
 

On this point though, I genuinely believe they’ll be in the mould of the 80s/90s/PFMs because that is what inspired them during their careers. It’ll be the Howes/Potters of the world who didn’t reach the professional heights the aforementioned dudes did and said fuck this and became actual students of the game that buck the trend of the British PFMs, not Gerrard or Lampard, who will get found out with relative ease and (hopefully!) moved on quicker than the Pardew/Bruce/Allardyce dinosaurs of the past were.

 

 

Edited March 2, 2022 by cubaricho