STM Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 Tongue in cheek, man. Wiki is hardly as reliable as the Bible, is it? Yeah, 'cos that thing is fact-filled, isn't it? There both a load of shite to be honest. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 Tongue in cheek, man. Wiki is hardly as reliable as the Bible, is it? Yeah, 'cos that thing is fact-filled, isn't it? Two for the price of one. Easy pickings on here today, like! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 http://www.rayyanclub.com/view.asp?id=79433 Looks like he is doing his Bramble impression in that picture. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NE5 Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 NE5, I fear you've just dug yourself a hole that is going to be fairly hard to climb out of. On Ashley not spending his "own" money... What if the club has no money, though? We finished 14th, we have not qualified for Europe, our wage bill is astronomical, the season tickets have not all been sold. If this was Freddy Shepherd in control on July 30th 2007 and we'd brought in Viduka, Geremi, Barton and Rozehnal for the players (wasters) that we released/sold am I completely "wide of the mark" in thinking you'd currently be defending him to the hilt? Now, I do understand that in this alternate universe some of the same people who are defending the new board might well be castigating Freddy by now, despite there being 32 days of the transfer window remaining. I know it's not just you in this ongoing "Shepherd" thing, it takes more than one to tango, but hear me out. Why is it so different now that it is Mike Ashley and Chris Mort running the club? Apparently, none of you have "agendas" for/against the previous board (hoho), but would I be entirely wrong to say that today, if Shepherd was still here, that some of you in this debate would be doing exactly the same as you are now, albeit on opposite sides of the divide? If Shepherd was still here and there was no money left in the coffers because of Souness or whoever would you be currently complaining about the board not backing the manager? What makes it so different now, if you don't want Ashley to spend his own money? Surely if it is purely club money that we're talking about then Mort/Ashley cannot be blamed for not offering the manager anything? Or should they take out more loans/get a bigger overdraft/accumulate more debt in order to give Sam Allardyce the money that he wants? Surely this would have been Freddy's only option? Him not being as "rich" as Mike Ashley, and all. Personally I do expect Ashley to put his own money into the club, and I'm damn sure the majority of this message board expect exactly the same, even if it's just money to clear the debts and make us self-sufficient in the longterm. As ohmelads has said to me, and as I've said elsewhere, none of us know the ramifications of the takeover or the current financial issues that the club is operating with. Not completely, at least. To me it seems like you're using this to lampoon the new owner where, if Shepherd were still here, you'd be praising him to the hilt for already have brought in 4 good-looking players to replace players who some I know for a fact you weren't overly keen on (Parker, Bramble) while still actively looking at bringing in MORE players (which we are currently doing). I understand that you're attempting to play devil's advocate here, but I can't help but feel you've played your hand far too early and have defeated yourself with your latest post. I know you do want what's best for this club at heart, you always have, but this crusade you seem to be on regarding the new takeover isn't doing you any favours, especially when you've got barely any evidence to back it up aside from what Big Sam has been saying in the media. Like Nut said, it makes more sense to discuss this on September 1st, but this "it's different this summer" nonsense is not going to fly, because if it IS different it's worse, not better, especially where club finances are concerned (not taking Ashley's own money into account, like you said yourself you won't do.) I can't see your point, and I can't see where you can talk about a "crusade", because from where I'm sitting, the only people on a "crusade" are those who simply cannot give the old board any credit for anything. A prime example is Mick, and his stupid comment about Arsprilla scoring 4 goals which make him a successful buy for the club. He quite simply just can't bring himself to admit that all the facts I have put forward about Arsprilla are correct. He and others have all taken a similar line with regard to Shepherd, especially macbeth. Now if you want someone on a crusade ...... I have stated facts, right from day 1. The old board have left the club massively better off than when they found it. In every single way. People are harping on about the last 3 years. I know as much as anyone that in the last 3 years they lost their way, but for the first 12 years people were quite happy with the club although we all would have liked to win a trophy. They have however finished their time appointing a manager who I believe would put us back among the top teams again. Some you win, some you don't, thats football. The board have done their jobs by providing the managers with the resources to put teams together to qualify for europe etc, and reach 2 Cup Finals. The buck stops there though. The blame for a dismal performance on the day, and many other completely bottled situations, rests with the players. It is also true that no person who holds a major shareholding in a major multi million pound company, lets another person with less shares make the single most important decisions of the business. Please tell me what sort of "crusade" this is, by simply pointing it out, and why you don't think the people who actually think that this IS the case aren't on some sort of "crusade", because it sure as hell doesn't make any sense. I completely agree that September 1st is the time to panic, or even January 31st if you like, but you can't help but feel worried when the best manager we have had for quite some time is telling us all he is unhappy with his employers. He obviously knows something that we do not, wouldn't you agree ? As it happens, I think because of Allardyce, we should do better than last year, but I recognise that we could do a lot better if he is backed by the board, and I fear a situation where we could lose a good manager unless he is ? Do you understand this, I've seen it before, and recognise the signs. Cox and Lee both said things like Allardyce is saying, and nobody ever said that under the Halls and Shepherd. You can accuse me of having an "agenda" by pointing this out if you like, but its true. I think if they are truly ambitious, they wouldn't give a rats arse about another 10 million quid, if it means the difference between getting back into europe at the first attempt, and not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERTOON Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 In other news we have had a bid for Alan Smith accepted Can he play LB or CB Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
eggybread Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 In other news we have had a bid for Alan Smith accepted says who? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pantu Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 In other news we have had a bid for Alan Smith accepted Can he play LB or CB What fucking planet are you on? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERTOON Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 Link http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/0400evertonfc/0100news/tm_headline=everton-face-fight-to-land-alan-smith%26method=full%26objectid=19542834%26siteid=50061-name_page.html Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guinness Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 In other news we have had a bid for Alan Smith accepted Can he play LB or CB EDIT: seen link. Don't believe it, we're hardly short in the striking department. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
relámpago blanco Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 In other news we have had a bid for Alan Smith accepted Can he play LB or CB What f****** planet are you on? Well he's not a very good striker or midfielder so maybe his best position is at the back. Only time will tell. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggio Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 Penny pinching in defence again. Will this club ever learn? Looking at the defence we put out against Juventus I think it'd be an understatement to say we need some investment in that area. If you believe we're targetting freebies purely because they're the right people for the job then good for you, but I think it's because the money isn't there and we're getting whatever we can, a view backed up by practically all of Allardyce's comments over the last couple of weeks ("can't guarantee quality but ill get some numbers in", "targets are disappearing rapidly", "missed out on loads of players recently", "clubs like fulham are spending much more than us", "I need to convince the new owners to spend and quickly" etc etc etc). Fair enough, but you've yet again completely ignored the relevant points that numerous people have made about the very recent takeover, the club's debt, the difficulty we might be having attracting players, etc. It's a waste of time looking at things on such a simplistic level, man. Ashley de-listed the club 12 days ago and alright, we might not have money in the immediate short-term while this infamous "review" is undertaken and while things are sorted out from top-to-bottom (I notice the board are backing Allardyce's backroom rebuilding plans, which won't be exactly "cheap" and which people seem to completely be ignoring while they claim he's going to be forced out.) Where is it written that you absolutely positively need to spend big, solid money to do well/build a solid foundation? Surely you can appreciate it that it might take more than 12 days (or a month or two at the most since they started buying shares/taking full control) to come in and decided what route to take a multi-million pound business. As Gemmill said, it's unfortunate that it's happened in the summer and it's perhaps "unfortunate" that the likes of Man City don't seem to be suffering the same problems, but perhaps they're not doing things the right way and we are. How many of us were calling for a massive upheaval at this football club just a few short months ago? Well we're getting it and people still aren't f****** happy because we're not doing that AND spending millions at the same time. Beggars belief and shows us up as supporters. Call it simplistic if you want but it's equally simplistic to assume more money couldn't have been provided, or to assume that we haven't signed players simply because none want to come to Newcastle. Cheap dig tbh. I haven't ignored the points made about the takeover or the club's debt, I've chosen to comment on actual quotes from the manager and facts such as the minimal spending on defence which goes back years at this club and the very limited options we have less than 2 weeks before the season's opener. I didn't say we need to spend big. Apologies if you think a bit of healthy scepticism shows you up as a supporter. I'll be as happy as the next man if I see us signing good defenders, but making excuses for the board without knowing any of the circumstances is pointless IMO. Agree with this, not spending on defenders will just push us further behind. But we are going to buy defenders. Mort, Ashley and Sam aren't stupid enough to let this window close without us at least getting the numbers in. It's a myth that you need to spend big on defenders though. Look at Rozehnal (so far). If he keeps it up it's a hell of a buy for peanuts. Agreed. I think there is alot of worrying going on a little to early. Obviously we need defenders but if there is anyone who i trust to get them in it is Allardyce, money or no money. Nothing worse than blind faith, you sound as bad as the Villa fans with their "MON the saviour" bollocks. Yes there is, consistent pessimism. Your getting all hot and bothered because we kick off in two weeks and we haven't got a left back in yet. How many times has he come out and said we need new defenders? Yet for some reason you think your complaints stand out above everyone elses and are making a difference. He knows his football, he also knows about the problems that our club has. So why not let him get on with his job FFS. When we kick off then you can up your complaints. There's a difference between getting anyone in to make up the numbers and getting someone in who's a big improvement on Babayaro, which is what we should be aiming for. You came out with a quote yesterday like "In Sam I trust" like you're some kind of f****** sheep with no opinion of your own. Sheep? Making insults towards people you don't know? Okay mate. I trust Sam Allardyce. Nothing wrong with that is there? He's a good manager and he knows the problems we have. No opinion of my own? Whats that got to do with anything? I have many opinions just clearly you just don't agree with them. In future when someone disagrees with you try debating it instead of an attempt to start mindless arguements. We both want this club to succeed don't we? How can you have a debate with someone who's opinion consists of "In Sam I trust"? Basically your only opinion is that you're happy to follow Allardyce in whatever he does without questioning him or the way he does things. Brummie on here made one of the best comments on the subject I've seen in a while... "Faith is excellent, blind faith is naive and dangerous, and that, for me, is why we need to maintain this healthy scepticism."...He's spot on too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
eggybread Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 hope that link is correct and smith wants to go to evrton as he is dog S*** Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERTOON Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 Maybe after realising that Smith doesnt score or create he will do a job at the back. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggio Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 If we have got money and Allardyce is going to spunk it on Smith then he's a arsehole tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STM Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 Penny pinching in defence again. Will this club ever learn? Looking at the defence we put out against Juventus I think it'd be an understatement to say we need some investment in that area. If you believe we're targetting freebies purely because they're the right people for the job then good for you, but I think it's because the money isn't there and we're getting whatever we can, a view backed up by practically all of Allardyce's comments over the last couple of weeks ("can't guarantee quality but ill get some numbers in", "targets are disappearing rapidly", "missed out on loads of players recently", "clubs like fulham are spending much more than us", "I need to convince the new owners to spend and quickly" etc etc etc). Fair enough, but you've yet again completely ignored the relevant points that numerous people have made about the very recent takeover, the club's debt, the difficulty we might be having attracting players, etc. It's a waste of time looking at things on such a simplistic level, man. Ashley de-listed the club 12 days ago and alright, we might not have money in the immediate short-term while this infamous "review" is undertaken and while things are sorted out from top-to-bottom (I notice the board are backing Allardyce's backroom rebuilding plans, which won't be exactly "cheap" and which people seem to completely be ignoring while they claim he's going to be forced out.) Where is it written that you absolutely positively need to spend big, solid money to do well/build a solid foundation? Surely you can appreciate it that it might take more than 12 days (or a month or two at the most since they started buying shares/taking full control) to come in and decided what route to take a multi-million pound business. As Gemmill said, it's unfortunate that it's happened in the summer and it's perhaps "unfortunate" that the likes of Man City don't seem to be suffering the same problems, but perhaps they're not doing things the right way and we are. How many of us were calling for a massive upheaval at this football club just a few short months ago? Well we're getting it and people still aren't f****** happy because we're not doing that AND spending millions at the same time. Beggars belief and shows us up as supporters. Call it simplistic if you want but it's equally simplistic to assume more money couldn't have been provided, or to assume that we haven't signed players simply because none want to come to Newcastle. Cheap dig tbh. I haven't ignored the points made about the takeover or the club's debt, I've chosen to comment on actual quotes from the manager and facts such as the minimal spending on defence which goes back years at this club and the very limited options we have less than 2 weeks before the season's opener. I didn't say we need to spend big. Apologies if you think a bit of healthy scepticism shows you up as a supporter. I'll be as happy as the next man if I see us signing good defenders, but making excuses for the board without knowing any of the circumstances is pointless IMO. Agree with this, not spending on defenders will just push us further behind. But we are going to buy defenders. Mort, Ashley and Sam aren't stupid enough to let this window close without us at least getting the numbers in. It's a myth that you need to spend big on defenders though. Look at Rozehnal (so far). If he keeps it up it's a hell of a buy for peanuts. Agreed. I think there is alot of worrying going on a little to early. Obviously we need defenders but if there is anyone who i trust to get them in it is Allardyce, money or no money. Nothing worse than blind faith, you sound as bad as the Villa fans with their "MON the saviour" bollocks. Yes there is, consistent pessimism. Your getting all hot and bothered because we kick off in two weeks and we haven't got a left back in yet. How many times has he come out and said we need new defenders? Yet for some reason you think your complaints stand out above everyone elses and are making a difference. He knows his football, he also knows about the problems that our club has. So why not let him get on with his job FFS. When we kick off then you can up your complaints. There's a difference between getting anyone in to make up the numbers and getting someone in who's a big improvement on Babayaro, which is what we should be aiming for. You came out with a quote yesterday like "In Sam I trust" like you're some kind of f****** sheep with no opinion of your own. Sheep? Making insults towards people you don't know? Okay mate. I trust Sam Allardyce. Nothing wrong with that is there? He's a good manager and he knows the problems we have. No opinion of my own? Whats that got to do with anything? I have many opinions just clearly you just don't agree with them. In future when someone disagrees with you try debating it instead of an attempt to start mindless arguements. We both want this club to succeed don't we? How can you have a debate with someone who's opinion consists of "In Sam I trust"? Basically your only opinion is that you're happy to follow Allardyce in whatever he does without questioning him or the way he does things. Brummie on here made one of the best comments on the subject I've seen in a while... "Faith is excellent, blind faith is naive and dangerous, and that, for me, is why we need to maintain this healthy scepticism."...He's spot on too. First of all, the only thing that i have stated is that i trust Sam Allardyce, correct? No more no less. Now if your telling me that i'm wrong in that trust then okay. Your fully entitled to question my judgement. However, what your saying is that i have "blind faith" in Sam Allardyce, implying that i think he can do no wrong. Not once have i stated that i think this, therefore you have made a poor assumption. I could go into much detail about what i think he could improve on and what he could have done better so far. Would you agree that he has a good record in transfer window? It's because of this and the fact he has pointed out our defensive deficiancies on many occasions that i believe he will get the right people in. If you disagree thats no problem to me, just don't assume that i have "blind faith" in him as a manager. 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Pantu Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 In other news we have had a bid for Alan Smith accepted Can he play LB or CB What f****** planet are you on? Well he's not a very good striker or midfielder so maybe his best position is at the back. Only time will tell. The gratuitously harsh jibe was mainly aimed at the fact that the story is probably a load of shit, and secondly because there is no way any manager in their right mind would dream of risking an average striker and failed holding midfielder as a full back or center half. Just because he is agressive and a supposed hard-man does not mean he would even be a remotely decent defender. A terrible, terrible idea Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Pie Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 Leazes, just to stop my toes curling, I'll happily donate a tenner to MacMillan charity if you stop putting that extra R in Asprilla. The old board did well enough but they fucked up a fair bit too. It became apparent that they werent able to take the club any further. The appointments of Roeder and Souness were as laughable as the treatment of SBR. It isnt as dichotomous as you make out. People are able to see both sides. It would be sad not too. Just as you are myopic at times with their fuck ups others take the other stance. Its not like that for many people - they can see both sides. They did ok, but we needed a bigger backer. Even Freddie acknowledges that. If Ashley isnt the answer then fair enough, what is certain is that Freddie couldnt compete with the owners of other clubs of similar size without putting the club in deep shit. Our turnover to wages ratio was becoming a joke. If Mort wants that sorting then there are two ways of doing it. Boost turnover - which he probably has done as season tickets appear to be a lot healthier than they looked likely to be with Freddie in charge. It is speculation that that is the case, of course. However, in my view the optimism (misguided or not) from the takeover sparked a few sales. The other way is to pay wages commensurate with a players ability rather than daft figures that put players in the comfort zone (Marcelino, Luque etc) and subsequently are hard to shift. Only time will tell but SJH seems confident enough and he was a fella who actually did well for consistently whilst taking responsibility for the running of the club. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 So ... does anyone have any tangible evidence that Cacapa has signed for Al-Rayyan? Or will he be in black and white by Friday? Wiki says he has... Wiki sucks! By the way dude ... I admire your patience, but I think you have to accept that some people would rather be negative about things and the more you try to convince them there is no real reason to be yet, the more they negative they get! One main thing has stood out to me regarding our pursuit of defenders. Sam says he wanted prem experienced defenders. In my opinion this has been the focus and I think we have been spending too much of our time trying to secure players who have experience in our league, which is usually very complicated as teams are likely to be less likely to want to give up good players to their rivals. They are no doubt being over priced as you only have to see what has been going on in the transfer market. In the odd occassion where they are likely to be reasonably priced, for example with defenders the top clubs don't want i.s. Man U's heinze and Silvestre they have decided not to come. I really think this has been the min problem and now we are only beginning to look at our foreign options. I think it is very likely that if we are going to be buying defenders from abroad, Sam will look for players that are not expensive but have the potential to be very good for us. Similar to the deal to bring Rozehnal in. There are absolutely no guarantees with foreign defenders so at this moment in time we cannot afford to spend £10 million on a defender from abroad I don't think. Especially, as we have no stability in the position at the moment. Lads just coolrelax it will all be fine. I am expecting at least three defenders in by this time next week, and then we will tie up another 3 players in different areas of the squad and it's showtime. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeletor Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 So ... does anyone have any tangible evidence that Cacapa has signed for Al-Rayyan? Or will he be in black and white by Friday? Wiki says he has... Wiki sucks! By the way dude ... I admire your patience, but I think you have to accept that some people would rather be negative about things and the more you try to convince them there is no real reason to be yet, the more they negative they get! One main thing has stood out to me regarding our pursuit of defenders. Sam says he wanted prem experienced defenders. In my opinion this has been the focus and I think we have been spending too much of our time trying to secure players who have experience in our league, which is usually very complicated as teams are likely to be less likely to want to give up good players to their rivals. They are no doubt being over priced as you only have to see what has been going on in the transfer market. In the odd occassion where they are likely to be reasonably priced, for example with defenders the top clubs don't want i.s. Man U's heinze and Silvestre they have decided not to come. I really think this has been the min problem and now we are only beginning to look at our foreign options. I think it is very likely that if we are going to be buying defenders from abroad, Sam will look for players that are not expensive but have the potential to be very good for us. Similar to the deal to bring Rozehnal in. There are absolutely no guarantees with foreign defenders so at this moment in time we cannot afford to spend £10 million on a defender from abroad I don't think. Especially, as we have no stability in the position at the moment. Lads just coolrelax it will all be fine. I am expecting at least three defenders in by this time next week, and then we will tie up another 3 players in different areas of the squad and it's showtime. I'll relax when we have a dependable, solid defence (and that includes back ups) rather than the nothing that we have right now with 2 weeks to go. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 NE5, howay man, as far as I can see that was a marvelous job you just did of skirting the real issue/shifting the blame onto others (who I'd already mentioned in my original reply to you - I do realise you're not the only one with an apparent "agenda"/what appears to others as an "agenda".) Being a gent, I'll actually reply to what you say though, makes for good debate you see? As far as I can see Big Sam is frustrated with the takeover more than anything, because after this "rip roaring" start we were all so enthused about things seem to have fallen a little bit flat after Ashley has got a firm grip over the club and taken us off the market. Whether this situation is short-term (as I'm inclined to agree) or long-term remains to be seen, but I'm of the opinion that you're not going to shell out £130M on a football club and take on a rumoured £80M debt unless you want to get some money back out of it, or at least raise your public profile, or something. So the personal investment will probably come, which is where we would have been lacking had Shepherd stayed (either yourself or HTL agreed with me a while back about the worry of "falling behind" these clubs with "new money" under Shepherd and Co.) None of us know the reasons and you're completely valid in your concerns about them not "knowing the game" - concerns I share with you - but concerns that again will be short-term while Mort gets to grips with the job, aided by Allardyce - who we both seem to agree was a fantastic appointment by the previous board who unfortunately came a few years too late, much like Bobby Robson. But at least Shepherd got his man eventually - and yes, he SHOULD be backed, but not to the point of financial problems - like we were heading towards under the old regime. Like I've said, I think you're worrying too early, it's only bloody July and they've had full and unmitigated control for less than 12 full days. It's asking a lot... and we don't even know that there's no money there. Only last week Allardyce was quoted as saying there were "lots of bids in for players" and various deals hadn't worked out, etc. so we are actively moving in the market and more money is going to be spent on transfer fees and wages. We should also not forget that Mort and Ashley are funding Allardyce's backroom plans - much like Shepherd also promised - and that we are still "poaching" staff from clubs to make up his "team" behind the scenes. None of which will be coming cheap and all of which points to "backing the manager". If they really wanted to squeeze Big Sam they would not be building him this "war room" or bankrolling his recruitment drive, would they? This is all stuff that they are definitely doing for him, as it's come from the horse's mouth. You and Baggio are correct in addressing this apparent "blind faith" amongst some on here about "anyone being better than Shepherd", when it could well be proven to be very, very far from the actual truth. But as I've said, I think you've blown your wad somewhat by getting onto the back of the new board merely 12 days after the de-listing of the football club and harmed your credibility on this issue because of it. You've just agreed there though that we "can" panic on September 1st if things turn out as badly as they did last summer, which is fair enough on your part. As for the £10M quid comment, for all we know it could be there, as I've said we don't know what's available and there is as much media evidence both from internal AND external sources to say that Big Sam will be backed than there is to say that he won't. He's criticised them for moving slowly and missing targets but has he actually said they aren't providing him the money to pursue people? The last I saw from him he said he picks the names and Mort does the negotiating, he has not been set any price restrictions. You're already saying we'll lose Allardyce because of the new board, 12 days into their full reign, which is grossly unfair on people who are admittedly brand-new to the football business. That's all the ammo you have, though, at this moment in time - the only stick you currently have to beat Mike Ashley and Chris Mort with is the fact that they aren't experienced at running a football club. I mentioned earlier the potential need for Shepherd staying on, or Dein coming in (which they tried to do, apparently) or a DOF being brought in to bridge the "gap" between manager and board (if there is one), but you completely ignored it and stuck "on message." Basically, I appreciate why you have the concerns you do, but I feel you've been a bit hasty in airing them. I also strongly believe you'd be on exactly the opposite side of the fence if Shepherd was still in control, while the likes of Mick would probably be slating the former chairman at this stage in proceedings while you did the whole "32 days left" line that I've been pulling. You'll probably both deny it, but from what I've seen I'd wager a lot on that being the case. That was the point of my last post and that is why it appears to people on the "outside" that you both have agendas for/against the previous Chairman. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NE5 Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 Leazes, just to stop my toes curling, I'll happily donate a tenner to MacMillan charity if you stop putting that extra R in Asprilla. The old board did well enough but they fucked up a fair bit too. It became apparent that they werent able to take the club any further. The appointments of Roeder and Souness were as laughable as the treatment of SBR. It isnt as dichotomous as you make out. People are able to see both sides. It would be sad not too. Just as you are myopic at times with their fuck ups others take the other stance. Its not like that for many people - they can see both sides. They did ok, but we needed a bigger backer. Even Freddie acknowledges that. If Ashley isnt the answer then fair enough, what is certain is that Freddie couldnt compete with the owners of other clubs of similar size without putting the club in deep shit. Our turnover to wages ratio was becoming a joke. If Mort wants that sorting then there are two ways of doing it. Boost turnover - which he probably has done as season tickets appear to be a lot healthier than they looked likely to be with Freddie in charge. It is speculation that that is the case, of course. However, in my view the optimism (misguided or not) from the takeover sparked a few sales. The other way is to pay wages commensurate with a players ability rather than daft figures that put players in the comfort zone (Marcelino, Luque etc) and subsequently are hard to shift. Only time will tell but SJH seems confident enough and he was a fella who actually did well for consistently whilst taking responsibility for the running of the club. If that wasn't a fairly sensible post that I can agree with, I would say that there are only one or two people who post using such words as you do on toontastic ie the ones in bold. It's a football message board, not a University Challenge one, I can see you're a clever lad but its feeling the need to show it to everyone else which is fantastically amusing. I put the "r" in Asprilla, simply because he's an Ars[e], and I quite like it, because I think he is a showboater, and a shit professional. Sadly bought by Keegan, which shows that even the best managers make mistakes, like everyone in life. I don't subscribe to the view that he single handedly cost us the title, there were other reasons for that alongside accomodating him into the team that did that. I agree that a new backer is good for the club, that is why I sold my shares to a single owner who could absorb the stadium debt and delist the club, but only if he actually backs it, or should I say his manager. Your point about wages boils down to backing the manager. You have to trust his judgement. If he wants the player, you pay the wages and the transfer fee if you can afford it. If the manager is shite, as in Souness' case, then you make mistakes. And as for appointing Souness being a major balls up, there is absolutely no way in the world that anyone can guarantee Ashley, or any chairman at any club anywhere, wouldn't make a similar balls up. They all do it. And if you DON'T pay the transfer fees, or the wages, then the player will go somewhere else. If we refuse to pay the going rate, we will lose the players the manager wants, and if we lose the players he wants - providing his judgement is good - you can wave goodbye to the Champions League. I am aware the Chelsea and ManU can blow everybody away in this respect, but you still have to do your best to match them. Too many players for 2 and 3m quid are no good for a club like us. You only get so many bargains, in the end, the quality just won't be good enough. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
toptoon Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 Link http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/0400evertonfc/0100news/tm_headline=everton-face-fight-to-land-alan-smith%26method=full%26objectid=19542834%26siteid=50061-name_page.html If true (it looks like it is atm) then it kinda blows a big hole in any of the guys on here saying that BS has no money to spend. Also striker is the department where we are best stocked at the moment, unless he fancies him in CM? This potential signing makes no sense to me when we are so unbelievably desperate for defenders. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Pie Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 Link http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/0400evertonfc/0100news/tm_headline=everton-face-fight-to-land-alan-smith%26method=full%26objectid=19542834%26siteid=50061-name_page.html If true (it looks like it is atm) then it kinda blows a big hole in any of the guys on here saying that BS has no money to spend. Also striker is the department where we are best stocked at the moment, unless he fancies him in CM? This potential signing makes no sense to me when we are so unbelievably desperate for defenders. Well we are light in central midfield and the injuries our forward line tend to have makes him a decent squad player. Disappointed if we aim to build a side around him as I don't think he has that quality. In the circumstances I would still like to see 4 faces at the back and another 2 or 3 in midfield. Doubt that will happen though. Of course we need other areas sorting but we cant afford to leave other areas (like central midfield) in the hands of the bairns next season. At present we have very little there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menace Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 Bramble back on a free. Nailed on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STM Posted July 30, 2007 Share Posted July 30, 2007 IF we are after smith for 6m then it makes me think Allardyce would rather go into the season without more faces in defence if there not good enough. I wouldn't be suprised if it turned out we are getting smith on the cheap. 6m just doesn't make sense. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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