merlin

...and that would be another NUFC mistake. I agree that it MAY be necessary to replace him with a TOP proven striker, but you don't get 'bargains' with those - any bargains tend to be like Lovenkrands - players who have been OK at a lower level(i.e.Scottish Prem), but will not hack it in the Prem. If Carroll could get 12-15 goals in the Prem it would be a definite success for the first season back ; any less than 10 and I would ask questions about his future provided he was given a fair number of games. Either way, we WILL need another,proven striker.

Carroll has the potential to be a much more effective striker than anyone at the club. Apart from Ameobi's fitness problems, he is nowhere near the physical threat that Carroll offers defenders. As he is now 28, Ameobi has only one way to go, whereas Carroll could become an England regular in a few years IF - IF he applies himself to developing his full potential. Even Rob Stewart in the Telegraph thought that Carroll could have a big future... Lovenkrands is a short-term fix, nothing more, nothing less ; he HAS done better than I expected on the goals front but he too is at, or past, his peak. He will not be a threat in the Prem and will be a squad player. Carroll could save the club a lot of money in the transfer market but as I said, there is a big question mark over whether he will continue to develop. Even if he does, we will still need a player to play off/with him because`neither of the others are the answer at a higher level.

I said some months ago that slagging off Carroll was premature - and so it is. So, too, is unduly praising him because he has off-field issues(which will hopefully get less as he assumes a degree of maturity), and he needs to work harder at his control and hold-up play. Nevertheless, he took his goals really well tonight and he has become a regular scorer now so he IS showing progress. His physical ability to dominate defenders will be very useful if he can maintain his improvements in the Prem because he could be a real handful. A great header for the first goal and showed composure, skill and(unusually)pace to score the second. He is the best prospect as a forward that we have brought through the ranks for years - maybe even since Pop Robson emerged in the late 60s. A great pity that Pop's Father-in-law, Lennie Hepple, is not now able to pass on his balance coaching to Carroll, because it would improve him in many areas of his game. If he fulfills his potential, we will have people from top clubs knocking on the door....

NO.

As I said, I would have agreed provided SBR had a genuinely decent replacement lined up - Kluivert would NOT have counted as that replacement. Whatever your opinion on the footballing side of things, it was Robson's call to make. When a Chairman over-rules his manager on a football matter because of what the fans might think, the club is clearly not being run in the right way. That was the start of the slippery slope. From Shepherd's point of view, I think he was right in anticipating that there would be a backlash from most fans, but it's part of his job to back his manager when he comes under fire. We've had plenty of talk over the last 2 years about 'fan power' and the supposed desirability of getting some representation in the running of the club. Trouble is, the general collective opinion of the fans is sometimes dead wrong, and the position of the professionals who are going to be held responsible for results on the pitch has to be respected. Agree with this, but replacing Shearer with a player who was seen as second rate or risky would not be an acceptable scenario ; had SBR come along with Eto or a combination of players who would do the job, then fine.

As I said, I would have agreed provided SBR had a genuinely decent replacement lined up - Kluivert would NOT have counted as that replacement.

To be honest, the constant agonizing about characters like Shearer, SBR, KK etc., and whether each was right or wrong OR a bad influence, really sums up what is wrong with Newcastle United - namely, that it is NOT United either on or off the field and rarely has been since the Fairs Cup days(even before that there was aggro between sections of the board). Although football is necessarily a game of opinions and always will be, there has been far too much dissent in the club for years and this, in my opinion, is why the club has failed to achieve what it should have done. The situation is made far worse by the fact that the media have always been delighted to get easy stories about the club and the club has, in turn, made it easy for them by washing far too much dirty linen in public - this probably really started in earnest after Pop Robson's famous Press conference when he accused the club of a lack of professionalism and then the arrival of Malcolm Macdonald in a white RR after his signing almost a year later. Joe Harvey ALMOST managed to create a good side capable of winning domestic trophies in 1973 but the loss of Tony Green and the unwillingness of the board to go that extra yard to sign players Harvey wanted(such as Andy Gray and Alan Hansen) stopped him from finishing the job...also, the players let the club down badly at Wembley in 1974 after all the hype preceding the Cup Final. There were reputedly schisms in the dressing room between Supermac's acolytes and those of Bobby Moncur and whether these stories were true or not, the club started to go backwards and Harvey had to go in 1975. Lee came in and achieved a modicum of success by taking the club to the LCF in 1976, but left(for Everton) the following season after selling Macdonald but leading the club to a European challenging position. We all know what happened after Dinnis took over with player-power - the club reached Europe then got relegated a year later.... Since then, a succession of managers have come and gone, many being unable to work with the Board, until the John Hall takeover - all the while, the club was slipping behind others, and we fans watched while clubs like Watford and Leicester won silverware. Even after KK took over, there was controversy and problems off the field but he(and, to be fair) the board got the club into its best position for years...both on AND off the field, where a degree of unity among fans and officials prevailed. To get to the point, the reason all this failed was, in my view, because we failed to win the League in 1996. Had we done so, the signing of Shearer would not have been seen as such a surprise, or the reason for it being given as 'he decided to come home' ; this gave him special status in the eyes of many fans and even though his unfortunate injuries took the edge off his game, he was still seen as Mr NUFC by most people. Had we won the league, his signing would have been simply that of a top player choosing to join what would have been the Best Club in England at that time. His turning down Man U was great at the time for fans of NUFC but many felt that we 'owed' him for doing so. That view still prevails, and it is hard to argue against it since he lost many medals by joining us. As to the SBR situation, he too was seen as a saviour because he joined us when the club was in danger of relegation and he sorted things out after a dire spell under Gullit ; people tend to forget that he turned us down after Sir John asked him to come in 1997 after KK left when he could have had access to a much better situation. The fact that people are STILL arguing about the relative merits of the two men is just ridiculous - for what its worth, if SBR had come to me and said he wanted to sell Shearer for 5m at the time he supposedly did, I would have agreed had I been Chairman - PROVIDED he could convince me that he had a proper replacement lined up...that is the way all TOP clubs deal with their aging stars, and Liverpool did that, esp under Shankly, which is why they stayed at the top so long until Souness wrecked it. No doubt Shepherd would have taken a different line....... However, SBR was definitely at the end of the road as a Prem manager in 2003 - he should have joined the Board that summer and helped to recruit a successor - maybe even Mourinho. UNTIL there is unity of purpose among both fans and club, and PROFESSIONALISM on and off the field, the club will always struggle to punch its weight - no matter WHO is in charge. Shearer was a great CF when he joined us, the best in Europe but his injuries never allowed him to make the contribution he should have done ; we had to do without him for months in his first season and then thereafter. He is still human and should have quit when he was past it - as should SBR and both WOULD have had to do so if the club was being run properly.

If capello didn't like him, then he wouldn't have picked him for most of his squads. Couldn't careless either, BTW. There were stories that the FA wanted England managers to pick Beckham because of his high profile in Asia etc(spin-off with sales of merchandise etc), although I doubt whether Capello would have accepted that condition with Beckham being at the end of his career. I believe that Capello picked him for squads because a) he didn't want to upset those England fans who still believe the hype about him and b)he would be useful to throw on in the last quarters of matches. He will now be able to fashion his own England side from the younger players.

Couldn't care less - just a pity he was there as Sven's puppet-master in the previous one. Glad to see the back of him and his wax-model wife - a bad influence on the squad and I bet Capello is secretly pleased too.

Was a disgrace today - have him on my list for one of those who would be out if it were possible. When you consider his age, he should be ashamed of himself ; he has all the mobility of an earth-moving machine. If any club daft enough offered 1m, he would be away.

Agreed - would be one of the first out of the door if I had my way. He's a bad influence and is simply taking the pee out of both club and fans. He WILL be out of the door once his contract finishes.....

A lucky point, but 2 well-taken goals, even if the Boro defence gave Carroll enough room to turn a liner. Excellent pass from Jonas for 1st goal, he would be a world-beater if he could add end product to his work like this... Poor overall performance, with ball given away like a hot potato - Boro had most of the possession and after seeing their new players, I reckon they could be a good bet for promotion next year ; Robson and McDonald will score goals in this league and still have time to improve both individually and as a pair. They offer far more potential as footballers than our front players. Carroll needs to work harder at holding up the ball. Enrique badly missed although Kadar looked better when moved into CD. Agree with earlier comment that we only have about 3/4 players who will look the part in the Prem. There will have to be at least 3 decent signings if the club are to survive comfortably - we all know where they are needed.

Ashley has made some horrendous errors since he came to the club, some which undoubtedly resulted in relegation. However(and in some ways because of the turn of events in the world of Finance), he has turned out to be what the club need at this time, because all top clubs are going to have to start living within their means during the next few years. Ashley has at least stabilized the club by continuing to support it financially, even though he has no alternative if he wants to get a slice of his money back. He will almost certainly sell if he gets the chance of getting a reasonable portion of his investment back(although it wouldn't surprise me to see him getting hooked on the club IF it does fairly well on its return to the Prem), but NUFC is in a far better position than it would have been had Shepherd still been in charge...look at Pompey... We are currently in no position to look Ashley's 'Gift Horse' in the mouth as there is no other party with the sort of finance necessary who is interested in taking over.

If you go to matches or buy merchandise, you are just as responsible - if you don't like the system, boycott it...but how many will ? As for the 'Free Market', what about the Zils that the hierarchy in the Soviet Union used to ride around in whilst the plebs were making do with the oh-so-reliable Moskvitch ?? Fans of Socialism are like St Augustine - 'Oh Lord, give me chastity - but don't give it YET..!' They want it to happen, but not for themselves. Yeah your right, social reform is a bad idea. Lets ban the minimum wage in this country while we are at it that way we might even be able to afford to give the corporations CEO,s and the bankers a bit more on their bonuses, poor souls. Who mentioned Bankers ? However, it has obviously escaped your notice that the politicians(including those pretending to be 'On the Left')have wrecked the UK by making its economy dependent on Financial Services - what the hell else do you think has allowed the current shower to keep spending money on non-jobs to keep them in power, other than the huge tax revenues the Chancellor has been picking up from the spivs in the City of London ? The Germans(and the French)have kept - and subsidised - their basic industries while UK companies were being merrily sold off to the highest bidder...WITH the approval of BOTH major UK political parties. Wake up and smell the coffee mate - the Asian nations like China & India are making stuff at a FRACTION of the costs in the West because of low wages, and unless outsourcing is stopped that will continue to wreak havoc on Western jobs. EVERYONE in Europe or USA that wants cheap goods is to blame because they BUY them... If you feel that strongly about exploitation of the workers, DON'T buy cheap goods from China etc...trouble is, you'll have a bit of a job finding similar products made in the West that are anywhere near the price for the same quality... Over to you......go on, tell me I'm wrong....

Guthrie is a plodder - that is why Liverpool allowed him to leave. They very rarely let decent players go, like Man U. He looks reasonable in this team and this division because BOTH are short of real talent - look how West Brom's midfielders left him chasing shadows, and he is probably the best midfielder we have(Jonas is mainly a winger). This is as good as he will get and. like many of his team-mates, will need replacing if NUFC manage to go up. I bet KK would have got rid of him - he let Peacock and Kelly go after promotion and BOTH were more effective in their positions than Guthrie. The fact that so many rate him shows how far the expectations of fans have fallen in the past 5 years.

No surprise if Moses joins a Prem club - even Wigan. Nothing is cast in stone if football and at present, NUFC is seen as a second-rate club - which it is. If a young player with potential becomes available, you can bet your boots that a Prem side will snap him up. It's a hard road back to the top and fraught with disappointments - it won't be easy to become a top club again after what the club has been through unless it brings its own players through the ranks ; something not looking likely at present. Just as the UK and USA have spent years living beyond their means and not facing reality, so NUFC did the same under Shepherd and then Ashley. This situation is the result because players want to go where the best chance of success is - just because Wigan is a 'small' club makes no difference - they are currently bigger than Newcastle United and will remain so until NUFC are in the top league and acting like a top club in EVERY way.

If you go to matches or buy merchandise, you are just as responsible - if you don't like the system, boycott it...but how many will ? As for the 'Free Market', what about the Zils that the hierarchy in the Soviet Union used to ride around in whilst the plebs were making do with the oh-so-reliable Moskvitch ?? Fans of Socialism are like St Augustine - 'Oh Lord, give me chastity - but don't give it YET..!' They want it to happen, but not for themselves.

Far too much focus given to Tyne-Wear rivalry - its small beer these days, There were some who would rather have beaten them home & away than for us to win the league, even back in 96 when Man U were clearly our main rivals..we are actually more of a comparison with the Mackems now than we were then, but tribal rivalry dies hard. The very fact that they seem so focused on what NUFC are doing shows how small minded they must be - if we were competing well in the Prem and they were in the CCC, I wouldn't give them a second thought...apart from a bit of pity now & again - well. maybe once or twice a season ! If Newcastle is ever to get back to where it was in the mid 90s, we have to aim higher than the Mackems. All the usual talk about 'at least we get the Derby games back' if they were to get relegated leaves me stone-cold, just as it would if we go up and they stay up. These games are like 2 old men fighting over a fag-end, and will be as long as both clubs are second-rate. I say that as one who USED to look forward to derbies, but times change - they have about as much significance to the rest of the country as Darlo V H/Pool.

Not how I recall it. ...And how do you recall it ? I knew before most people and the first I knew of it was when another former Magpie Group member rang me and told me the club had bid 1.75m for Cole ; he signed very soon after that and I didn't really know who he was - neither did most fans although he soon changed that..... This was in late Feb 1993 and Cole made his debut soon after.

You give credit where credit is due - so far, the transfer dealings have been done in the right way and without all the hullabaloo that occurred under previous regimes, although KKs signings of Andy Cole and Alan Shearer were also kept under wraps until done & dusted...exactly as it should be. I have hammered Ashley for his mistakes and would do so again, but I think he seems to have acted correctly this time...whether the signings bear fruit by getting the club promoted remains to be seen. Also, although he seems to have achieved it by accident, his policy of keeping the club's debts down is exactly right for the situation football now finds itself and should pay off for a club like Newcastle in future years. The TRUE test of Ashley's transfer policy will be seen if and when the club gets promoted and has to strengthen the squad with Prem-quality players...

The crunch is most certainly coming for Prem clubs and I'm not surprised at all - I knew this would happen after the Financial crisis , but all that has done is bring things to a head. Football is NOT immune from problems in the economy and they will have to cut their cloth accordingly. As has been said, Ashley may turn out to be a bit of a mixed blessing as his cutbacks on the club's debts should prove invaluable - in the long run... However, as with most of what he does, some of this has largely been down to outside forces rather than a good long term pan - still, any silver lining on the cloud is welcome. As for Scudamore - no time for him...he is the idiot that claimed the Prem 'wouldn't miss Newcastle' at all...Not much when clubs like Wigan and Burnley can hardly drum up our average crowd in 2 matches ..! Head of the 'Know Nowt About It' Dept...

This - has been glaringly obvious all season....unless the squad is strengthened there will be problems.

Without seeing the game I cannot comment properly, but I am not surprised that WBA won, even if it seems that they had some help from the ref. After watching the game at SJP last Monday, they looked a far better footballing side and I could not understand those posters who claimed that their style was 'better suited to Away games'.. If you keep a lot of possession and play the ball quickly on the floor, it stands to reason that you are going to create chances - esp at home where refs DO usually lean towards the home side. They caused loads of bother at SJP with their quick passing style(reminiscent, strangely, of our 92/93 side, if not quite as dangerous up front), and I fully expected that they would be a tough task at the Hawthorns - most of this has to be credited to Di Matteo because they didn't look anywhere NEAR as good when we played them on the first day of the season. Our defence, esp the RH side, was taken apart at SJP and WBA will have learned from that. I am not sorry the club has gone out of the FAC - there was NO chance of winning it anyway - but these matches have shown up the weaknesses in the side and if we do not beat Palace, there is a real chance of having a bad spell which could ruin promotion hopes. Pleased Carroll got his goals - he DOES have some talent but how he is handled from now will determine whether he makes it or not - wouldn't be too surprised if he went before the deadline.....

I don't share your enthusiasm. Middle eastern investors would rather throw money at a London club if possible, I don't think Newcastle have much of a profile in the arab world these days. If they do have any knowledge of the club I doubt they've missed the unpopularity of Ashley either. Not sure we're as attractive a proposition as you think. Totally agree - the world has changed irrevocably now and outside of London, Manchester or Liverpool , teams are seen as insignificant - INCLUDING NUFC.. The club has not won a domestic trophy for 55 years and Middle Eastern potential investors have bigger fish to fry. Also, top players want to play in the CL clubs unless, like Shearer, they are from the NE. Daydreaming about our 'huge crowds, massive potential' is a throwback to the 90s - we had our chance then and blew it. As for the finance, even the Arabs are struggling - look at how Dubai had to re-name the Burj to the Burj-al-Khalifa because Abu Dhabi were bailing them out - to a point..... The best hope the club has for the future is that the UEFA rules on indebtedness are introduced together with the limit on number of foreigners in a junior side. Failing that, the future will consist of being a yo-yo club or making up the numbers in the Prem. When Supermac was sold to Arsenal in 1976, there was a joke told - seemingly, a Newcastle tailor gave him a roll of cloth as a farewell present to make a suit. When Macdonald got to London, he went to Saville Row to get the suit made...the tailor he spoke to said' Oh yes, I can make you a suit alright - not just that, but I can make you 3 suits and a waistcoat from this roll of cloth' Macdonald was incredulous ; 'But the tailor in Newcastle told me there was only enough for a suit' The London tailor replied ' Yes - but you were a lot BIGGER UP THERE THAN YOU ARE DOWN HERE !!!'..... That sums up how outside investors see NUFC compared to the view of many fans - this is the real world now, even more so than in was in 1976....

Hard to see where a really wealthy new owner, interested in moving the club forward, is coming from. Even the Hammers managed to find people willing to pay over 100m for them - even if those people have a somewhat shady past career, and WHU are a smaller club than NUFC . One has to assume that their London base has given them an edge and that is something NUFC can do nothing about. Unless someone with a local connection, or a Randy Lerner type is found, it will be difficult to find a buyer willing to pay Ashley's price.