Football Finances

[madras]

"who would've paid off the debt" well hall didn't, thats like saying, who was going to pay off the debt we had when he left the club in the hands of tweedle dee and tweedle dum.

 

the situation ashley inherited was one of huge debts and future income hocked, hall was in a position on taking over that almost whatever they created they could use and it was a time when loads of money was just about to start pouring in to football.

 

I'm not doing down what we achieved under Hall snr but trying to point out that ashley inherited a pile of shite aswell (not that it will wash with you as I know you have a personal thing with ashley for not giving keegan carte blanche)

[Guest Howaythetoon]

"who would've paid off the debt" well hall didn't, thats like saying, who was going to pay off the debt we had when he left the club in the hands of tweedle dee and tweedle dum.

 

the situation ashley inherited was one of huge debts and future income hocked, hall was in a position on taking over that almost whatever they created they could use and it was a time when loads of money was just about to start pouring in to football.

 

I'm not doing down what we achieved under Hall snr but trying to point out that ashley inherited a pile of s**** aswell (not that it will wash with you as I know you have a personal thing with ashley for not giving keegan carte blanche)

 

I don't even know what you are arguing about to be honest...

 

Anyway, for me Sir John Hall should be regarded as a legend around these parts for what he did for the club. People complain about the money he earned from the club yet I didn't hear anyone complain about Shearer's wages or how much Colo cost us and rightly so because these players gave/give a great deal back and were worth every penny they cost.

 

Its the likes of Freddy Shepherd and Douglas Hall who were the real leeches, who benefited massively financially without ever really contributing much, not to justify what they earned from the club anyway.

 

Sir John Hall took a huge gamble when he decided to buy up all those shares, spending several million of his own money at that time, money his advisers and accountants were telling him he was basically throwing away and how mad he was to buy such a shitty run down nothing football club. He saw something in the club though that no-one else did at that time.

 

We should all be grateful the man got involved with the club and regard him as a hero at worst,  because we would not be what we are today without his involvement. Forget KK, forget the entertainers, Feyenoord away, 5-0 against Man Utd, our wonderful stadium. Forget the lot.

 

Its sad how in the modern game people like Mario fucking Balotelli and Joey fucking Barton are considered heroes or legends and the likes of Sir John Hall a leech or KK a quitter, men who give to their clubs everything they had to offer.

 

It is even more sickening when NUFC fans look at men like SJH and KK with disdain or suspicion.

[TheHoob]

[Kanji]

Hold up - who considers Mario and Joey a hero or legend?

 

Good post though, other than that Mario and Joey reference...I know what you're trying to say though!

[Guest chicken little]

a quick history question: about the massive debts (mortgages etc.) that shepherd ran up. when did that all begin? i know shepherd was reckless as f*** financially, but was hall the same? put it another way, was our 90s renaissance entirely funded out of the man's pocket?

 

thanks to you all for the enlightening replies to this - i will confess that during the time i was only just getting old enough to follow the club, and wasn't living in the region.

 

definitely have some doubts about sjh (both in terms of nufc, and his character in general), but cannot argue with htt's characterization of his importance to the club. my earliest memories of the club are around 1990-91 - it all could have been very different.

[colinmk]

Good post HTT.

[Guest chicken little]

Aye, and I should say good post to quayside as well - between the two of youse you've covered well two perspectives on a period I struggle to analyze.

 

 

[Toonpack]

"who would've paid off the debt" well hall didn't, thats like saying, who was going to pay off the debt we had when he left the club in the hands of tweedle dee and tweedle dum.

 

the situation ashley inherited was one of huge debts and future income hocked, hall was in a position on taking over that almost whatever they created they could use and it was a time when loads of money was just about to start pouring in to football.

 

I'm not doing down what we achieved under Hall snr but trying to point out that ashley inherited a pile of s**** aswell (not that it will wash with you as I know you have a personal thing with ashley for not giving keegan carte blanche)

 

I don't even know what you are arguing about to be honest...

 

Anyway, for me Sir John Hall should be regarded as a legend around these parts for what he did for the club. People complain about the money he earned from the club yet I didn't hear anyone complain about Shearer's wages or how much Colo cost us and rightly so because these players gave/give a great deal back and were worth every penny they cost.

 

Its the likes of Freddy Shepherd and Douglas Hall who were the real leeches, who benefited massively financially without ever really contributing much, not to justify what they earned from the club anyway.

 

Sir John Hall took a huge gamble when he decided to buy up all those shares, spending several million of his own money at that time, money his advisers and accountants were telling him he was basically throwing away and how mad he was to buy such a shitty run down nothing football club. He saw something in the club though that no-one else did at that time.

 

We should all be grateful the man got involved with the club and regard him as a hero at worst,  because we would not be what we are today without his involvement. Forget KK, forget the entertainers, Feyenoord away, 5-0 against Man Utd, our wonderful stadium. Forget the lot.

 

Its sad how in the modern game people like Mario f***ing Balotelli and Joey f***ing Barton are considered heroes or legends and the likes of Sir John Hall a leech or KK a quitter, men who give to their clubs everything they had to offer.

 

It is even more sickening when NUFC fans look at men like SJH and KK with disdain or suspicion.

 

A gamble would indicate risk, he took no personal risk - ever. He never invested a penny of his own money except to excercise share options at prices that were less than (as share options often are) the shares were worth at the time, i.e. printing money.

 

Cameron Hall Ltd bought NUFC for SJH to run, then that loan was put straight onto the club = the club bought NUFC for SJH.

 

Don't get me wrong, I realise what SJH did for the club, but a man who REALLY should get a lot of the credit for making NUFC what it was, is Freddie Fletcher, who sadly, rarely gets a mention these days.

 

BTW NUFC goes back way before SJH and KK for some of us, they didn't start it, and whilst deserving credit for elevating our status in the game (luckily when the game really took off) they certainly shouldn't be looked upon as "founding fathers". Indeed, there's a rather large bit of me that's never forgiven KK for 1974.

 

Poeple come and go from football clubs and some leave a legacy, SJH and KK are just two more of them and in KK's case he profoundly damaged his legacy (for me) when he bailed and took the club to court trying for a ridiculous sum.

 

Joe Harvey, a man who gave virtually his whole life to the club (and actually won stuff as a player and manager) is a bigger legend, in my eyes, than either.

[OzzieMandias]

"who would've paid off the debt" well hall didn't, thats like saying, who was going to pay off the debt we had when he left the club in the hands of tweedle dee and tweedle dum.

 

the situation ashley inherited was one of huge debts and future income hocked, hall was in a position on taking over that almost whatever they created they could use and it was a time when loads of money was just about to start pouring in to football.

 

I'm not doing down what we achieved under Hall snr but trying to point out that ashley inherited a pile of s**** aswell (not that it will wash with you as I know you have a personal thing with ashley for not giving keegan carte blanche)

 

I don't even know what you are arguing about to be honest...

 

Anyway, for me Sir John Hall should be regarded as a legend around these parts for what he did for the club. People complain about the money he earned from the club yet I didn't hear anyone complain about Shearer's wages or how much Colo cost us and rightly so because these players gave/give a great deal back and were worth every penny they cost.

 

Its the likes of Freddy Shepherd and Douglas Hall who were the real leeches, who benefited massively financially without ever really contributing much, not to justify what they earned from the club anyway.

 

Sir John Hall took a huge gamble when he decided to buy up all those shares, spending several million of his own money at that time, money his advisers and accountants were telling him he was basically throwing away and how mad he was to buy such a shitty run down nothing football club. He saw something in the club though that no-one else did at that time.

 

We should all be grateful the man got involved with the club and regard him as a hero at worst,  because we would not be what we are today without his involvement. Forget KK, forget the entertainers, Feyenoord away, 5-0 against Man Utd, our wonderful stadium. Forget the lot.

 

Its sad how in the modern game people like Mario f***ing Balotelli and Joey f***ing Barton are considered heroes or legends and the likes of Sir John Hall a leech or KK a quitter, men who give to their clubs everything they had to offer.

 

It is even more sickening when NUFC fans look at men like SJH and KK with disdain or suspicion.

 

A gamble would indicate risk, he took no personal risk - ever. He never invested a penny of his own money except to excercise share options at prices that were less than (as share options often are) the shares were worth at the time, i.e. printing money.

 

Cameron Hall Ltd bought NUFC for SJH to run, then that loan was put straight onto the club = the club bought NUFC for SJH.

 

Don't get me wrong, I realise what SJH did for the club, but a man who REALLY should get a lot of the credit for making NUFC what it was, is Freddie Fletcher, who sadly, rarely gets a mention these days.

 

BTW NUFC goes back way before SJH and KK for some of us, they didn't start it, and whilst deserving credit for elevating our status in the game (luckily when the game really took off) they certainly shouldn't be looked upon as "founding fathers". Indeed, there's a rather large bit of me that's never forgiven KK for 1974.

 

Poeple come and go from football clubs and some leave a legacy, SJH and KK are just two more of them and in KK's case he profoundly damaged his legacy (for me) when he bailed and took the club to court trying for a ridiculous sum.

 

Joe Harvey, a man who gave virtually his whole life to the club (and actually won stuff as a player and manager) is a bigger legend, in my eyes, than either.

 

[Guest Howaythetoon]

 

A gamble would indicate risk, he took no personal risk - ever. He never invested a penny of his own money except to excercise share options at prices that were less than (as share options often are) the shares were worth at the time, i.e. printing money.

 

Cameron Hall Ltd bought NUFC for SJH to run, then that loan was put straight onto the club = the club bought NUFC for SJH.

 

Of course it was a gamble. Financially and to his own actual standing as a businessman. I understand what you are saying about the shares and the holding company etc. and you are right, but at some point Sir John Hall pulled out his own money to buy the club. At the time he was buying a pretty worthless club, one that even the fans didn't want to know about.

 

Don't get me wrong, I realise what SJH did for the club, but a man who REALLY should get a lot of the credit for making NUFC what it was, is Freddie Fletcher, who sadly, rarely gets a mention these days.

 

I couldn't agree more with you on Fletcher. He lost a lot of fans/respect over the SOS carry on but he was a monster when it came to the business side of the club. He was as vital to the operations as SJH and KK were, without a doubt.

 

BTW NUFC goes back way before SJH and KK for some of us, they didn't start it, and whilst deserving credit for elevating our status in the game (luckily when the game really took off) they certainly shouldn't be looked upon as "founding fathers". Indeed, there's a rather large bit of me that's never forgiven KK for 1974.

 

Of course but no-one has claimed that. In SJH though whatever way you want to look at it and his time here, he was a colossus figure in the history of our club, as was KK, massive positive influences.

 

Poeple come and go from football clubs and some leave a legacy, SJH and KK are just two more of them and in KK's case he profoundly damaged his legacy (for me) when he bailed and took the club to court trying for a ridiculous sum.

 

They do indeed come and go and one day someone will replace SJH as an even bigger figure and the same applies with KK. Who knows maybe even the man Ashley himself...

 

I don't blame KK for resigning or taking the club to court btw, the way they treated him was a disgrace on any level and he had to defend his corner given they were basically leaking stuff to the media how KK wanted millions to go and buy your Henrys and Lampards etc. They were basically trying to paint him as some kind of lunatic who couldn't be trusted with buying and selling and who would if allowed, bankrupted us with crazy signings.

 

Joe Harvey, a man who gave virtually his whole life to the club (and actually won stuff as a player and manager) is a bigger legend, in my eyes, than either.

 

He's a legend no doubt. Such a lovely bloke by all accounts too.

 

Getting back to SJH, if you ask yourself whether he was a good owner or not, there can only be one answer. He, KK and Fletcher were a dynamic force who together with us fans, created something very special indeed. A nothing club, broke and going nowhere into one of the biggest in the game. And before anyone jumps on the biggest line, I don't mean by success etc. but by growth, stadium, number of fans, wealth and brand.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

"who would've paid off the debt" well hall didn't, thats like saying, who was going to pay off the debt we had when he left the club in the hands of tweedle dee and tweedle dum.

 

the situation ashley inherited was one of huge debts and future income hocked, hall was in a position on taking over that almost whatever they created they could use and it was a time when loads of money was just about to start pouring in to football.

 

I'm not doing down what we achieved under Hall snr but trying to point out that ashley inherited a pile of s**** aswell (not that it will wash with you as I know you have a personal thing with ashley for not giving keegan carte blanche)

 

I don't even know what you are arguing about to be honest...

 

Anyway, for me Sir John Hall should be regarded as a legend around these parts for what he did for the club. People complain about the money he earned from the club yet I didn't hear anyone complain about Shearer's wages or how much Colo cost us and rightly so because these players gave/give a great deal back and were worth every penny they cost.

 

Its the likes of Freddy Shepherd and Douglas Hall who were the real leeches, who benefited massively financially without ever really contributing much, not to justify what they earned from the club anyway.

 

Sir John Hall took a huge gamble when he decided to buy up all those shares, spending several million of his own money at that time, money his advisers and accountants were telling him he was basically throwing away and how mad he was to buy such a shitty run down nothing football club. He saw something in the club though that no-one else did at that time.

 

We should all be grateful the man got involved with the club and regard him as a hero at worst,  because we would not be what we are today without his involvement. Forget KK, forget the entertainers, Feyenoord away, 5-0 against Man Utd, our wonderful stadium. Forget the lot.

 

Its sad how in the modern game people like Mario f***ing Balotelli and Joey f***ing Barton are considered heroes or legends and the likes of Sir John Hall a leech or KK a quitter, men who give to their clubs everything they had to offer.

 

It is even more sickening when NUFC fans look at men like SJH and KK with disdain or suspicion.

 

A gamble would indicate risk, he took no personal risk - ever. He never invested a penny of his own money except to excercise share options at prices that were less than (as share options often are) the shares were worth at the time, i.e. printing money.

 

Cameron Hall Ltd bought NUFC for SJH to run, then that loan was put straight onto the club = the club bought NUFC for SJH.

 

Don't get me wrong, I realise what SJH did for the club, but a man who REALLY should get a lot of the credit for making NUFC what it was, is Freddie Fletcher, who sadly, rarely gets a mention these days.

 

BTW NUFC goes back way before SJH and KK for some of us, they didn't start it, and whilst deserving credit for elevating our status in the game (luckily when the game really took off) they certainly shouldn't be looked upon as "founding fathers". Indeed, there's a rather large bit of me that's never forgiven KK for 1974.

 

Poeple come and go from football clubs and some leave a legacy, SJH and KK are just two more of them and in KK's case he profoundly damaged his legacy (for me) when he bailed and took the club to court trying for a ridiculous sum.

 

Joe Harvey, a man who gave virtually his whole life to the club (and actually won stuff as a player and manager) is a bigger legend, in my eyes, than either.

 

 

Quelle surprise!

[OzzieMandias]

Yeah, big surprise that I haven't become young enough not to remember Joe Harvey.

[Dave]

http://www.sportingintelligence.com/2013/06/11/revealed-man-city-rise-to-top-of-global-pay-charts-dodgers-soar-to-challenge-110601/

http://i.imgur.com/WYWfqqu.jpg

 

Rank (last year) – Team – League – Ave player pay, £ per year (week) - Ave player pay $ per year (week)

http://i.imgur.com/RIuEFxs.png

[Village Idiot]

I have a really hard time believing Milan have the 4th highest average wages in world football.

[Optimistic Nut]

About where I'd expect us to be really in that respect given what Sunderland spunk on players, and although a young squad on the whole, Villa must be paying a fortune to the likes of Given, Bent, N'Zogbia & Ireland.

[Flip]

I have a really hard time believing Milan have the 4th highest average wages in world football.

 

Trying to figure out how come they're that high up the list, must be something wrong there.

[merlin]

"who would've paid off the debt" well hall didn't, thats like saying, who was going to pay off the debt we had when he left the club in the hands of tweedle dee and tweedle dum.

 

the situation ashley inherited was one of huge debts and future income hocked, hall was in a position on taking over that almost whatever they created they could use and it was a time when loads of money was just about to start pouring in to football.

 

I'm not doing down what we achieved under Hall snr but trying to point out that ashley inherited a pile of s**** aswell (not that it will wash with you as I know you have a personal thing with ashley for not giving keegan carte blanche)

 

I don't even know what you are arguing about to be honest...

 

Anyway, for me Sir John Hall should be regarded as a legend around these parts for what he did for the club. People complain about the money he earned from the club yet I didn't hear anyone complain about Shearer's wages or how much Colo cost us and rightly so because these players gave/give a great deal back and were worth every penny they cost.

 

Its the likes of Freddy Shepherd and Douglas Hall who were the real leeches, who benefited massively financially without ever really contributing much, not to justify what they earned from the club anyway.

 

Sir John Hall took a huge gamble when he decided to buy up all those shares, spending several million of his own money at that time, money his advisers and accountants were telling him he was basically throwing away and how mad he was to buy such a shitty run down nothing football club. He saw something in the club though that no-one else did at that time.

 

We should all be grateful the man got involved with the club and regard him as a hero at worst,  because we would not be what we are today without his involvement. Forget KK, forget the entertainers, Feyenoord away, 5-0 against Man Utd, our wonderful stadium. Forget the lot.

 

Its sad how in the modern game people like Mario f***ing Balotelli and Joey f***ing Barton are considered heroes or legends and the likes of Sir John Hall a leech or KK a quitter, men who give to their clubs everything they had to offer.

 

It is even more sickening when NUFC fans look at men like SJH and KK with disdain or suspicion.

 

Great post HTT - and right on the button.

I also detest the hero-worship that scabs like Balotelli and Barton receive whilst SJH is run down by many fans. We simply wouldn't have existed after 92 had he not rescued the club when it was facing ruin financially and nobody else was willing to step in.

The only thing SJH did wrong was to leave the club in the hands of Shepherd and his son.

[merlin]

"who would've paid off the debt" well hall didn't, thats like saying, who was going to pay off the debt we had when he left the club in the hands of tweedle dee and tweedle dum.

 

the situation ashley inherited was one of huge debts and future income hocked, hall was in a position on taking over that almost whatever they created they could use and it was a time when loads of money was just about to start pouring in to football.

 

I'm not doing down what we achieved under Hall snr but trying to point out that ashley inherited a pile of s**** aswell (not that it will wash with you as I know you have a personal thing with ashley for not giving keegan carte blanche)

 

I don't even know what you are arguing about to be honest...

 

Anyway, for me Sir John Hall should be regarded as a legend around these parts for what he did for the club. People complain about the money he earned from the club yet I didn't hear anyone complain about Shearer's wages or how much Colo cost us and rightly so because these players gave/give a great deal back and were worth every penny they cost.

 

Its the likes of Freddy Shepherd and Douglas Hall who were the real leeches, who benefited massively financially without ever really contributing much, not to justify what they earned from the club anyway.

 

Sir John Hall took a huge gamble when he decided to buy up all those shares, spending several million of his own money at that time, money his advisers and accountants were telling him he was basically throwing away and how mad he was to buy such a shitty run down nothing football club. He saw something in the club though that no-one else did at that time.

 

We should all be grateful the man got involved with the club and regard him as a hero at worst,  because we would not be what we are today without his involvement. Forget KK, forget the entertainers, Feyenoord away, 5-0 against Man Utd, our wonderful stadium. Forget the lot.

 

Its sad how in the modern game people like Mario f***ing Balotelli and Joey f***ing Barton are considered heroes or legends and the likes of Sir John Hall a leech or KK a quitter, men who give to their clubs everything they had to offer.

 

It is even more sickening when NUFC fans look at men like SJH and KK with disdain or suspicion.

 

A gamble would indicate risk, he took no personal risk - ever. He never invested a penny of his own money except to excercise share options at prices that were less than (as share options often are) the shares were worth at the time, i.e. printing money.

 

Cameron Hall Ltd bought NUFC for SJH to run, then that loan was put straight onto the club = the club bought NUFC for SJH.

 

Don't get me wrong, I realise what SJH did for the club, but a man who REALLY should get a lot of the credit for making NUFC what it was, is Freddie Fletcher, who sadly, rarely gets a mention these days.

 

BTW NUFC goes back way before SJH and KK for some of us, they didn't start it, and whilst deserving credit for elevating our status in the game (luckily when the game really took off) they certainly shouldn't be looked upon as "founding fathers". Indeed, there's a rather large bit of me that's never forgiven KK for 1974.

 

Poeple come and go from football clubs and some leave a legacy, SJH and KK are just two more of them and in KK's case he profoundly damaged his legacy (for me) when he bailed and took the club to court trying for a ridiculous sum.

 

Joe Harvey, a man who gave virtually his whole life to the club (and actually won stuff as a player and manager) is a bigger legend, in my eyes, than either.

If ever I saw history being re-written and airbrushed, this is it - for a start, the money SJH used to buy up the shares from shareholders/board members came directly from his pension fund. If that is not a personal risk, then what is ? Secondly, Lady Hall had to fund the transfer of Kilcline just after KK arrived because the bank were impounding any money the club had to cover its debts....is that not a personal risk..??

 

As for your hero-worship of Shepherd - he was just a bit-part player in the whole exercise and his contribution was minimal when compared to SJH who could have eaten him from breakfast financially at that time. Shepherd, apart from his dubious contribution to the NOTW con along with Douglas Hall, was most notable for buying over-priced players, botching the departure of SBR and bringing his son into the club whilst he was working for a football agent.

 

I don't know whether you were old enough to know what was happening at the time, but your points seem way, way off the mark.

[merlin]

In addition to what I wrote above, I would also add that to blame KK for so-called 'bailing' when he was put into an impossible position by Ashley, Lambias and Co is just a further illustration of re-writing history - even Fergie and Wenger said that Keegan was right to leave as the board had usurped his position and in case you have forgotten, the club also tried to sue him for breach of contract ; the court agreed with KK, hence the award of damages for constructive dismissal.

 

Some of us have long memories - people who want to change history to suit themselves shoudl remember that....

[AyeDubbleYoo]

KK was definitely right to resign, it was a mistake to appoint him in the first place. I would be really interested to know what he was told when he took the job... I guess Ashley does a better job of explaining the role to his manager now.

[Guest Slippery Sam]

"who would've paid off the debt" well hall didn't, thats like saying, who was going to pay off the debt we had when he left the club in the hands of tweedle dee and tweedle dum.

 

the situation ashley inherited was one of huge debts and future income hocked, hall was in a position on taking over that almost whatever they created they could use and it was a time when loads of money was just about to start pouring in to football.

 

I'm not doing down what we achieved under Hall snr but trying to point out that ashley inherited a pile of s**** aswell (not that it will wash with you as I know you have a personal thing with ashley for not giving keegan carte blanche)

 

I don't even know what you are arguing about to be honest...

 

Anyway, for me Sir John Hall should be regarded as a legend around these parts for what he did for the club. People complain about the money he earned from the club yet I didn't hear anyone complain about Shearer's wages or how much Colo cost us and rightly so because these players gave/give a great deal back and were worth every penny they cost.

 

Its the likes of Freddy Shepherd and Douglas Hall who were the real leeches, who benefited massively financially without ever really contributing much, not to justify what they earned from the club anyway.

 

Sir John Hall took a huge gamble when he decided to buy up all those shares, spending several million of his own money at that time, money his advisers and accountants were telling him he was basically throwing away and how mad he was to buy such a shitty run down nothing football club. He saw something in the club though that no-one else did at that time.

 

We should all be grateful the man got involved with the club and regard him as a hero at worst,  because we would not be what we are today without his involvement. Forget KK, forget the entertainers, Feyenoord away, 5-0 against Man Utd, our wonderful stadium. Forget the lot.

 

Its sad how in the modern game people like Mario f***ing Balotelli and Joey f***ing Barton are considered heroes or legends and the likes of Sir John Hall a leech or KK a quitter, men who give to their clubs everything they had to offer.

 

It is even more sickening when NUFC fans look at men like SJH and KK with disdain or suspicion.

 

A gamble would indicate risk, he took no personal risk - ever. He never invested a penny of his own money except to excercise share options at prices that were less than (as share options often are) the shares were worth at the time, i.e. printing money.

 

Cameron Hall Ltd bought NUFC for SJH to run, then that loan was put straight onto the club = the club bought NUFC for SJH.

 

Don't get me wrong, I realise what SJH did for the club, but a man who REALLY should get a lot of the credit for making NUFC what it was, is Freddie Fletcher, who sadly, rarely gets a mention these days.

 

BTW NUFC goes back way before SJH and KK for some of us, they didn't start it, and whilst deserving credit for elevating our status in the game (luckily when the game really took off) they certainly shouldn't be looked upon as "founding fathers". Indeed, there's a rather large bit of me that's never forgiven KK for 1974.

 

Poeple come and go from football clubs and some leave a legacy, SJH and KK are just two more of them and in KK's case he profoundly damaged his legacy (for me) when he bailed and took the club to court trying for a ridiculous sum.

 

Joe Harvey, a man who gave virtually his whole life to the club (and actually won stuff as a player and manager) is a bigger legend, in my eyes, than either.

If ever I saw history being re-written and airbrushed, this is it - for a start, the money SJH used to buy up the shares from shareholders/board members came directly from his pension fund. If that is not a personal risk, then what is ? Secondly, Lady Hall had to fund the transfer of Kilcline just after KK arrived because the bank were impounding any money the club had to cover its debts....is that not a personal risk..??

 

As for your hero-worship of Shepherd - he was just a bit-part player in the whole exercise and his contribution was minimal when compared to SJH who could have eaten him from breakfast financially at that time. Shepherd, apart from his dubious contribution to the NOTW con along with Douglas Hall, was most notable for buying over-priced players, botching the departure of SBR and bringing his son into the club whilst he was working for a football agent.

 

I don't know whether you were old enough to know what was happening at the time, but your points seem way, way off the mark.

 

He said Freddy Fletcher, not Shepherd.

 

He must have some age as he mentions the '74 cup final as reason for disliking KK. To dislike KK for doing his job in '74 is just plain daft iyam.

[GuyP]

I have a really hard time believing Milan have the 4th highest average wages in world football.

 

Trying to figure out how come they're that high up the list, must be something wrong there.

 

Absolute rubbish. Even with Zlatan, Cassano, Nesta, Seedorf etc. I would be surprised if they were above Chelsea and Bayern etc.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

Yeah, big surprise that I haven't become young enough not to remember Joe Harvey.

 

Nowt to do with that and I suspect you know it. For what it is worth I actually believe Joe Harvey should be honoured by NUFC with either a statue or a stand named after him. He too is a NUFC legend and arguably more justified than KK due to his longevity and the fact he won stuff here.

 

There can be no denying or downplaying KK's impact at NUFc though nor Sir John Hall's. They are the two biggest figures in our post war history in terms of impact on everything about the club. We would be yo-yo-ing between the Championship and League One right now if it were not for those two, with gates of between 15-20K in a run down stadium. That's if we survived going bust which would have happened.

 

They transformed the club completely. Where once we dreamed of being in the same division as the Man Utds and Liverpools we could actually dream of beating them to major honours. Where we once dreamed of being able to keep hold of our own local born players never mind anything else we could dream of signing anyone.

 

We went from being close to 6m in debt turning over less than that a season or something to being cash rich and turning over 60m in the space of 5 years, all that with pretty much a new stadium built over the old stadium. Prior to the IPO only Man Utd turned over and made more than us and that was mostly down to the extra at the time 7-8K seats Old Trafford had over SJP.

 

Commercially we were out performing even the likes of Barcelona and AC Milan. Our revenues went from 4m a year to 60m plus, from 6m debt to profit. Full houses every week with huge waiting lists that would further down the line enable us to expand the stadium further and actually fill it as we do now. All thanks to KK and Sir John Hall and of course guys like Fletcher, an unsung hero if ever there was one. Ironically him and KK fought like cat and dog over the running/direction of the club. He was the one that pushed for an IPO where as KK was as we all know dead set against it. All the IPO did was to make the likes of the Hall's and Shepherd's even richer. It didn't benefit the playing side one bit as it transpired.

[George Bailey]

Yeah, big surprise that I haven't become young enough not to remember Joe Harvey.

 

Nowt to do with that and I suspect you know it. For what it is worth I actually believe Joe Harvey should be honoured by NUFC with either a statue or a stand named after him. He too is a NUFC legend and arguably more justified than KK due to his longevity and the fact he won stuff here.

There can be no denying or downplaying KK's impact at NUFc though nor Sir John Hall's. They are the two biggest figures in our post war history in terms of impact on everything about the club. We would be yo-yo-ing between the Championship and League One right now if it were not for those two, with gates of between 15-20K in a run down stadium. That's if we survived going bust which would have happened.

 

They transformed the club completely. Where once we dreamed of being in the same division as the Man Utds and Liverpools we could actually dream of beating them to major honours. Where we once dreamed of being able to keep hold of our own local born players never mind anything else we could dream of signing anyone.

 

We went from being close to 6m in debt turning over less than that a season or something to being cash rich and turning over 60m in the space of 5 years, all that with pretty much a new stadium built over the old stadium. Prior to the IPO only Man Utd turned over and made more than us and that was mostly down to the extra at the time 7-8K seats Old Trafford had over SJP.

 

Commercially we were out performing even the likes of Barcelona and AC Milan. Our revenues went from 4m a year to 60m plus, from 6m debt to profit. Full houses every week with huge waiting lists that would further down the line enable us to expand the stadium further and actually fill it as we do now. All thanks to KK and Sir John Hall and of course guys like Fletcher, an unsung hero if ever there was one. Ironically him and KK fought like cat and dog over the running/direction of the club. He was the one that pushed for an IPO where as KK was as we all know dead set against it. All the IPO did was to make the likes of the Hall's and Shepherd's even richer. It didn't benefit the playing side one bit as it transpired.

Agree 100%

Amazes me that he hasnt had anything officially named after him , apart form a bar or restaraunt iirc?

One of the stands named after him or at least a statue would be a mark of respect for the great man imo.

 

On the finances thing, what baffles me is that no one really has ever seized our full potential. If only Ashley had an ounce of footballing nous he could make himself a lot of money, make us a true "giant" of a club and get us success on the pitch too.

Always irked me that we havent had the best of men in the boardroom for long enough, with a vision of building the club in the right way. We could easily challenge any English side on a business front imo, with the right man/woman in charge. Our market has been/is hardly tapped really. Bloody frustrating.

[Guest antz1uk]

From twitter, very surprised there is this much money in French football

 

@PhilippeAuclair: OM cashed in more French TV money than any other L1 club last season (incl. PSG): €47.97m - that's nearly 4 times more than Troyes.