Ronaldo

[Flip]

I'm not saying that Messi et al have no flair, mind, just that they are more direct and chose simpler options than other greats did. In part one of the reasons Messi is a better player than, say, Rivaldo, is because of this.

 

Then I agree fully with you. Rivaldo was such a fun player to watch like and he gets less credit for what he did defensively too. He would track back a lot when playing in an offensive side like the Brazilian 2002 World Cup winning team. He would trackback help his teammates out and then take the ball forward.

 

Easily the best player of the 2002 World Cup, but I guess Ronaldo's injury problems and comeback in a couple months to score 8 goals overshadows Rivaldos hard work during that World Cup.

 

But Messi is easily the 3rd best player I have ever seen. At his peak probably the best, but he still has some years to prove that he is a better player than what Zidane and Ronaldo were in my opinion as these guys did it for many many years.

[Village Idiot]

Rivaldo's stock is, imho, hurt by the fact we were never successful in Europe during his time with us, and possibly because of *that* dive, too.

 

[Ginola]

Ronaldinho was the ultimate flair player, like. Watching Messi play is brilliant, but in a different way to how it was watching Ronaldinho play.

[Village Idiot]

Ronaldinho was the ultimate flair player, like. Watching Messi play is brilliant, but in a different way to how it was watching Ronaldinho play.

 

Aye, that's what I was sort of getting at. I can only dream of what would have happened had Ronaldinho kept his head screwed on. One of the most salient things of Ronaldinho's game is that he wasn't a smart player *at all*, he always tried to play his way out of trouble and constantly ran into blind alleys, but was so ridiculously talented that he'd get away with it time after time and leave me with my jaw on the floor. In his peak he was also a great athlete, which people don't seem to remember.

[Flip]

Ronaldinho was the ultimate flair player, like. Watching Messi play is brilliant, but in a different way to how it was watching Ronaldinho play.

 

Aye, that's what I was sort of getting at. I can only dream of what would have happened had Ronaldinho kept his head screwed on. One of the most salient things of Ronaldinho's game is that he wasn't a smart player *at all*, he always tried to play his way out of trouble and constantly ran into blind alleys, but was so ridiculously talented that he'd get away with it time after time and leave me with my jaw on the floor. In his peak he was also a great athlete, which people don't seem to remember.

 

Biggest reason he didn't succeed later in his career was because he lost his athletic ability of running and moving at a high speed. But I'm not sure what you mean by a not a smart player. You have most probably a better opinion on this, but I always felt he was a smart player as he knew exactly how to get out of impossible situation. But like you said maybe he got into them because he wasn't that smart, I always got the impression it was because he had 30 players man marking him though.

 

Watching him was like eating candy though, fucking enjoyable as hell. People tend to forget though that even without his athleticism he was still the involved in almost 50% of Milans goals last season, even if he was nowhere near the same player he once was.

 

He always had problems with partying and so on, it's a shame, but that's the Brazilian players today, they win everything once and they're happy with that. Ronaldinho and Adriano are two wasted talents, finishing prior to their prime. I think Ronaldinho and Adriano all had so much more to contribute with.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

HTT

 

Ronaldo adapted a lot, he changed his game which was based on movement and speed to a more inside the box type of player. The thing with the body has all to do with injuries and he was most referring to the fact that his body wouldn't respond to certain movements without feeling pain and so on. Nothing to do with adapting, he couldn't adapt anymore. I'm not questioning Shearers adaptation, like you said he adapted more and in a more extreme matter, but Ronaldo still had to adapt and adapted from a successful type of player to another successful player. You won't find many players 'big' as he was still scoring goals and taking on defenders.

 

I don't doubt he adapted his game to some degree but he in the main (and he admits this himself) still tried to play the same kind of game in his latter years as he did in his earlier years which given just how good he was, was painful watching at times. To see such a once hugely talented player try to play like he once did but falling short many a time wasn't good viewing. It does say a lot about his finishing skills mind the number of goals he continued to score, although he was helped in that way by playing in sides that were always contained several world-class stars, sides that were always competing at the very top for the best honours, be it domestically with Real and AC or internationally with Brazil. In the main part Shearer was surrounded by average players at both levels. Since signing for Newcastle, the only genuine world-class talent Shearer has played alongside (for me anyway) was Woodgate and Shay Given and to a lesser extent Michael Owen. The rest were either top-class or decidedly average to poor. Ronaldo was surrounded by the very best.

 

On the other hand, I don't agree at all with the fact that you say that Shearer was better centrally. I mean both were central forwards, both were strikers, two different types of strikers but both played as central-forwards. Shearer was no doubt a very physical player and unstoppable on his day, but so was Ronaldo and I would even say to a greater extent. Ronaldos prime was unstoppable he could take on 3-4 defenders something Shearer wouldn't do with the ball at his feet. Ronaldo was also a great facilitator in the sense he made smart runs and so on. But then again if you put Ronaldo in a long-ball tactic he wouldn't be as effective and the same for Shearer in a team where there was no balls to his head.

 

As a centre-forward playing centrally Shearer was for me the best because he dominated that area of the pitch. Ronaldo's best work came on the flanks or behind the opposition defence. A bit like Henry for Arsenal who struggled centrally despite starting the game in that position. Ronaldo could indeed take on and beat 3 or 4 defenders, but in his pomp Shearer could too, although using more physical strength and sheer determination than sheer skill or trickery as Ronaldo often used. You are correct though, they were two very different type of centre-forwards. Shearer's positioning was magnificent, the best I've seen, especially on crossing and his anticipation was something else too. Ronaldo's positioning for a centre-forward wasn't the best, especially on crosses. Ronaldo was best at attacking space and making space for himself via his pace, athleticism, skill and trickery and then making the most of things from that. He wasn't an off the ball type of forward, very much an on the ball one. Shearer was the opposite. Off the ball he was a huge threat. Ronaldo was more of a threat on the ball. For me when it comes to marking etc. it is easier to nullify someone on the ball than off it. That is why movement and positioning is probably more important to a player than say, the ability to pick a pass or hit the ball hard and accurately. Barcelona are all about positioning, running and movement. I watched them against Arsenal and I was just as impressed with them off the ball as I was with them on the ball. Shearer was a huge huge threat off the ball and that is why as a centre-forward and as an all-rounder, why for me is was better than Ronaldo who could be tamed and quite easily in his later years in terms of general play outside of scoring goals.

 

Kaka, you suggest he's never been a world best for you, which I find very weird since at his prime during two seasons in Milan before injuries he was unstoppable. That game at Old Trafford he was just immense, he was without a doubt the best player in the world at the time. He helped Milan to two Champions League finals. He is nowhere near the type of player Frank Lampard is, thats a utterly poor judgement.

 

He was a top performing player for his club in the same way Lampard was for Chelsea who outscored him and out assisted him yet didn't receive half the world-wide plaudits (probably because he's English and not foreign) as Kaka. Gerrard is or was the same, a top performing player for his club at the highest level but never a top echelon player ala Rivaldo, Ronaldo, CRonaldo, Ronaldinho, Figo, Zidane etc. (and Shearer). Paul Scholes was better than Kaka who I'm not doubting was for a short period a very very good player and performing as one of the best but he's no better than a Lampard or Gerrard for me. Top-class but certainly not world-class.

 

Kaka was a strong, fast player who was a playmaker in a sense very different to Lampard. Kaka would run with the ball, while Lampard is more of a player coming into positions from behind. Kaka was, just like Lampard, an exceptional player in his prime. He's only 28 but he's past it though for me, he's been unlucky with injuries. But you just have to look at the World Cup where he was very poor but still created a lot with a single touch and vision.

 

I wasn't comparing them as similar players, just similar records etc. in terms of goals, assists, how they performed for their respective clubs etc. I actually rate Lampard as the better player myself of the two but that's a different debate. Xavi is twice the player kaka is by the way, even back when Kaka was winning world player of the year awards.

[Tooj]

He wasn't an off the ball type of forward, very much an on the ball one.

 

Ronaldo's positioning for a centre-forward wasn't the best

 

I'm sorry, but I had to stop taking you seriously after those two comments.

 

Ronaldo's positioning was absolutely amazing, especially in the latter years of his career. The same applies to his off the ball movement, he was far from static, and the way he timed his runs was one of his (many) great attributes.

 

He wasn't the best from crosses, as that wasn't his game, but when he was at Barcelona, he still managed to score a couple of headers.

[Tooj]

Ronaldinho was the ultimate flair player, like. Watching Messi play is brilliant, but in a different way to how it was watching Ronaldinho play.

 

Aye, that's what I was sort of getting at. I can only dream of what would have happened had Ronaldinho kept his head screwed on. One of the most salient things of Ronaldinho's game is that he wasn't a smart player *at all*, he always tried to play his way out of trouble and constantly ran into blind alleys, but was so ridiculously talented that he'd get away with it time after time and leave me with my jaw on the floor. In his peak he was also a great athlete, which people don't seem to remember.

 

Aye, that goal he scored (I think it was against Sevilla) in his first season at Barca testifies that.

 

Pre-2006 he was a physical monster, then after that he became far too static and just seemed to hang around the left playing people in or doing a trick (which he was brilliant at, of course), but he wasn't the same as when he used to run at people.

[Mr. Snrub]

I don't think I'll ever enjoy watching another player as much as I did Ronaldinho.

 

Shame them Brazilians love to party a bit too much, he should still be out there setting the world alight. 

[Raconteur]

Ronaldinho was the ultimate flair player, like. Watching Messi play is brilliant, but in a different way to how it was watching Ronaldinho play.

 

Aye, that's what I was sort of getting at. I can only dream of what would have happened had Ronaldinho kept his head screwed on. One of the most salient things of Ronaldinho's game is that he wasn't a smart player *at all*, he always tried to play his way out of trouble and constantly ran into blind alleys, but was so ridiculously talented that he'd get away with it time after time and leave me with my jaw on the floor. In his peak he was also a great athlete, which people don't seem to remember.

 

Watching Ronaldinho reminded of everything I've read about Garrincha - a supremely talented footballer who played for the buzz of beating his man, sitting his opponent on his arse.

 

Similarly, both could have been regarded as the greatest ever if they had even a fraction of the dedication and discipline of other lesser-talented but ultimately more successful players...

 

Watching Messi dance through defences is the most beautiful sight in football today, but it doesn't provide that certain... childlike joy that the Dinho or (vids of) the Angel with bent legs did

[PCW1983]

Not sure if i can post the videos however all this link has a link to videos of Ronaldo's goals for PSV and Barcelona.

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog/2011/feb/17/classic-youtube-cricket-ronaldo-schadenfreude

[Guest CR07]

Ronaldo (CR07)  :smitten: :smitten: :smitten: :smitten: :smitten:

[M4]

Ronaldo (CR07)

 

Huh?

[Guest CR07]

Ronaldo (CR07)

 

Huh?

 

I saw someone mentioning Him in some of the posts and I thought I'd show what I think of Him.

[alpal78]

Of all the players mentioned in this thread, I enjoyed watching Zidane the most. His ball control was on a different level, so good that he could play in slow mo and still get away from 3-4 defenders. He didnt need pace at all. Watching Zidane was like watching an orchestra in slow motion.

[LooneyToonArmy]

From January when he was still a player.

 

http://globoesporte.globo.com/platb/files/985/2011/01/ronaldo1.jpg

[Yorkie]

His goalscoring record still being better than 1 in 2 at that point.

 

Ronaldo: "so fuck "

[Tooj]

Classic HTT in this thread like.

[Tooj]

Is he still playing against Romania this week?

[Flip]

Yes sir, going to play the last 15 or so of the first half if he doesn't get injured before.

[Gash]

From January when he was still a player.

 

http://globoesporte.globo.com/platb/files/985/2011/01/ronaldo1.jpg

He looks like Tracey Morgan when he's always lifting his shirt!

http://www.thecelebrityblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/Tracy-Morgan-Crazy.jpg

[Tooj]

Yes sir, going to play the last 15 or so of the first half if he doesn't get injured before.

 

 

[Tooj]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2011/jun/08/ronaldo-emotional-farewell-brazil-romania

 

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/SPORT/Pix/pictures/2011/6/8/1307527764224/Ronaldo-007.jpg

 

Ronaldo's career with Brazil's national team has come to an emotional end with a brief appearance in a friendly against Romania. He came on in the 30th minute and played until half-time, when there was a ceremony to mark his 18-year career.

 

The 34-year-old retired in February having represented Brazil in four World Cups – picking up two winner's medals of them – and remains the competition's all-time leading scorer with 15 goals.

 

He could not mark his farewell appearance with a goal but one of his successors in the national side, Fred, sealed the 1-0 win in Sao Paolo.

 

Ronaldo had a couple of opportunities but could not match Fred's precision, after the latter scored in the 21st minute.

 

He told the crowd: "I had chances to score. Sorry for not finishing them correctly. Thanks to all of you for what you did in my career. When I cried, you cried with me. When I smiled, you smiled with me. See you soon, but on the sidelines this time. I'm very proud of being Brazilian."

 

[Kaizero]

[ponsaelius]

Legend.