Hatem Ben Arfa

[Ronaldo]

Not sure what he does wrong as a centre forward. It seems to me some can't differentiate between wanting Ba to play wide left and the idea of someone playing wide left and him moving central.

 

I really like Cisse and am under no illusion he has,lost it but Ba is clearly our best centre forward at this time so some's wanting to drop/sell him is absolutely baffling

 

We can't built a team around Ba.

[Cajun]

Would we have dropped Colo when we thought (and let's face it, we all did) he was never going to sign that contract? No, because you don't shift your best players.

[Guest bimpy474]

Would we have dropped Colo when we thought (and let's face it, we all did) he was never going to sign that contract? No, because you don't shift your best players.

 

Because Colo didn't sulk and have his people talking to papers ?

[Ronaldo]

The contract's only part of the issue.

[Cajun]

Colo had nothing to whinge about. If we moved him to right back for half a season I'm not sure he would be so keen to sign a nee contract.

[Guest bimpy474]

Colo had nothing to whinge about. If we moved him to right back for half a season I'm not sure he would be so keen to sign a nee contract.

 

Fair comment that .

 

I still bang on about rotating position in the front three, and not being left centre right, just freed up movement. Mind you you need a expansive forward thinking coach for that to work.

[Cajun]

Agree with the fluent movement thing (love you Bimpy).

[Guest bimpy474]

Oi 

[Ronaldo]

For the record I've said before that Ba's the best all round striker we've had since 96-97 Shearer. I just don't think he's the right man to build the attack around for various reasons.

[Mole_Toonfan]

Agree with the fluent movement thing (love you Bimpy).

 

This is the biggest problem for me.... when Ba and Cisse play in a front 3  irrelevant who the central figure is the movement, link up and interchanging with those around them and just overall understanding of the role is a million times better.

 

Against Wigan i felt we saw Ba and Cisse's best performance of the season in regards to off the ball movement, linking up and roaming and interchanging with those around them.

 

For example who was the one who roamed to a deep position to play Marveaux in who in turn played Bigi in for his goal? Ba.

 

I know Cisse didn't score but i felt his movement and link up play and understanding of the role he played just like Ba whether he played on the right or the centre was great too.

 

When doing this other players come into the equation too just like Bigi did so we are not as predictable and we are more threatening from different angles.

 

This doesn't happen when the two of them play as a front 2 as they are both making similar runs and seem to have the understanding and off the ball movement of a couple of Heskeys.

 

But as a front 3 whether Ba plays out wide or Cisse  plays out wide there seems to be a better understanding of roles, movement seems to be better, link up seems to be better and obviously the team improves as a result.

 

Hoping we similar to what we saw against Wigan with regards to movement, link up play and understanding of roles but with Ben Arfa thrown into the mix.

 

 

 

[alexf]

Agree with all of that. The 4-3-3,4-2-3-1 etc whatever you want to call it suits the players we have right now and if Pardew reverts back to 442 with ba-cisse on monday then i am finally done backing him.

[Revolution]

Agree with Ronaldo. Ba is a superb footballer but I'd choose Cisse if I had to build the team around one.

[Wullie]

The most frustrating thing re: Ba is that when he arrived he was touted as someone who could and would play wide left, he'd played there fairly regularly in his career by all accounts, including for West Ham. It seemed simply that he took a bit of a huff during that barren run when Cisse was getting all the plaudits and all the goals that he'd previously been getting and just took an attitude of "never again".

[Tiresias]

Ba is fantastic but we don't have the width to build the team around him. In the end the player we want to build the team around has to be Ben Arfa and Cisse makes more sense to play with him.

 

Having said all that, would be horrible to lose Ba, absolutely wonderful player, and one of the best at redirecting balls coming from any angle into the net. The opening goal vs Man U at home last season can not get enough love, yes route one but just how well he places it 

[ponsaelius]

The most frustrating thing re: Ba is that when he arrived he was touted as someone who could and would play wide left, he'd played there fairly regularly in his career by all accounts, including for West Ham. It seemed simply that he took a bit of a huff during that barren run when Cisse was getting all the plaudits and all the goals that he'd previously been getting and just took an attitude of "never again".

 

Yep. Played there when Hoffenheim had their excellent debut season IIRC.

[Mick]

Ba is fantastic but we don't have the width to build the team around him. In the end the player we want to build the team around has to be Ben Arfa and Cisse makes more sense to play with him.

 

Having said all that, would be horrible to lose Ba, absolutely wonderful player, and one of the best at redirecting balls coming from any angle into the net. The opening goal vs Man U at home last season can not get enough love, yes route one but just how well he places it 

 

We should be looking to build a team around our 3 forwards instead of our back 5.  Ba is class and it's amazing how people are so quick to accept that we might lose him, not just this coming window but also the last.

[Tiresias]

I think a front 3 of Ben arfa on right Cisse in middle and Ba on left is fine, and I'd like them to fluidly switch round for the record. It bothers me that Ba sees fit to complain about this though. I don;t disagree that it may be ideal to build the team around them, but I am unconvinved that Ba and Cisse can work together as presently set up, and the 3 at front isn't sure to work, didn't work for Ba at least.

 

I wouldn't sell Ba for 3 times the release clause if given the option mind

[Mick]

I think a front 3 of Ben arfa on right Cisse in middle and Ba on left is fine, and I'd like them to fluidly switch round for the record. It bothers me that Ba sees fit to complain about this though. I don;t disagree that it may be ideal to build the team around them, but I am unconvinved that Ba and Cisse can work together as presently set up, and the 3 at front isn't sure to work, didn't work for Ba at least.

 

I wouldn't sell Ba for 3 times the release clause if given the option mind

 

I was quite happy with his performances on the left of a front 3 and just think he was unlucky.  He was still getting shots off on goal and they just weren't coming off for him.

[Tiresias]

I certainly want to go back and try that again, I remember he did seem to be on a run of bad luck there I agree

[AlanSkÃrare]

Agree with all of that. The 4-3-3,4-2-3-1 etc whatever you want to call it suits the players we have right now and if Pardew reverts back to 442 with ba-cisse on monday then i am finally done backing him.

 

This. It would signal his lack of understanding and irreversable philosophy of hoofball. I'm done with him if it does happen.

 

Big issue, long term, is dropping Ba or Cisse.

[Cajun]

Dropping Ba or Cisse is a no brainer at the moment (and I do rate Cisse) Ba seems to be suffering from the fact he was willing to play half a season out wide.

 

Cisse put just as good a performance outwide against Wigan as Ba ever did last season, not sure why the option is Ba playing wide or fuck off, especially as them playing central with 'no service' has resulted in Ba scoring 10 and Cisse scoring one with another being kicked off him.

[joeyt]

If you ever get down about NUFC and particularly how we're playing at the time, think about Ben Arfa. What a talent. Plays for us.

 

Aye but for how much longer

[Mole_Toonfan]

Dropping Ba or Cisse is a no brainer at the moment (and I do rate Cisse) Ba seems to be suffering from the fact he was willing to play half a season out wide.

 

Cisse put just as good a performance outwide against Wigan as Ba ever did last season, not sure why the option is Ba playing wide or f*** off, especially as them playing central with 'no service' has resulted in Ba scoring 10 and Cisse scoring one with another being kicked off him.

 

Honestly if Wigan is any indication i'm not bothered anymore if Cisse can show a similar performance in regards to movement and things i mentioned before then i don't see the problem.

 

Static movement is the issue but if both of them are roaming and linking up with those around them i don't see the issue.

[Guest bimpy474]

Dropping Ba or Cisse is a no brainer at the moment (and I do rate Cisse) Ba seems to be suffering from the fact he was willing to play half a season out wide.

 

Cisse put just as good a performance outwide against Wigan as Ba ever did last season, not sure why the option is Ba playing wide or f*** off, especially as them playing central with 'no service' has resulted in Ba scoring 10 and Cisse scoring one with another being kicked off him.

 

Honestly if Wigan is any indication i'm not bothered anymore if Cisse can show a similar performance in regards to movement and things i mentioned before then i don't see the problem.

 

Static movement is the issue but if both of them are roaming and linking up with those around them i don't see the issue.

 

 

This goes for the midfield and overlapping full backs too. And its the reason we are so poor when we play 4-4-2. Man Utd sometimes line up 4-4-2 but have movement galore because they aren't static.

 

I dont like and never have liked 4-4-2, Pardew's way of playing it is exactly why, as a kid thats how you were taught, shape shape shape, wingers staying wide, full backs not pushing up too high. It was so rigid. Now that was some managers yet i remember playing for a manager who would start 4-4-2 and the only two players who weren't given freedom to move were the centre backs. We scored a lot but let a few in too, i know you cant really compare a Saturday amateur game with pro football but the point is still there.

 

Pardew seems to lack the guile and imagination to give players that freedom, even in a 4-3-3 but at least we look better and its suits our player so much better.

[Guest Spiria]

Pardew hopeful over Ben Arfa return.

 

Hatem Ben Arfa has missed Newcastle's last four matches through injury Hatem Ben Arfa has missed Newcastle's last four matches through injury

 

Alan Pardew hopes the impending return of the mercurial Hatem Ben Arfa can spark Newcastle into life.

 

The 25-year-old France international, one of the few Magpies to shine on a regular basis during a difficult start to the campaign, has missed the last four games with a hamstring injury. His pace and invention proved potent weapons during the early weeks of the season, and when he joined compatriot Yohan Cabaye on the sidelines Newcastle were robbed of much of their spark.

 

Ben Arfa could be one of several big names to return to the side at Fulham on Monday night, and that would represent a significant boost for Pardew. "If he is fit enough to play, it would be important because he's a good player - a great player," Pardew said.

 

"If there was one defender to beat and I had to choose a player too take him on beat him, it would be Hatem. That's his real strength."

 

Ben Arfa was already on the books at St James' Park when Pardew arrived two years ago having been signed on a season-long loan deal from Marseille by predecessor Chris Hughton.

 

However, he was at home in France recovering from an horrific double leg fracture suffered in just his fourth appearance at Manchester City on October 3, 2010.

 

Pardew pushed through a permanent deal during the following January despite the midfielder being months away from a return and having seen him only second-hand, with his performance and winning goal at Everton a particular highlight of the manager's research.

 

Asked what had prompted his decision, he said: "It was the tape of the Everton game and the goal. The little history I did about him in France was enough to convince me that he had massive talent.

 

"It was just a question of whether I could work with him and get into his head, and I felt I could do that with the experience I'd had of Yossi Benayoun, Carlos Tevez, Javier Mascherano, Teddy Sheringham, and fortunately it seems to have worked out."

 

Pardew will hope to have not only Ben Arfa but also Davide Santon, Cheick Tiote, Jonas Gutierrez, Gabriel Obertan and Demba Ba back in harness at Craven Cottage as the Magpies attempt to build on last Monday's 3-0 home victory over Wigan.